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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Pretty desperate (v.v.v.long)

205 replies

JustDontWantToSay · 24/06/2014 00:06

It's taken me weeks and weeks to pluck up the courage to post here. I am doing this out of utter desperation. I've hesitated because my DP would be so furious if he found out - the fury I could cope with but he would mock me too, i.e. "oh you think you're hard done by after what you've done," etc., etc. and I find that the most cutting thing of all.

Sorry - I think this may be quite a long post.

Basically I'm not sure whether I'm in an abusive relationship or not. Or whether I'm the problem. Please, please be honest if you reply - I need to know whether I'm going mad or not.

We've been together 2 years. I don't really want to describe the incidents to date because it will out me, but I don't see an alternative if I want valid opinions. I'm a strong character, he's a strong character. We had a complicated start but we knew that we wanted to be together and we worked hard to do that. It was very stressful for lots of different reasons, we really didn't have the best start.

Around 3m into the relationship he lost his temper after a party one night, threw me against a wall and onto a bed, gripped me so hard I bruised and threw me out of the front door of a hotel room into the snow wearing nothing but my knickers. I was only out there for a few seconds though and then he opened the door again. We were both drunk and tension was high. He was mortified the next morning and swore that he'd never do it again. A few weeks later we had an argument in a hotel and he smashed a wineglass in his hand. I left.

Over the next few months we had dramatic highs and lows. The highs were the best days of my life and the lows were the worst. We had a couple of big arguments where he got slightly violent (smashing things, pushing me up against a fireplace and he held a glass against my neck threatening to smash it into me - though this is something he completely denies. Maybe I imagined it. I'm not sure. It was a vivid memory at the time.) In his defence I have to say that I would have been antagonising him by arguing with him. At that point I wasn't one to shy away from a disagreement. His point throughout the relationship has been "you don't know when to stop". His jealousy was getting out of control too. He once marched me home from a bar, physically manhandling me. I didn't want to go elsewhere, but he made it clear that I was within his physical control. On another occasion we were in a restaurant and there must have been something going on; all I remember is him saying "I've seen you look at that table of blokes once, I've seen you look twice, now you do it a third time" - very threateningly. I just stared down at my hands as it was safest after that.

A short while later we split up. Before that, we had some vicious fights (always drink-related, Saturday night, emotions boiling over sort of thing) and I called the police twice, probably unnecessarily and he holds it against me to this day, calling me 'mad', 'attention seeking', etc.

Three times we had a 'last night' together because he was going to end it with me. After the split I was diagnosed with severe depression. Medication helped. We got back together and all was fine until Christmas. We had an argument one night and he locked me out of his house (I had no key, live two hours away) and I stayed in the pub and became aware that there was a table of three blokes next to me and they were talking about something that interested me. To my huge embarrassment now I was so drunk that I went over, joined their table and their conversation for a bit. I can honestly say that by this point I was absolutely desperate for non-judgmental company. Desperate. I would never have gone on to do anything else under any circumstances. Over Xmas I think what happened was that he got annoyed that I was having fun at my parents' without him (he had his own plans) and on Boxing Day I was late to see him (maybe an hour, maybe a bit less, because I was packing) and we had an enormous fight in a car park where he literally screamed at me for an hour or more in public about this pub incident that he had got to hear of. Again, I didn't help matters by trying to slap his face once with a bunch of keys in my hand. To this day he accuses me of punching him with a bunch of keys, and whilst they were in my hand I genuinely didn't intend them to touch him. It was a fraught situation and I made a mistake.

There have been a few incidents since then, too many to recall exactly, but one saw me going to the pub to use the wi-fi to submit some work and because he'd been out all afternoon (I was unreasonably annoyed) I decided to stay there. In retrospect I was crying out for attention and care. Again, I joined a table of people (male and female) and stayed there for a couple of drinks. Not having eaten and drunk far too much I ended up absolutely wasted, left my ipad behind the bar in lieu of paying because I couldn't find my card and stumbled back to his house. His view on the whole night had been "Well, fuck you, if you're out, I'm going out."
In the morning I told him where I'd been and he went ballistic. He threw me and my stuff out of his flat, I wasn't dressed and he made me get dressed in a communal stairwell. He literally threw my bags down the stairs. He said that I was completely disrespectful and selfish. We fought badly that day, but I had behaved appallingly by staying out and getting drunk. He thinks that a woman shouldn't be in a pub on her own.

