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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

BBC3 programme; wake up call

240 replies

PerfectlyPosed · 26/06/2014 16:47

I'm sure there have been numerous threads about 'Murdered by my boyfriend' which was on Monday evening. I have watched it twice, once with my DP of 6 years and once with my two best friends.

The scene in it that made me really sit up and re-evaluate my relationship was at the end when it all came to a head and he, eventually, beat her to death. He got home very drunk and climbed onto the bed with her as she pretended to sleep. Then when she wouldn't wake up he started being a bit more aggressive and pushing her until eventually she snapped in his face.

This is exactly what my DP does to me. He comes in from a drunken night out telling me he loves me and I am his world, etc. etc. Then gradually gets more and more irritating (purposely stealing the covers or knowingly sitting too close, etc.) until I am forced to retaliate. He has never hit me and I really don't think he would but it really frightened me to see the similarities. I even said, when I was watching last night with friends, "this is exactly the way DP behaves" and they were shocked. I have recently found out I am pregnant.

I don't know why I've posted really, just to get it off my chest I suppose. In many ways, he is incredible and I am so happy that we are having a baby together but that programme really frightened me. The guy on there was charming and treated her like a princess at the beginning but flipped when he became paranoid about her behaviour. DP has never been possessive and we very much have our own lives but he does like a drink and can sometimes often get quite aggressive with it although I must reiterate never violent.

OP posts:
GarlicJunoWho · 27/06/2014 13:37

He doesn't know any better and that's very sad but I know it's not my responsibility to change him.

YY. Please keep this in your head, Perfectly, and act upon it sooner rather than later.

It would be a terrible pity if, after learning about all this, you decided to test the theory by hanging in there until after your baby's birth. By that point, you'll be at your most vulnerable and will have suffered nearly a year's more 'training' into his learned relationship style.

Keep posting, eh? :)

PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 13:45

I'm tempted to show a couple of RL friends this thread and see what their view is. None of them can offer the wisdom that you have but they can look at it from the perspective of knowing us and understanding what I can handle.

OP posts:
GarlicJunoWho · 27/06/2014 13:57

Not a bad idea :)

But DON'T show it to him!

PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 13:59

He couldn't read it even if he wanted to! I meant what I said about him not being clever enough earlier...

OP posts:
GarlicJunoWho · 27/06/2014 13:59
Shock
PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 14:00

That came out wrong. He can read but is very dyslexic. A thread like this would drive him crazy.

OP posts:
weatherall · 27/06/2014 14:09

Every abuse victim has said 'I'm not ready to give up on him yet'.

I did.

I wish I was more of a quitter, I wouldn't have the scars I have now.

PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 14:14

I honestly think that, even if I was ready to leave, he wouldn't let me go. He doesn't see that there is a problem. He thinks he has massively changed since we broke up before and thinks that he puts more effort into the relationship than ever. I sometimes tell him I disagree but he still stands by it.

I need to know that if I do choose to leave that I can be strong enough to not go back. And this time there is so much more at stake, we could never fully be apart like we were last time.

OP posts:
PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 14:26

I just remembered that last time I threatened to leave him (about 6 months ago) my friends vowed to never offer advice again as they feel like it is falling deaf ears. They feel like they are telling me to end it with him and I am ignoring them and laughing behind their backs (I'm not, I take it very seriously but it's not as simple as that). Anyway, we did have a bit of a row because I asked if they've ever been given advice that they haven't taken and thought it was unfair of them to effectively wash their hands of me when I'm supposed to be their friend.

So it would seem that I am probably on my own this time. I'm sure once I've actually left, they will be there for me but they won't be there to offer me any advice as they will think it's a waste of time.

OP posts:
unrealhousewife · 27/06/2014 14:27

I know exactly what you mean about coming on here and being overwhelmed at the response. I've been there. You have both the Cagney and the Lacey (Garlic and AF)of the relationships threads on here (I'm more of a Charlie's Angel), plus several more experienced people than me who really do understand this. It is very weird to have your perceptions altered like this.

