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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

mortified at BIL and reaction to request for loan

240 replies

vexedveg · 03/04/2014 00:31

I have name changed for this.
I was not sure where to put this thread but hoping this is the right section

I want to give a bit of background to avoid drip feeding so bear with me. This outpouring is lonnnnnnnnnng!

DP and I dont have a lot of spare money - less so these days like alot of people but we are lucky to have got by to date with no credit cards, no loans and no debts ( apart from mortgage).. We lead a relatively frugal life and are v careful with money - dont really go out alot and our last family holiday was 4 years ago (was able to combine it with a work related trip to keep flight costs down). I buy most of our clothes from charity shops / car boot sales. We do however make sure DD gets things like swimming classes, membership of a running club.

we have one DD and pg with number 2.

I dont come from a well off background but my family is close and all help each other out as much as possible, whenever we can. I struggle with asking for any kind of help from people, including my family and have never owed anyone any money. Personally i find it really hard but also know i have been very lucky not to be in that position until now.

DP's family is somewhat different and alot more money focused. He is the youngest son with 2 older brothers, very successful in the financial sector in the city. They lead very different lifestyles to us and refer to us as the paupers and black sheep of the family. I have never had a v good relationship with eldest BIL, just very different people with different views and values. He once told me that i "should go home to the other f**king gypos". His words not mine. I am Irish.

He however is always offering to help us out and has repeatedly told DP that if there is ever anything he can do help out -including with money - to just ask, he is there for him and nothing would be too much. He always tells us how many millions he has in bank, how much he makes a month etc etc. He has laughed at our flat -saying that its overall value wouldnt even cover the value of his broom cupboard.
We never ever have asked for anything ( and even paid his share of MIL's funeral a few years ago when he refused to contribute.)

We both work FT earning just less than average salary each and live in a small flat in a building with other home buyers and some housing association tenants.

2 weeks ago we were presented with an unexpected bill for 25 k each for compulsory work in our area on subsidence - a bolt out of the blue and a total shock. We do not have those kinds of savings and my family in no way has access to that kind of money.

DP's first thought was to ask BIL to help out and I refused, wanting to explore all other options first. Have spoken to council about a repayment plan and tried to look at how to balance our books and fit in the repayments over the 2 years we have been given as well as cope with my mat leave. DP finally persuaded me that he would ask BIL for a LOAN for 1/3 amount which we would repay with interest- not to be given it as a handout or to keep.

We spent ages coming up with an email, basically explaining the situation and stating that we would really appreciate the loan, would repay it as soon as we could, how hard we both found it to ask but of course, if it wasnt possible it was not a problem and we would go back to the bank. i honestly felt sick writing it and v v embarassed at sending it.

I was dreading his reply but didnt expect what we got.

He didnt get back for a week, fair enough. When he did, he told us that he has been trying to find ways to get us out of paying at all, speaking to the council and pretending to be our debt adviser. he told them we are in massive debt and will not be paying.
he says he wont give us a loan as he thinks this would be propping up our lifestyle, that this will be a valuable life lesson and that he thinks we should be supporting the banks through a loan from them. He also said that he found it strange that we would not be able to find that amount as it is such a small amount. He also sad he was angry that we would approach him in the first place and it wasnt his fault that I came from "tinkers and layabout" stock. He said he was embarassed that his own brother would have to stoop so low as to ask for a handout. We didnt.

we have since found out that BIL shared our email with other family members in a - "jeez - what are they like" and "cant quite believe I have a brother so low on the social rung"

i feel very hurt and embarassed. Not at that he isnt going to give us a loan but at what he said. DP is shocked that when he finally had to ask for something, this is what has happened. I am also angry that even when he knew how hard we found it to go cap in hand for a loan, he shared this and is basically making a laugh of us behind our backs.

I suppose i am not really asking for advice - we will get through it somehow but wanted somewhere to vent.

well done for making it to the end... Smile

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 03/04/2014 16:28

That is shocking behaviour from your BIL. But I expect the was all talk and probably isn't any position to lend you that kind of money. Don't know what I'd do in your position. But I can't see how they can enforce this payment. I am sure you will not be the only people unable to afford this.

Timetoask · 03/04/2014 16:37

Shocking behaviour by your BIL. I am sorry he has been so insulting.
Please please ignore him, he thinks he is great because he has all this money and city job, but you are a better person because you value the important things in life.

I really hope you manage to sort out the financial situation. Good luck. Good karma is coming your way.

pancakesfortea · 03/04/2014 16:37

I know this isn't what you asked OP but you should contact the Leasehold Advisory Service who can tell you about your rights to challenge this bill as well as options to help pay it. It's a free service, funded by government. They give free initial legal advice - so they can't represent you but can set you off in the right direction.

slug · 03/04/2014 16:40

I'd be tempted to send BIL an email and bcc all the family (with the exception of the aunt) in apologising for asking for a loan as he's 'obviously still not over the financial embarrassment he was in at the time of MIL's funeral'

AngelaDaviesHair · 03/04/2014 17:02

Contact the Bar Pro Bono Unit urgently and ask for advice. They have a pool of barristers who volunteer and you might get a specialist to look at it, even quite a senior one if you are lucky. If they accept your case there is no charge.

The Law Society should also have details of solicitors' firms that will give free advice.

deste · 03/04/2014 17:04

I also think he us all mouth. I bet he doesn't have the money, he is all talk, in other words a bullsh*er. And I doubt the aunt made a mistake, she wanted you to know what he was saying. This would surely be worth claiming off buildings insurance.

pancakesfortea · 03/04/2014 17:18

Surely the freeholder should have had buildings insurance to cover this. Definitely worth taking advice before paying up.