On another occasion he got angry and threw my shoes out of the window into the road, meaning that I had to go out barefoot to the middle of a busy road and pick them up. The humiliation was horrible. A few weeks ago I drove to see him after a fight and found him in a bar, he was very drunk. He was absolutely horrible to me and threw me physically out his flat and took back the key he'd given me and I had to sleep in my car overnight. He apologised profusely the next day and was sincere in regretting it.

So now we get to this period of time and it's been a rollercoaster. In brief: he is extremely suspicious and jealous, he needs to know all my passwords, if I use my phone when he's not next to me he accuses me of being 'sneaky'. He regularly goes through my phone and computer, etc. and flies off the handle if he sees anything he doesn't like (old photos, etc.) If I use any form of social media he is instantly suspicious and disapproving. He says that I've caused it by lying to him. I do admit that I have lied - but it was only ever about stupid stuff (is that coat new? No, type thing) I know that doesn't justify it.

Over the last few weeks I have been diagnosed with anxiety and have new meds (they're working well). He has been making a big effort to drive to see me rather than the other way around and we've had some spectacular times. We were aiming to spend our lives together and whilst I was totally comfortable with that idea, he wasn't and the pressure was always on - if I put a foot wrong then I wouldn't be a suitable wife. He's always yelled insults at me, but recently he's got really nasty - he's called me a scumbag, a disgusting cunt, a fucking awful person, a complete fucking joke, basically run me into the ground. He says that he only says those things when I am behaving like a disgusting cunt or whatever (this isn't language I would normally use btw). He says that I don't know when to stop and that's why he gets so angry. This weekend I really wanted to go to a special, one-off event which we had planned to attend together, but it had been sold out but a last minute opportunity came up. I was all excited and began making plans to see if we could go and he got immediately cross at one of my ideas (he said that I was 'palming my child off on anyone who would have her' - I'd suggested her staying with someone as an IDEA, it wasn't fixed or a definite plan in any way and I wouldn't have done anything if it wasn't in her best interests.) He got aggressive, nasty, shouted some awful things and I walked out. He said he couldn't go to the event because he had nothing ti wear (specific dress needed) He was appalled at the thought I would go on my own for an hour or so - it was my last chance to see one friend before she moves abroad and a whole group of girls were going who I am friendly with. I really wanted to go,.He later admitted that he'd lied to me about not having clothes because I hadn't walked in immediately and asked him if he wanted to go. I assumed that his previous desire to attend still stood. I wasn't sure all day about going or not and eventually he said that he would rip up my dress to stop me going, and all of my other dresses, though he later said that he wouldn't actually have done it. So I missed the event. He blamed me hugely for 'fucking off and doing whatever I wanted' when I walked out because he was being so verbally abusive. He denies this, but every time I came back he went down the same path and I was trying to make a stand.

Last night was the final straw. Too boring to go into but basically his point was that I have no right to complain about anything he does because of what I've done (nothing not detailed here). He says that I am selfish on a level that he's never experienced before (hand on heart, I'm just a normal person), I'm rude on a daily basis (I'm not at ALL) and he cannot see any fault with himself in any way. He says that he has the right to throw me out of his home and call me names, though he admits it isn't nice. These are things that have been repeated hundreds of times, along with the names. He accuses me of being deliberately deceitful, manipulative, spiteful, that I have 'snidey eyes' and many other things. When I argue he shouts that I'll "say ANYTHING" to win a point (I don't) and he constantly accuses me of lying. He sneers at me, belittles me constantly and mocks me by repeating what I've said in a childish voice. This morning I began to tackle him very gently about his behaviour, knowing that I couldn't take any more, and he turned around and said that he felt he was in an abusive relationship, that I was an abusive person, that I lied and manipulated and controlled him, that I had damaged him completely, that I'd ripped him apart and left his self-esteem at rock bottom, that I was calculated and nasty and would stop at nothing to make sure that he was hurt. Nothing could be further from the truth but he just doesn't see it. He says that anger is the only emotion that I can't destroy so it's all he has to use. I promise that I am just a normal woman, going about my normal life and trying to be the best partner that I can to him. I don't do anything that he accuses me of but he just can't see it. He remains determined that I'm this awful person. He says that I 'suck the life out of him', that being with me is an awful thing. He has isolated me from friends and family but hating me going out with friends, disliking my friends, saying that it's disrespectful to see them. He doesn't believe that I haven't slept with some of them. I just cannot tell him anything. He makes his mind up and that's that. He judges me on things that I simply haven't done. He's called me a whore, a slut and many other things.

