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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

mortified at BIL and reaction to request for loan

240 replies

vexedveg · 03/04/2014 00:31

I have name changed for this.
I was not sure where to put this thread but hoping this is the right section

I want to give a bit of background to avoid drip feeding so bear with me. This outpouring is lonnnnnnnnnng!

DP and I dont have a lot of spare money - less so these days like alot of people but we are lucky to have got by to date with no credit cards, no loans and no debts ( apart from mortgage).. We lead a relatively frugal life and are v careful with money - dont really go out alot and our last family holiday was 4 years ago (was able to combine it with a work related trip to keep flight costs down). I buy most of our clothes from charity shops / car boot sales. We do however make sure DD gets things like swimming classes, membership of a running club.

we have one DD and pg with number 2.

I dont come from a well off background but my family is close and all help each other out as much as possible, whenever we can. I struggle with asking for any kind of help from people, including my family and have never owed anyone any money. Personally i find it really hard but also know i have been very lucky not to be in that position until now.

DP's family is somewhat different and alot more money focused. He is the youngest son with 2 older brothers, very successful in the financial sector in the city. They lead very different lifestyles to us and refer to us as the paupers and black sheep of the family. I have never had a v good relationship with eldest BIL, just very different people with different views and values. He once told me that i "should go home to the other f**king gypos". His words not mine. I am Irish.

He however is always offering to help us out and has repeatedly told DP that if there is ever anything he can do help out -including with money - to just ask, he is there for him and nothing would be too much. He always tells us how many millions he has in bank, how much he makes a month etc etc. He has laughed at our flat -saying that its overall value wouldnt even cover the value of his broom cupboard.
We never ever have asked for anything ( and even paid his share of MIL's funeral a few years ago when he refused to contribute.)

We both work FT earning just less than average salary each and live in a small flat in a building with other home buyers and some housing association tenants.

2 weeks ago we were presented with an unexpected bill for 25 k each for compulsory work in our area on subsidence - a bolt out of the blue and a total shock. We do not have those kinds of savings and my family in no way has access to that kind of money.

DP's first thought was to ask BIL to help out and I refused, wanting to explore all other options first. Have spoken to council about a repayment plan and tried to look at how to balance our books and fit in the repayments over the 2 years we have been given as well as cope with my mat leave. DP finally persuaded me that he would ask BIL for a LOAN for 1/3 amount which we would repay with interest- not to be given it as a handout or to keep.

We spent ages coming up with an email, basically explaining the situation and stating that we would really appreciate the loan, would repay it as soon as we could, how hard we both found it to ask but of course, if it wasnt possible it was not a problem and we would go back to the bank. i honestly felt sick writing it and v v embarassed at sending it.

I was dreading his reply but didnt expect what we got.

He didnt get back for a week, fair enough. When he did, he told us that he has been trying to find ways to get us out of paying at all, speaking to the council and pretending to be our debt adviser. he told them we are in massive debt and will not be paying.
he says he wont give us a loan as he thinks this would be propping up our lifestyle, that this will be a valuable life lesson and that he thinks we should be supporting the banks through a loan from them. He also said that he found it strange that we would not be able to find that amount as it is such a small amount. He also sad he was angry that we would approach him in the first place and it wasnt his fault that I came from "tinkers and layabout" stock. He said he was embarassed that his own brother would have to stoop so low as to ask for a handout. We didnt.

we have since found out that BIL shared our email with other family members in a - "jeez - what are they like" and "cant quite believe I have a brother so low on the social rung"

i feel very hurt and embarassed. Not at that he isnt going to give us a loan but at what he said. DP is shocked that when he finally had to ask for something, this is what has happened. I am also angry that even when he knew how hard we found it to go cap in hand for a loan, he shared this and is basically making a laugh of us behind our backs.

