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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Argh. Please stop me being an OW!

197 replies

StuporousFunker · 14/12/2013 22:56

Oh bugger. Please help me to NOT be a twat.

I'm a lone parent, with two lovely boys. Have been on my own with them since splitting up with ex-H about 7 years ago. They're fab, but I have to admit sometimes I am lonely and would love to have someone in my life.

I've been working with this guy for the last 6 months, who I think is absolutely amazing; when we first met it was like one of those thunder struck moments. He's incredibly creative and intelligent, makes me laugh and I think we just really click. God, that sounds like such a horrible cliché, but I haven't felt like this about anyone for about 1,000 years (am an old bird, clearly...).

Now the problem is, he's married, so I haven't said or done anything about how I feel. Well, that would be until last night's work Christmas party. Had been cunningly keeping away from him, but then he cornered me and said that he had to talk to me about us: he's been feeling the same about me, his marriage hasn't being working for the last 4 years, I'm beautiful etc, etc. Could have been a load of old lines, and probably was, and God-damn the alcohol, but I ended up kissing him. He's called and texted me today, which I've ignored.

Argh. I really, REALLY like him and my head seems to have been infiltrated by a random teenager's. Please, please talk some sense into me. I know I can't go there, and I feel horribly, hideously guilty for kissing him.

I am an idiot. I can't do anything with this, can I?

OP posts:
Hogwash · 17/12/2013 01:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Lazyjaney · 17/12/2013 07:30

"We all sympathise and offer support on MN when someone is complaining of their husband having an affair so to knowingly become the OW would be very hypercritical"

IMO it's time to get real. The facts are that 33 - 40% of people admit to having affairs at some time or other, never mind who actually do so, so there are likely to be a lot of OW on MN too. The MM could be everything from a total wanker to a desperately unhappy man living with a complete bitch - who knows?. The chances of any MM ending a marriage before romancing the OP and finding out she is worth it are minimal. The OP here is a free agent, and owes no one anything. Finding decent unmarried men is damn hard past the 20s, harder still with kids.

That's the reality.Besides, alls fair in love and war.

A lot of the crap the OP has been getting on this thread is from people who wont face this reality.

She should do what she pleases, just so long as she is fully aware of the risks she is taking.

mammadiggingdeep · 17/12/2013 08:01

"Alls fair in love and war?" Total and utter bollocks.

Fairenuff · 17/12/2013 08:22

How did he respond when you said this OP?

Livinginlimbo2 · 17/12/2013 10:18

Nobody knows the real situation of his home life. I was an OW many, many years ago. The relationship lasted about 12 months and he had every intention of leaving his wife. Unfortunately his wife had a history of mental heath issues and was frequently physical and mentally abusive to him and others.
On one occasion she had his car followed, it was a rental. Upon getting out of his car he was bludgeoned by two strangers. He was left unconscious and I had to drag him onto the back seat and drive him to A and E. This was in the days before everyone had mobile phones ,so as we were in the back of beyond I couldn't call 999.
He regained consciousness some time after arriving at the hospital. He was badly bruised and had a number of lacerations to his head. The medical staff wanted to keep him in hospital but he refused. He told the police officer who was investigating the case that he didn't want to take the matter further. The same police officer told me to go home as it was a "family matter" and I should leave well alone.
Some time after arriving at my flat, the man I was having the affair with staggered in in a very confused state followed by his wife. She ranted at him for being such a stupid clot for getting himself beaten up and bringing shame on his family. She then laid into him, punching and kicking him . I literally had to pick her up by the back of her sweater and throw her out. He duly followed her.
I saw him once after that; about 2 years later in a collage canteen. He looked as if he'd aged 20 years. I often wonder what became of him.

savemefromrickets · 17/12/2013 10:27

It's never a good sign when the OW feels worse about the husband's breaking of vows than the husband himself feels!!!

Please don't go there. I have the tshirt. It would go nicely under your hair shirt.

Lazyjaney · 17/12/2013 10:51

"Alls fair in love and war?" Total and utter bollocks

It's a statement of reality, not morality.