What he said this morning has floored me. Am I abusive?? How?? I try every which way to look after him - doing all his washing, cooking for him when I can, giving him drinks and vitamins, tidying his flat, doing little things that he likes and I curb my own tongue all the time so that we don't fight. Now I've reached the point where my self-esteem is so low that the only people who make me feel like a decent person are my daughters. I rely heavily on their smiles, hugs and pictures that they draw to make me feel ok. I am often frightened by him - I know he would physically overpower me if he wanted. I feel undervalued, worthless and not special in any way in the slightest. He says that this is exactly how he feels. The name-calling really upsets me for some reason. They're only words but they do upset me. My friends and family hate him because I've relayed some of his behaviour. He's cross about this and says that I painted him in a certain light and focussed on the bad bits rather than the good.

Flip side? I do love him, I understand he's damaged in some way and we do have some wonderful times. He's done a lot for me.

That's it I guess. Sorry it's so long. I'd be grateful for any feedback. Has anyone else been in this position? What should I do? I am totally isolated, no friends or family nearby. I have no-one to confide in.

PS. The alcohol usage is going to leap out at you. I'd just like to say that we don't drink heavily or every day and it isn't a problem. It just seems to have fuelled fights in the past - so we cut it out.

OP posts:
FatherJake · 25/06/2014 06:04

I am completely bemused. You write very defensively about how your children are not affected or aware by the situation. Even if that's the case now, it clearly won't be in the future. Are kids really going to be unaware that their mother is being abused in a relationship??

You have only been together 2 years. You aren't married. You don't have kids together. You don't live together and your lives are apparently very separate. You are being physically and mentally abused.

So given the above what in god's name are you doing in this absurd relationship and why aren't you immediately walking away?

Southpaws · 25/06/2014 06:11

Why are you sending lengthy responses to texts OP instead of just saying 'it's over, do not contact me again'. That's a genuine question btw. It sounds like on some level you won't be happy until he has admitted his flaws which he never will, so just let it go now.

YouAreMyFavouriteWasteOfTime · 25/06/2014 06:19

just sorry but he is throwing you crumbs and you are on your knees with gratitude.

you are not being objective and sadly I think you wont be changing anything soon. but I hope you do one day.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 25/06/2014 06:37

Stop engaging with him and leave him. You may think that you have your life nicely compartmentalised so that this doesn't have a negative effect on your kids but life doesn't work like that. You are in an unhealthy obsessive relationship which is effecting you in all aspects of your lives.

Just. Stop. Seeing. Him.

AnyFucker · 25/06/2014 06:45

He seems incapable of recognising his own behaviour.

I think that can equally apply to both of you

Get off the merry go round, OP.

Charley50 · 25/06/2014 06:52

I've just read your OP again and you have clearly laid out to yourself and us all the reasons how your P is a complete and utter abusive bastard and a dangerous man. Read it back to youself. He has you isolated and your self esteem is shattered. Your children must be suffering even if they don't see or hear the abuse because you are an emotional mess and on medication because of it.
Please end it without trying to understand it and get dome counselling or something straightaway. Be prepared to call police, get an injunction on him if he persists. Please. He is so awful it can only get worse. Why don't you start a new thread this morning 'I have ended my abusive relationship' and keep posting on that, as no doubt you will wobble. Once he is out of your life your friends and family will come back in. Don't be scared of what he will do when you end it, just be prepared to not let him into your home and to call police at the first sign of any hassle.

vicmackie · 25/06/2014 06:52

He seems incapable of recognising his own behaviour. Why is that??

WHO CARES?

It's IRRELEVANT. He's not a suitable person to have a relationship with. There's no puzzle here to be solved. Stop angsting over this tedious twat, walk away and get on with your life FFS.

FellReturneth · 25/06/2014 07:50

Let's face it, the pair of you are just a disastrous combination and it's time you both faced up to it. You both seem to have a streak of aggression and belligerence and an an addiction to drama, (and in his case that's the understatement of the century obviously) yet despite this you both continue to binge drink (your life seems to revolve around bars and pubs) knowing full well it is going to result in a violent bust up each time. Just ask yourself WHY you keep repeating this pattern? You are not responsible for what he does to you, but you are responsible for yourself, and for what happens if you repeatedly put yourself back in the same situation, knowing full well where it is likely to lead.

You are just not right for each other. You are very, very wrong for each other. You might both stand and a chance of being normal and happy with other people, (even him) but together it's just ever going to happen.

Putting the abuse aside for one second, (and the very obvious fact that one of these days he is going to knock you into the back of next week if he hasn't done so already) you are just badly matched. You are both going around in circles of blame, about who said/did what that was worse than the other person that week, both convinced that the other is the villain. Regardless of who is the villain, this is NEVER GOING TO CHANGE.

