How do I respond to this email from DH?

[catgirl1976]

DH and I have some problems. I think a few people on here might remember some of them and some of MN have the strong opinion that DH is not good for me.

However, I do love him. But I am exhausted and unhappy.

I tried to talk to him last night and this morning found the email below in my inbox.

I just don't know how to reply, or what I want. Well I do. I want things back the way they were and I want a partner.

Does anyone have any advice on how I should respond?

Hello Cat,

It guts me to see you so unhappy. It really wasn't the intention. You see there was a time when we had fun and I thought it rocked. So much so I didn't want anything to interrupt that. But you wanted a baby and reluctantly I acquiesced. Thank the stars I did. Look at DS! He is incredible and amazing.

That doesn't help you though. (Actually it should but lets move on from that).

You are right, I have changed. I have grown older, and also commercially very cynical. My entire life I have been looking for happiness, I have actually found it in our DS. I never expected this and certainly didn't ask for it, but he has had a profound effect on my outlook on life.

Its a crime that you were forced (in part by me I guess) back to work so early. I do agree you have drawn the shitty end of a long stick. The answer is simple, that being get a new job. However I fear you will be unhappy wherever you are. Certainly XX despite its shortcomings is far better than any company I have had the grace to work for. I also admit that's not saying much.

You are 100% Correct in that I could do more around the house. I hope you acknowledge the increased effort I have been putting into this. An example would be tidying up even though I have DS. Yes I could do more, but I am sure you can relate to the amount of demands he makes on one and given that its easy to procrastinate. However that said I will increase my productivity and I hope it makes life easier for you.

For me though the nub is that I feel as out of place as you do. I have said repeatedly that I would love to do your job, hell I have even advised you on it (Not that you really need it, you are more than competent, I was just trying to help). The fact of the matter is that at the ripe old age of forty I have no other trade than selling. Between you, me and the gatepost, I cannot and will not return to the environment that I used to inhabit. I cant. Call it burnt out, mid life crisis, or laziness. I simply cannot do that anymore. As I have stated, i would rather clean toilets.

Maybe I should clean toilets. It would be fairer of course to contribute financially. However the one thing that does bring me a modicum of prestige is DS. I have worked so hard (and enjoyed it, a luxury you don't have in your vocation) to help and develop him. I think I am just in being proud of my Son, regardless of bias.

You are right, I do need friends and interests outside this house. However in my experience the Muppets I worked with tended to be the opposite of my outlook in every way. A notable exception would be XX. That said I don't expect to find many “XX's” in any job I stand a snowballs chance of getting.

I can see how hard you are working and pushing yourself. Its obvious that the gas tank it empty and its not sustainable. I will do whatever I can to help, with recourse to the above. I cannot fix your career.

I cannot be the the dude you fell in love with either. I'm older, slower (still quick) and jaded. But the two aspects of my life where I raise a smile are (in order) TDS and you. You are exhausted, mentally, physically and emotionally. Its not surprising give the amount of responsibility on your shoulders. It means everything to me to be able to help, but DS means everything to me too, and I want to have a real, fundamental impact on him and be the father I never had. In a nutshell that means forsaking everything for him.

I don't want to forsake you though. However if we are at the point where you simply don't see why you married me, or that dude that looked you up (and down) in halls then I get it. I am not a parasite and will bow out with as much honour as I can muster.

I love you and always will, but I cant stand seeing you this unhappy. I do believe we can grow from this position, however I respect your feelings too and If that isn't a decision you subscribe to I understand.

I Love you, and pray that is enough.

x

Hi catgirl,

You know what I think of your husband so I won't say it all again

I'm glad you are starting to get angry and fed up.

Why is he writing this way? I agree at least in part it's to further HIS narrative for the purposes of custody down the line. I would strongly suggest you write back not for the purpose of dialogue (that's hopeless) but to correct the vision he has painted. Point out that he spends more days playing computer games than looking after this son that supposedly he wants to make the centre of his life. Explain his bullshit 'financial initiative' in words so it doesn't sound impressive or anything.

Stay strong and stay angry, and please get this useless man out of your life.

"Why is he writing in that really pretentious manner? He doesn't speak like that, so why write it?".....