MerryFuckingChristmas · 17/12/2013 10:55

I'm glad I don't move in your sort of circles, LJ

Leavenheath · 17/12/2013 10:58

All is not fair in love and war and this thread has got absolutely nothing to do with 'getting real'. No-one needs educating that affairs are commonplace or that Mumsnet has amongst its posters people who've never had affairs, have never had a partner cheat, people who've had affairs, OW and OM. The OP is not stupid. Everyone knows that internet forums have a cross section of posters with different experiences.

Neither does it matter a fig whether this man is in an unhappy marriage to a dislikeable woman. That shouldn't change any of the sensible advice which is that if he's that unhappy, he should get out of his relationship before starting another and embroiling another woman in his drama, using her as a prop because he's too weak to do it himself.

cjel · 17/12/2013 11:05

LIMBO . I am not saying that your MM wife wasn't mentally ill and wrong in how she behaved, but I do feel very strongly that if you love someone and they are having an affair and breaking your heart it can really drive you mad. Have you ever stopped to consider it was the very fact that her DH was having an affair with you that caused her to be 'mental'

Livinginlimbo2 · 17/12/2013 11:12

Well of course she had every right to rant and rage, and yes, finding out your partner cheats is likely to send you off kilter. The woman in question had a long history of being violent. I wasn't told this by OM but by those that knew him. She had been arrested on more than one occasion for assault.

downunderdolly · 17/12/2013 11:46

"The chances of any MM ending a marriage before romancing the OP and finding out she is worth it are minimal. The OP here is a free agent, and owes no one anything. Finding decent unmarried men is damn hard past the 20s, harder still with kids."

Seriously? All that very nice women in their 30s have to aspire to is a married man who will hedge his bets and shag her before possibly leaving his wife for her is the aspiration for most and they should go for it as all is fair in love and war? I'm glad I don't subscribe to your world view LJ.

mammadiggingdeep · 17/12/2013 12:38

Cjel- I thought exactly the same. If she wasn't mentally ill before her husband started shagging someone else and driving around the countryside on secret rendezvous, I expect it helped her go that way...

Another example of why it's icky to get involved with married people. It leads to drama and heartache.

mammadiggingdeep · 17/12/2013 12:39

Livinginlimbo...not condoning violence but had you considered that he may have also had a long history of shagging about??

Livinginlimbo2 · 17/12/2013 12:50

He had had one affair, years before we met. His wife was very unstable at the best of times. She had attacked a number of people. OM was shit scared of her and I bet she didn't weigh more than about 7stone, she was tiny.

theunashamedow · 17/12/2013 12:58

I was in exactly the same situation and 4 years later my dp are happy together with new blended family after my dp left his very unhappy marriage. His exw also says she's happier now.
So go for it as why should you be alone and him stuck in a grossly unhappy marriage?
He sounds like a classic exit affair situation but make sure he's committed to leaving his wife before sex!
Take a chance on him op. This can and does work out for everyone.

5HundredUsernamesLater · 17/12/2013 13:12

Lazyjaney
Can I ask if your views change to suit the thread. We know your views on this one but if the devastated wife were to post would you be one of the hypocrites offering sympathy and if it happened to you and it was your partner or husband playing away would you then still congratulate the other woman with the same attitude 'alls fair in love and war' I obviously don't know you but I would guess not!

Hogwash · 17/12/2013 13:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Jellymum1 · 17/12/2013 13:56

I am feeling concerned. My DH started a new job sixish months ago and he was on his night out on friday. I have mental health issues one of which is pnd and our marriage can be difficult although i remember the totally amazing sparks flying wonderful man from the beginning sighs feeling insecure :(

GimmeDaBoobehz · 17/12/2013 14:06

How did yesterday go?

LurcioLovesFrankie · 17/12/2013 14:15

Well done for the lunchtime chat, OP. Hang on in there. It can be done

I had a "friend" who came onto me while in a relationship - I can honestly say it was the most passionate snog I've ever had - but I read him the riot act afterwards, and eventually. Several more attempts at chatting me up later, I told him I'd tell his OH if he persisted. He eventually married her, they're divorced, but at least it wasn't my fault!