But it's not really sinister, it's not quite like Sleeping With the Enemy. It's more like Dysfunctional bloke meets nice girl. But you probably won't ever look at him the same way again, you have started the journey of understanding it. You can then make an informed choice and you have the relationship cops ready by your side. Wink

And he WILL expect you to be like his mother.

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 27/06/2014 14:31

You don't need him to let you go. You can make the decision for yourself. I'm not surprised to hear that your friends have advised you to endnt either, but they will be there to support you if ty are good friends. Don't keep his behaviour a secret because you are afraid of their reactions.

AnyFucker · 27/06/2014 14:39

If anybody is ever in a relationship with a person who "won't let them go" then they need to go and no more questions asked

OP, remember in the BBC3 programme ? That bloke "wouldn't let her go" until he had full control of her. In the end, he gained the ultimate in control didn't he. Every time she stayed, every time she went back she lost a little more of her spirit until in the end she gave up.

Your boyfriends mother also gave up a long time ago and decided to accept a lesser kind of life. Is this what you want for yourself ?

CurtWild · 27/06/2014 14:49

Just saying he wouldn't let you go is in itself worrying. My stbxh said things like 'you'll never leave me' 'I can't let you go' and even now, almost 6 months post separation, he hasn't 'let me go' (you can read about that in more detail on the Support Thread for emotional abusive relationships..I'm all over it!)

He will see you as his property. Mine did and still does. Waking you up because if he's awake you should be. Imagine that when your heavily pregnant and exhausted. Imagine that when you're knackered from settling a young baby who's only just gone off..and he wakes you both.

You are not his property. NO ONE can stop you from leaving if that's what you want.

unrealhousewife · 27/06/2014 14:57

X post again -

Friends - probably feel out of their depth. They have done what they could but don't want to lose you as a friend. It's hard for them to see you like this.

He wants you to believe he has changed - that's because he knows he can't. His only option is to convince you. You're right that he can't help it, but it doesn't mean it's your fault.

Of course he won't let you go - he has put so much energy into getting you to stay.

You can resist going back to him with support from here and counselling. But once you have really let go of him, wish him all the best even, but said goodbye properly you probably won't want to.

One last point - your child. His child too. Gather all the information you can about his abusive nature, the alcoholism as he may use your child to get you back, it's what they do. You will need legal advice once you have some evidence. Diary entries will do, threads on here.

Leaving asap is important because there's more chance that he won't be attached to the baby, will not want anything to do with her even. That's going to be a lot better than the alternative.

I would give him an explanation (others might advise against), maybe something to do with the drink, once you are safely out of his way. That way he can't blame you, there's no way he can turn that back on you, even if he gives up you can say you can't risk it.

PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 15:06

I don't mean won't let me go in the sense that he will barricade the door. I mean that he will beg and plead and try and convince me that he's changed until I'm worn down. Then things will be wonderful maybe for a few weeks but gradually, it will go back to the way it was before.

I need to think hard about this all. Thank you so much for all your advice, you really don't know how much it means. Even if, at this time, I do decide to stay, it's not because of anything you've said, it's because I'm simply not ready and not strong enough to be my myself yet.

OP posts:
CurtWild · 27/06/2014 15:14

Stbxh is using contact with our DC as leverage to get me back. Visits have to be in my home or he won't see them, that kind of thing. He was barely interested in them whilst we lived together..now they've become a valuable assett for his darker agenda. Abusive men don't like it when their wife escapes (that can be interchanged with women/husbands obviously).

I get that you wabt to down play his behaviour, I did it for a long time. Made excuses. Attempted to rationalise. Minimalised hos actions/my feelings. Family and friends 'gave up trying' to get through to me. Finally I couldn't excuse his behaviour anymore, and most importantly I couldn't let my DC grow up thinking it was ok. I'm a single mum of 3 under fours and yes, it's hard work, but by god it's worth every minute.

AnyFucker · 27/06/2014 15:17

This "not strong enough to leave" thing puzzles me

To my mind, you have to be "strong" to live like this. To live with uncertainty and fear for the future. Knowing within yourself that you are making a mistake and shoring yourself up for future self recrimination and regret.

I wish women in situations like this were more able to reprogramme their mindset and accept that a life without this shit is easier

CurtWild · 27/06/2014 15:26

Life without this shit is far easier.