I suppose i am not really asking for advice - we will get through it somehow but wanted somewhere to vent.

well done for making it to the end... Smile

OP posts:
vexedveg · 06/04/2014 22:13

I think BIL meant that the chalet they are staying in is the one Kate and Will stay in when they are holidaying there. Not that they are there at the moment.

DP has always wanted his family to be close and I think he has clung onto some kind of hope that they may be. He has wanted to know his nephews / nieces and has wanted our DD to know them too. DD is the only grandchild on my side of the family so he has thought it important that she knows her cousins and uncle / aunts. It is heartbreaking in a way and he finds it hard that their behaviour falls so far from what he wants / needs.

when we first met - he found my tumbling tribe strange and was genuinely surprised that we all actually liked each other and wanted to be together. He used to be on guard, waiting for the jibes and derogatory comments to start and was disarmed when it didnt happen. My family is far from perfect but we get on and over things. If any of us need anything - we will work together to help out. I can honestly say that we would do nothing to deliberately hurt each other and whilst they may be arguments and disagreements, we are incredibly loyal.

They love him - my bros and sister as well as my parents and he is so welcome in our family home. He also has a laugh with them. It hurts him a bit to see how much love and attention DD gets from them, they give her so much and he finds the complete contrast hard at times.

Anyhow - we have both agreed that whilst we would love things to be different - that is the way they are and that is not going to change. There are some decent grounded people in his family and he will keep in contact with them. BIL will not be hearing form us again and nor will we be responding to any communication that he may send our way. There is to be a big family event in a couple of months time with them gathering. It would cost us a fair bit to be part of and we are going to bow out of it ( a relief in many ways!)

OP posts:
saffronwblue · 06/04/2014 22:50

Vexed your DD and LO to come have won life's lottery already by being born to loving and decent people like you and your DP. Sounds corny but the values that you are giving your DC will make them happy and secure people throughout their lives. BIL's poor DC will always feel a hole inside which cannot be filled with money or flash.

Botanicbaby · 06/04/2014 23:14

vexed - congratulations on your pregnancy and hope that things work out ok regards the subsidence bill. really think things will work it, your update sounded really positive.

as for your BIL (CIL), I truly wonder if he is a fantasist. all the people I have known of who had to boast that much about money turned out to be not quite as wealthy or important as they liked to portray. it will be a blessed relief for you and your family not to have to deal wtih him anymore really. he sounds utterly despicable.

ThatVikRinA22 · 07/04/2014 00:04

sb you believe your stuff and ill believe mine. i have my own reasons. i dont believe that if something bad happens its because you deserve it - but i do believe that if you do do something bad the universe has a way of righting it....

stepfather dropped dead. he had chosen a remote place to beat the women in his life - this meant when he had a heart attack he was dead before the ambulance got there.....i call that karma.

my son got a life threatening illness at 3. he hadnt done anything wrong. that was life. chance. lottery.
he got well again, he survived meningitis.

so i chose to trust in a greater good. rightly or wrongly. i think no matter how long it takes, bad deeds get their just desserts.
as do good ones.

BillyBanter · 07/04/2014 01:09

I'm sure he is very wealthy. Not as wealthy as he likes to be seen as being. Is not just important to be wealthy but to be demonstrably wealthy. He spends a lot of money on the status symbols.he us one if those people who 'work hard for his money' and if people are poor it must be their own fault they are idiots for valuing other things above money and mugs for not choosing a more lucrative career. He doesn't like paying for things if he can get away with it however. Leave that to the mugs. Tradesman nagging to be paid? Argue the toss that the job us not up to scratch.

He's an Arsehole. Let's hope he gets his comeuppance.

Know that he can't be that happy if he has to lord it over you like this.

Anchorage · 07/04/2014 04:35

I sooooooo want you to PM me his name and company. I have a huge network in financial consultancy industry (am partner in one), and it would be a joy to prick his obnoxious little balloon from the inside...

I know you are too nice to do this, but oh, it would be lovely...