Definitely worth thinking about that further.

Yeah, who's in the bcc line...?

Why is he writing like this?

He was in sales. He is selling himself. He is presenting his best version of himself as the 'on the record' version. Whether he is as calculating as doing this as paper trail for a potential future separation, or simply doing it because of lack of self -awareness, or to gain sympathy from friends and family down the line, this is what he is doing.

And the possibility that it might be the former is worrying.

Please, please, please think about legal advice Cat. You need to make it very clear that he is not the main carer. You need to make it very clear that you are doing mornings, evenings and weekends and that, despite working full time, you are more of a main caregiver than he is with his two days a week.

Please protect yourself.

If it helps, my situation was a bit like this 2 years ago. DH was made redundant and his career had come to an end in his early 40s. He looked after the kids 2 days a week, they were in childcare for 3 and I worked all hours full time. He did very little housework, no cooking and played on the computer. Part of it was despair. He thought he was washed up and didnt think he could ever retrain and that no one would want him. He applied for jobs he was not qualified for. It was very frustrating.
Eventually I found a government retraining program. They took him on, retrained him and while we struggled for the childcare during the training period he was given a job. He now has excellent career prospects and is much happier. He contributes more and is easier to live with.

I told him that staying at home was not an option, that he would need to find something or he would have to find himself a pinny (sorry, not politically correct) and become a full time house husband and actually make an effort. My DH is not a bad man or a lazy man, he was depressed and wanted to take an easy way out.
Mind you he never emailed me about it!
Good luck!

cat I do think people might be onto the truth by saying that you aren't really the intended audience of those e-mails. He is writing for the benefit of posterity, of a solicitor, of a court. So that he can say 'look how I tried, look what I do'. Be really bloody careful, because he may be an utter cunt be he also isn't stupid.

What do you two actually say when you are in a room together.
Do you speak? Do you ever make a reference to the emails that you are sending to each other?

It's all very odd!

On the Emotional Abuse thread there was some discussion a couple of months ago of the pompous, arrogant ways in which fuckwits used the English language to communicate with their other halves, especially about things they thought they were entitled to. There were some classic examples and were quite funny, if you disregarded the mind fuck that it was intended to cause.

I agree with someone up thread who said it was to make him look better if you went down the legal route.

Make sure you cover your own back.

If you think he's a cocklodger who won't change, end things.

If you think he could change then don't be surprised if you have to help him to change. Blame and anger needs to be dealt with to allow you both to move forwards without the past holding you back. It'll be a hard and long process.

This is exactly how my ex and I used to 'communicate' in the death throws of our relationship, only his emails contained no reference to loving me!

I kidded myself that this was 'communication'. It really isn't. It's just a way of dodging the issue, hiding your head in the sand etc.

Please believe when I say, from lessons learned from long bitter years of experience, if you cannot sit down together and TALK to one other, the relationship is doomed.

Put your business hat on for a moment.

It's been three years at least that you've been trying to improve things. And this is where you are? Him saying that if you sit down and do a rota, of eminently predictable household tasks, he'll do his best to try to do it. After three years.

Honestly, how much hope do you have that things will ever get to the point where you want them to be?

do you want to be like your parents, and play out this drama for the next thirty years?

If you do that, what do you think are the odds that your own son will escape that cycle?

I can't believe your husband is throwing in your face now that you were the one who wanted the baby. That alone makes me want to do unspeakably bad things to him. But it shows how enduringly selfish he is -- even after all this time, even though he supposedly just wants to take care of your DS, he can't let go of the fact that you were the one who ruined the big party. Well fuck him. People that narcissistic and selfish will just ruin your life.

Like others, I remember your previous threads catgirl and feel furious on your behalf.

Others have said it better and given good advice so I won't go on but one thing jumps out here. Your H is clearly of the opinion that he just needs to say jump and you will go 'how high'.

What he's doing is using a trick he has learnt to keep you doingwhat he wants. That's what all of this is about. He's figured out that a few 'I love yous' trotted out every now and again will keep you dancing attendance on him, making yourself ill while he does fuck all.