Being a mum to tiny people is hard work anyway, single or not, but believe me it's far harder when you live with an abusive partner. Once they're (almost) out of the equation, even the hardest day will be a doddle in comparison.

Good luck, perfectly, congratulations on your pregnancy and all the best for a happy future x

PerfectlyPosed · 27/06/2014 15:28

I suppose not strong enough = not prepared to be by myself. I like having someone there when I get home from work, even if it is just Monday to Friday. I don't enjoy my own company, I get bored easily and even if he sits watching football and I'm reading my book or playing on my phone, there's still someone there.

I will get over that but I need time. I need to read up on everything so I have a strong case when he asks me why I have made this decision. Saying I don't like his behaviour when he's drunk is not enough.

OP posts:
CurtWild · 27/06/2014 15:42

I think it's safe to say most of us like having someone to come home to/company! I certainly didn't want to become a single parent.

But I put my safety and that of my DC above getting a bit bored of my own company. And if that's a reason to stay in a potentially dangerous situation, I have to say I'm a bit gobsmacked.

Anyway. Still wishing you a safe and happy future x

OxfordBags · 27/06/2014 15:42

AF is right - you do have to be strong to deal with this. Unfortunately, it's a damaged, misguided form of strength. You are using all your strength to endure, endure, endure, and to deny, minimise and delude yourself. The effort and strength required is massive. The amount you need to start believing that you are worth better - that you are worth something at all - and should leave is actually much, much less, but the mental leap is harder due to the nature of abuse.

I have some other points you've brought up, OP, that I think need addressing:

You can leave for any reason. You can leave for no reason. The idea of having to have a big enough reason is bullshit, and can and will only lead to more abuse and damage, except to your child in the future, as well as you. Has it lead to less abuse so far? Of course not.

You wondered about the wisdom or fairness of leaving him if he never gets any worse in the future . My love, even if he stays at this level for ever, and never worsens, it is already a far too abusive and toxic relationship to be in. More importantly, even if he stays at this level, it is already a hideous one to bring a child into. Merely staying at the level he is will cause mental and emotional damage to your child. Your partner abuses you because of his damaged childhood - surely you can see that a damaged childhood for your own child will just continue the cycle, an abuser for a son or a victim for a daughter? You stay with him and you have to accept that you are choosing to have your child emotionally scarred for life.

The very fact that he would not you go means that this is a relationship you must not be in. Barricading the door is incredibly serious and a massive red flag. In fact, there are certain red flags that indicate sn abuser who is more likely to seriously injure or kill, and barricading someone in is one of them.

The begging and pleading then being wonderful for a few weeks until it goes to shit again are all part of the classic cycle of abuse. Your life with him will always be this way.

What if he gets drunk and decides he wants to kiss your sleeping baby? What if he digs his fingers in or twists their head to achieve it? That could kill them.

Why are you going on about trying to talk to him? It sounds like all you do is try to talk to him, try to get him to understand you and your pain, etc. the fact is, he doesn't care. You don't exist as a real person for him, he is only nice to you when it serves and pleases him. If he cared about your needs or feelings, he wouldn't abuse you in the first place. He keeps telling you he won't talk, isn't interested, won't listen, and the problems and blame are all yours. You have talked far too much, not enough. Every time you talk and he shuts you down and you stay and tolerate him and his shit, you actually do communicate very well then - unfortunately, what you're telling him repeatedly is that you'll put up with his abuse, no matter what he does. It doesn't matter what you say, because your actions tell him that you'll be his victim. Why should he listen to actual words when you've already told him what he wants to hear?

AnyFucker · 27/06/2014 15:43

It's plenty enough. The fact he doesn't think it is enough is not a consideration.

Lweji · 27/06/2014 15:50

Do you realise that you don't need his permission to end the relationship, or even explain to him?
You need to explain to you and only you.

Lweji · 27/06/2014 15:50

And there is a saying in my country "it's better to be alone than in bad company".

andsmile · 27/06/2014 16:11

I feel quite frustrated for you, you need to leave when you are ready I suppose..but what about your baby?