Dozer · 03/04/2014 17:22

Bil is massive tosser, but as others say there could be hope of help with dealing with that huge demand for payment.

AntoinetteCosway · 03/04/2014 17:22

BIL is an utter arse. I am gobsmacked someone could be so cruel.

I'm also gobsmacked the council can do this to you. If we had the same thing we wouldn't be able to get a loan for that much, we don't have anywhere near that much in savings, it's more than our combined credit card limits and no one in our families could lend it to us. Even if we sold the hose we wouldn't have enough equity to pay it. What on earth do they expect people to do?!

Caitlyn2014 · 03/04/2014 17:43

I'm of the opinion that your brother in law isn't as flush as he'd like people to think.

MexicanSpringtime · 03/04/2014 17:51

Your BIL is obviously a miser, and for those of a religious turn of mind, misers go to one of the worst parts of hell!

Lots of rich people are extremely miserly, a friend of mine was married to one. He would never, ever pay the full bill for any work done for him by some lesser mortal.

eddielizzard · 03/04/2014 17:53

i reckon your bil is in serious financial shit.

he's decided his strategy is to belittle and put you down. he is the lowest of the low. money has nothing to do with it. the rest of the family are probably shocked at his behaviour.

you sound lovely and responsible and i really hope this works out for you. you deserve a break and i think it would be good not to mix with your bils again.

you don't have to you know!

FetchezLaVache · 03/04/2014 18:34

Another vote here for BalloonSlayer's excellent email. I would definitely copy it to the whole family or it could look like you've gone NC with BIL over his refusal to lend you money, rather than his generally knobbish behaviour and insults about your family.

What a prize cunt this man is. Encouraging you for years to ask him for a loan if ever you needed one, then declaring himself angry at your temerity in asking for a loan.

Hope you manage to get rid of the bill as well as the BIL, OP.

NurseyWursey · 03/04/2014 19:08

This is absolutely awful. I'm also gobsmacked the council can do this!

nauticant · 03/04/2014 19:17

I reckon your BIL has access to more than enough money but he's a mean cunt who's simply revelling in hurting you both. I expect he was always was hoping to get one over on you and this gave him a chance to really stick the boot in.

Long term though he loses. No matter what he does, he'll still be who he is.

SELondonSwede · 03/04/2014 19:49

Hi OP,

I have been in a similar situation regarding a major works bill via the freeholder. Please PM me and maybe my experiences can help? I understand the stress 100% but you have rights and you are not on your own in this. Please do contact LAS as mentioned above and get legal advice.

You and your dh seem genuinley lovely people so keep your head held high. And remember, the chicken will come home to roost. They always do.

Hang in there, all will be well.

Sleepyheadx · 03/04/2014 19:57

Haven't read all if thread sorry . Your BIL sounds toxic and you are gaining nothing IMO fri your relationship with him apart from being put down and insulted . You are better than that .
As for getting a bill for £25000 seek legal advice properly and your mortgage or house insurance should cover subsidence ?

TaytoCrisp · 03/04/2014 19:59

That is atrocious behaviour on your bils part. You both sound like lovely sensible people. I imagine that other family members will see how unreasonable he is, and how nastily he has acted in this circumstance. Hats off to u if u can remain civil with him, I don't think I could.

FrequentFlyerRandomDent · 03/04/2014 21:09

BIL sounds like he was waiting for you to be down to kick you.

I wonder his offer of help was just so that you would unveil your problems.

I am glad you are getting legal advice, etc. Please do not liaise with him. Calling the council to claim you are in debt is, if true, madness. Just tell the council you have an unhinged BIL.

Good luck. You deserve some.

MistressDeeCee · 03/04/2014 21:49

Patronising git. Fuck him. Id never speak to the odious man again. He obviously gets off on being seen as the big 'I am' and making others look small. So, you had money problems - and? you and millions of others. Doesn't give anybody the right to judge and patronise you. How jealous inside he must be of your DH. Nope, this would be it for me. Bye bye creep.

Botanicbaby · 03/04/2014 21:57

another one here who thinks your BIL is not as wealthy as he makes out. sorry he has been so utterly vile to you OP. I think you should send ballonslayers email reply to him too.

when I read your post, it just reminded me of a good friend of mine who had been in a similar-ish situation years ago with her BIL. the BIL in question was the MILs 'golden boy', could do no wrong. He sent his children to private school that, as they all discovered later, he couldn't afford and it was all for show. In the end he was the one who borrowed money from my friend's husband (his brother) and sister and never paid it back.

VivaLeBeaver · 03/04/2014 22:02

ContACT PEOPLE PREVIOUSLY RECOMMENDED to appeal this bill.

Send that email to BIL that BalloonSlayer wrote and cc everyone in who he has emailed about the situation. Then cut him off.

The aunt is on your side and I would bet copied you in accidently on purpose.

DustBunnyFarmer · 03/04/2014 22:08

I'm another one who agrees that aunt's copied reply was no accident. She meant for you to know.

bumbumsmummy · 03/04/2014 22:12

He's an arsehole no question but there is a bright side and that's the fact that you will not be beholden to this shit for anything

Your life is your choice and you don't have to justify it to anyone

will your insurance not cover the work

AnnRuleRules · 03/04/2014 22:18

I could kiss your aunt!!!! Balloon's email is pretty damn good!! Send it, yes!!!

OP....your family sounds lovely and happy, and I bet BIL is deep down very unhappy that his life is nothing compared to yours and his brothers (the one he took great delight in tormenting).

I also think he is short of money....all talk and no trousers!!