I'm sorry if this sounds blunt but he doesn't love you and probably never did. No loving person (hell, no half decent person with a conscience) would behave towards another human being the way he treats you. Essentially, you're just there to facilitate his parasitic lifestyle and he'll do what he can to keep you there.

He's one of life's takers and will keep on taking, taking, taking from you until you have nothing left to give if you let him.

Sorry...I have gone on a bit haven't I. I really wish all the best to you and your DS.

Btw I know it's been said but please make sure he can't see this thread. Don't, on any account, show it to him.

cat ive not seen your other threads (somehow!??) despite being here a fair old bit.

firstly, he is flatly stating his position and its seems that there is no negotiation. Its up to you to like it or lump it is the gist of what im reading from him.

if he loved you, truly, then he would be moving heaven and earth to save the marriage, to help you, to nurture and look after you, but he isnt. he likes things just the way they are and is using flowery language to bamboozle you into thinking what a nice guy he really is....

he is very very blinkered if he thinks that making such small, pathetic gestures is going to placate you and sort things out. It sounds very much like he is quite happy to see you struggle on and on, as long as HE is happy.

the scales need to fall from your eyes.

ive been married 23 years....now we went through a very rocky patch 20 years ago and we ended up communicating by letter to each other....but dh backed it up with actions - not just words. he pulled out the stops to save our marriage - ask yourself how your DH is doing that?

i often have a similar conversation with my son about division of labour in this house....but he is 22 with special needs. your dh is lazy sod who has got very comfortable doing nothing, no demands, pleasing himself and he is actually expecting you to buy the fact that he thinks that he is doing rather well actually....he looks after your DS for 2 whole days!!
sorry.
too bloody little, too late by the sounds of it.
he needs a huge wake up call. then you will see his true colours.

Oh cat girl, I don't think your H is ever going to change love. Why would he? He leads the life of Riley, makes everything your fault & your responsibility. Get some legal advice re your DS. You sound like such a lovely person, you absolutely do not deserve a life like this.

Sorry to pop by - not much time to read whole thread, just a couple of posts from you and a few responses, so I may be repeating others...
What exactly would this man do if he wasn't freeloading from you, if you left for example?
How would he live? Would that perhaps force him to get a job?

Reading these emails (from him not you) has made me scream with rage he is such a pretentious, nasty, responsibility shirking SHITBAG.

Sorry. He reminds me of my EX husband.

Read them to DP, he was looking utterly baffled and saying 'what a twat!' and 'how does he get away with not working and only having their ds two days a week?'

Honestly, get shot (i know its easier said than done). I divorced exh and had 2 years of sadness and upset through the divorce but 7 years on I thank God every day I did it, both for my me and my children

Catgirl, I am so sorry you are married to such a dickhead. You deserve so so much more. He needs a big dose of Grow The Fuck Up, but he never had that, did he? You've always been there as his shield from life.

He can't find his way when you are together. And neither can you. Blossom, sweetheart, by letting him go.

Actually, just thinking about it further...what's YOUR payoff for staying in this situation? You have read back through the threads you've started over the past couple of years, haven't you? And the ones in which you have participated relating to relationships and how they play out?

So, what do you get from being in this one? That's where your answers lie, not in what he will or will not do to be a functioning human being.

Hi Catgirl - I'm a namechanger, I 'know' you too.

Protect yourself legally from now on - consider all emails as future legal documents. I agree with everyone who says either state your position clearly (ie that you actually do more childcare than him, the SAHD!) or don't reply - CERTAINLY don't tell him he's a good dad. This is important. And him having your son for 2 days out of 7 and not taking on childcare whenever you are around does not make him the main carer.

On the anonymous front, I can see you are not that bothered as you have pics on your profile of you, your h and your son and you have posted his emails on here in their entirety. Just ask yourself if you want him and other people in RL to see what you post though...

On the other stuff - I understand how hard it is. You want everything to be ok, him to change, you want to stay together for your son. I really feel for you.

It does seem like he won't change and his initial email made me actually wince - it's so hammy, so self indulgent, so scripted, so stilted, so manipulative, so insincere, so passive aggressive, so sly...

And self-indulgent. Bet he spends time on libertarian sites, the big faker.