Cerisier · 07/04/2014 04:53

The truly rich usually live very modestly. Your BIL has no manners and is a bully; I too hope he gets his comeuppance.

Caitlyn2014 · 07/04/2014 06:07

Anchorage your idea is hardly professional.

Solo · 07/04/2014 06:25

Only skim read page one, but do you have any kind of buildings insurance OP? I don't know if you would in a flat though...

8isalotoflegsDavid · 07/04/2014 09:40

Yes, you could follow up with a solicitor's letter saying that he has slandered/defamed you by what he allegedly did with the phone call to the council. Even if he didn't do it, it will make a point. Do you think there would be grounds for getting the police involved in that? Is it a criminal offence or merely a civil one? Did he pose as someone else to hoodwink a government official?

you could have some fun and give him some grief with that. Grin

Barbaralovesroger · 07/04/2014 13:34

We live much like yourselves, mortgage, second hand clothes/furniture, salt of the earth jobs. You sound really lovely too with morals and values I'd respect. BIL sounds v grabby, just awful.

YellowTulips · 07/04/2014 13:55

I just wouldn't bother with any revenge. He's the type of guy that would thrive on it.

I think the OP's approach of dignified silence is best.

Remember indifference can be very powerful - especially against someone who seems to relish the spotlight and loves to crassly show off in the way CIL does.

BeCool · 07/04/2014 14:23

your BIL is a ghastly cunt of the highest order! Never forget this.

Custardmiteofglut · 07/04/2014 14:42

I hope the awful BIL doesn't break something skiing or encounter an avalanche. That would be what he deserves dreadful.

Anchorage · 07/04/2014 15:35

Caitlyn, I can assure that if the BIL belongs to any of the professional bodies, they would be most interested to hear of any hint of slander, libel, misrepresentation and bringing the profession into disrepute...

ScarletWomanoftheVillage · 07/04/2014 17:28

Thank goodness he didn't lend the money. Can you imagine how he would have lorded it over you and held it against you etc? Best to keep a distance between yourselves and this nasty piece of work.

AnnRuleRules · 07/04/2014 21:19

Cerisier, yes that is true. My mother's parents were landowning farmers...her dad died when she was seven, and my granny then married another very wealthy landowner, who died in an accident just a year later. So she was extremely wealthy.

She lived VERY modestly....a gypsy woman used to sleep in her garden (this is in Ireland) as my granny used to give her food when everyone else spurned her. (the woman wouldn't go into the house). She left her money to my mum and my uncle, who again live very modest lives. My mum gives much of her money to animal charities!!!!

People who are all about image live like your BIL...the truly wealthy don't have the need.

anapitt · 07/04/2014 23:19

your BIL is horrible but please folks, don't call him a cunt.
Cunts are beautiful, warm, soft, and inviting.
He is none of these

BillyBanter · 07/04/2014 23:22

I'm sure the posters on here are quite capable of coping with words that have two different meanings.

morethanpotatoprints · 07/04/2014 23:30

His family are arse holes and without the loan request I would go nc.
As far as the subsidence payment is concerned, there must be others who haven't got this sort of money in their pockets.
I'm not sure I know anybody who could pay this.

NoArmaniNoPunani · 07/04/2014 23:31

Can we call him a scrote sac then?

BillyBanter · 07/04/2014 23:33

scrote sacs are lovely, they are squishy and a bit hairy.

Also arseholes can be very sensitive and welcoming.

so you can't use those either.

trixymalixy · 07/04/2014 23:39

Totally gob smacked by how vile your BIL is!! By trying to put you down he has shown his true colours to the rest of the family too. I'm sure the aunt wasn't the only one who thought it a very nasty thing to do.

Good luck with challenging the £25k bill.

trixymalixy · 07/04/2014 23:40

And please don't ever speak to him again.

Oldraver · 08/04/2014 01:31

One last text to him...Dear Scrote Sac...It is crass to discuss how much money you may have, and a sure sign that money doesn't buy class

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