You have script for this relationship now, a pattern of behaviours has been set in stone. Don't waste your precious time and energy trying to change it.

So if you don't listen to us, and leave him immediately, what next? You both promise to change, you move him in with your children, a big effort is made on both sides, everything's fine for a six months and then one day you inadvertently say the wrong thing and the children are there…..

Don't do it. Just don't.

Lweji · 25/06/2014 07:56

I do think that anything more than a couple of sentences is too long.
While "we are done, don't contact me again" may be too short, four or five paragraphs is still too much and leaves a lot open for a come back.

Something more like
"This relationship is wrong for me, I am unhappy and I have decided to end it. Do not contact me again, as I will not change my mind and I will not discuss it."

Just keep in mind that he will blame you for everything and anything. His self esteem is probably too low to ever admit that he may be wrong at something and needs to feel superior to other people, particularly those closest to him. But this is irrelevant for you. Only he could change himself, and only if he recognised at any point that he needed to change. There is nothing you can do about it.
All you can do is work on yourself and recognise that you need to get out of this terrible dynamics. And protect your children from abuse.
At the moment, the two things are separate, but you could easily get pregnant, or eventually decide to move in together and they would certainly be affected by this.
Or if you get seriously hurt, or are killed, they will definitely be affected.
I feel that he has the potential to be very dangerous. He has already threatened you with a glass to your throat!

Even now, if he has keys, I would change the locks rather than ask for keys back. And would immediately call the police if he shows up outside and doesn't leave.
If he harasses you, by phone or by showing up, you could file for a restraining order. Keep safe.

Fingerbobs · 25/06/2014 08:02

Oh god this rings many many awful old bells for me. In my case, and I suspect in yours, in all other areas of your life you are what you seem to be - intelligent,competent, confident, kind, etc etc. No-one you know could believe that you'd be treated like this for a second. But this is about how much YOU love YOU, not how much you love him, or he loves you. It's about value, worth, self-esteem. Until you get the help you need - and I think you said you are getting counselling, if not please, please, please do - to understand why you think you deserve this awful hateful hurtful abusive controlling relationship, it will be hard to get away. And whilst I fully believe your daughters aren't exposed to violent abuse, they will be picking up on your lack of self- esteem. If you can't believe you deserve it for yourself, please think of them and what you are and could be modelling to them. There really is a life beyond this and you can have a relationship which has all the fire and passion and emotion you want, with a person who cares for you. It's not a choice between fireworks and dull safety. Good luck.

FellReturneth · 25/06/2014 08:07

OP are you prepared to tell us what you meant at the beginning of your first post, when you said you had a bad start and you had to work hard to be together?

mrsbrownsgirls · 25/06/2014 09:01

Was one of you married at the start?

my best friend stayed in a hideous relationship because when it began she was engaged to his best friend .

they limped on for years because it was such a big deal for them to get together in the first place that she felt she has to stay to prove to herself and others that all the initial heartache and disruption was worth it.

Please please get out today

YouMakeMeHappy · 25/06/2014 09:49

I know that you might not be ready to finish with him yet, it's perfectly understandable if you want to try again and see if you can make it better, as you obviously have strong feelings for each other. In my opinion this man is a bully, but that's something you will need to figure out for yourself.

I hope you don't feel unable to come back and post saying you have given him another chance or whatever. You don't have to do what people on a forum tell you, although I do think it's good advice! But please don't think that you can't post unless you are ready to dump him for good. It takes time to come around to that idea, and loads of women stay in the cycle of making up and breaking up for a while before ending it for good.

I don't think anyone will be angry at you if you haven't chucked him yet. I certainly won't. You are allowed to post for support and advice without promising to do what you are told! :)

So please come back and update if you feel it would help. Like I said you won't be the first person to think you can change someone, and it's fine if you still want to try. Personally i don't think it's relevant how you got together, and I wouldn't post details here if I were you.

KellyElly · 25/06/2014 09:56

He seems incapable of recognising his own behaviour. Why is that?? Maybe because you keep engaging, therefore giving him the attention he craves (and the drama it seems you do too), rather than just saying 'goodbye' and getting on with your life away from this emotional rollercoaster of a relationship.

hellsbellsmelons · 25/06/2014 10:01

Stop continuing the drama.
Yes he is majorly abusive.
Physically, mentally, emotionally and anything else you can think of.
End it.
Stop contact and let it be now.
I would imagine your anxiety and depression have escalated whilst being in this 'relationship'.
Get out, get yourself better and concentrate on YOU for a while.

Very glad you are getting counselling but please sign up with the 'Freedom Programme'. The fact you even to ask if this is abuse is unbelievable.

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 25/06/2014 10:04

He is abusive.
You both have a drink problem.
You are immature.
You are not being a good, protective parent.
You need to cut ALL contact with this foul man.
End of story.

FellReturneth · 25/06/2014 10:07

mrsbrown I was thinking exactly the same thing. To break up would have too many people saying 'I hope you're happy - all that fuss for it to come to this.'

Deverethemuzzler · 25/06/2014 10:07

I read some of the OP.
I could read the whole thing but its all much of the same isn't it?

justdont this is not a Love and Rockets, Intensely Romantic, Love/Hate, Dramatic Relationship.
Its a fucking car crash and you don't need to keep getting back in the car.

Enough already.

There are people on here who can tell you exactly what you need to do to disengage yourself from this abusive man.

I hope you can take their advice.

wol1968 · 25/06/2014 11:31

Just one thing to add. If you carry on like this, you may well lose your children. Seriously. No matter how you may try and shield them from the consequences of this relationship, the violence and binge-drinking WILL be affecting them, and SS take it very seriously. You will end up choosing between your partner and your children. Make sure it's your children.

JustDontWantToSay · 25/06/2014 11:32

Thank you all so much for the messages. Believe me when I say they are truly appreciated - I don't really get why some of the harsher posters have put what they have, but each to their own.

He did answer my text this morning to say that he hadn't responded because he was shocked at what I said and wasn't ready to send the reply he's written. It doesn't take a genius to work out what that 's going to be........

I'm in a very difficult place. I know full well that I cannot go back to the relationship as it was - and yet he's a wonderful man in some ways. He has admitted that he needs help for his anger issues but refuses to recognise the rest. He's insistent that it's me who is abusive, me who is so selfish and awful, etc.
Each time I write something down about how I feel I can hear his voice sneering at the back of my mind telling me that I'm playing the "poor me" card and "boohoo Justdont" and "it's all about YOU as always! It's always the Justdont show".
I can appreciate that as none of you know me in RL I could well be some if not all of the person he describes. But I'm not. I have strived for two years to be the person he wants and more. I have subjugated my own needs for his, tried my best in every way to look after him and he doesn't see it. Inside I feel bewildered, hurt, shocked, stunned and frightened of the way he's treated me. I don't understand why. A lot of you have said why bother understanding but I need to. He was so lovely in the beginning, in fact he's charm personified in day to day life. Why would he choose to do this? And continue??

I'm not writing off the relationship yet - but I'm certainly not going back to how it was. I can't. I can't go back to the misery, the anxiety, the controlling, the aggression and the suspicion. If he held his hands up and said that he would change then things might be different, but he hasn't and I don't think he will. So it's a stalemate. This is the first step for me.

Thank you all again, as I'm sure many of you know your support is invaluable at this stage. X

OP posts:
hellsbellsmelons · 25/06/2014 11:42

I have strived for two years to be the person he wants and more
WTF! WHY????

You are your own person. You are you.

Who cares what he wants.
What do YOU want?
Not someone who you have to change for.

Write it off.
He has been majorly physically abusive to you.
No-one on here is going to say it's OK to be with an abuser.
It's not. They do NOT change.

You are still embroiled in the drama. STEP BACK!
Stop feeding off of it.
There is nothing to explain. Some people are abusive and will abuse.

As to why? Well that's easy. Because he can, because you put up with it, because you keep coming back for more.

This is so frustrating. Please do not go back there. It will end very badly for you and your children.

Stop being his victim.

Please sign up to the Freedom Programme TODAY!
You can do it on-line. Get it done!

MellowAutumn · 25/06/2014 11:45

Or sign up for Jeremy Kyle ? Its your choice either way - and people are not getting nasty - just honest with you.

MorrisZapp · 25/06/2014 11:51

He wasn't lovely in the beginning, he threw you out of a hotel in your pants after three months. You don't owe us anything but at least be honest with yourself.

MorrisZapp · 25/06/2014 11:58

As for trying to change yourself to please a violent abuser, that suggests you are a very damaged person and need urgent help. Your relationship with your kids is at stake here but you don't seem that arsed.

MexicanSpringtime · 25/06/2014 12:06

I have strived for two years to be the person he wants and more

Ok, let's forget the abominable abuse for a moment, but call me romantic, wouldn't you want someone to love you for who you are?

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