These things happen - people do feel sexual attraction towards people they shouldn't. Sometimes they act on it and wish they hadn't Sometimes people have "exit affairs" because they're not strong enough, or are so down-trodden that they can't find any other way to escape an intolerable situation. This doesn't make them monsters - weak, maybe, foolish, almost certainly. And (old gimmer that I am) I'd say the odds of happiness for any of the protagonists is pretty low at the end of the whole sorry business (my experience of watching this sort of situation unfold is that when there's a love triangle, in general both spouse and bit on the side get shat on, while it's the cheater who has least emotional fall out from the situation - and this holds regardless of the genders/sexualities of the protagonists). So common sense (never mind morality) suggests you're following the right course.

Good luck (and don't listen to those who are going overboard saying ridiculous things like "she's just looking for an excuse to go ahead" - you don't come across that way to me, you come across as maybe a bit lonely, vulnerable towards this sort of approach, but with your head screwed on enough to know it will likely end in tears, and determined to try to do the sensible/right thing).

wannaBe · 17/12/2013 15:59

the numbers that cheat are actually closer to 60%.

What does make me Hmm on mn is how an affair pretty much justifies any behaviour. so upthread a poster said she was in an affair with a woman who was violent. and suddenly that violence is justified because the man was having an affair? how does that work then? So nobody who is the victim of an affair is ever in any way responsible for the state of their marriage before the affair? get real.

Ultimately affairs are never justified because of their destructive nature, not only to the other party but also often to the person doing the cheating depending on the circumstances that have brought them there. but just because affairs are wrong doesn't mean that everyone whose partner has an affair is an innocent saint who did no wrong in the marriage. And given that 60% of people (and the numbers are similar for men and women) admit to cheating on their partner it doesn't add up that 60% (probably higher) of the population are thoughtless bastards who have poor innocent victim partners at home...

My ex mil's auntie was the ow for 40 years. She even had a child by the mm. His wife had some mh issues and threatened to kill not only herself but also her children if he ever dared to leave her (he had tried to before entering into an affair fwiw) Her children confirmed this some years later when they reached adulthood. So he ended up in an affair. Ideal? absolutely not. But he was desperately unhappy and in fear of his children's lives, and while it's very easy to sit on the sidelines and say he should have left, lots of people stay in abusive relationships precisely because they or their children are threatened if they dare to leave.

But he loved the ow, and I think that after 40 years it can be safely assumed that she wasn't just some shag on the side.

Do I think that the dw's threats to kill her children were justified? no I bloody don't. Do I think that the mm should have had an affair? probably not, but I can see why he did. And while I think that the ow could have done so much better, she clearly loved him, and I don't see him as a bastard or her as a homewrecking bitch. Life just isn't that black and white.

MaybeABitLikeTigger · 17/12/2013 16:10

Op, don't be so hard on yourself. It was just a kiss from a man you really fancy, and you know it was wrong! Agree with other posters: tell him you do not want to be involved with him. If he ever is single he can contact you! And avoid flirting at work; minimise contact and be business like!

worsestershiresauce · 17/12/2013 16:12

wannabe I agree. Relationships are by their very nature complicated, and sometimes in life people avoid awkward conversations and just go ahead with something that may to an outsider seen morally reprehensible because they are too much of a coward to do the right thing.

However, in the situation you outline I'd be surprised if the wife's mental state wasn't entirely unrelated to the fact her husband had a mistress.... It's the kind of living hell that would drive all most people half mad with misery. People who cheat tend to save up their nice side for the bit on the side and bring home an emotionally cold, critical, hostile version of themselves for the wife. The fact she was unstable before the affair implies she probably didn't have the mental strength to cope with it and walk out on him.

wannaBe · 17/12/2013 16:28

no I don't agree.

It's a very warped view that suggests that violence or threats of it are somehow justified on the basis of an affair yet an affair is never understandable and that even domestic violence does not justify someone having an affair yet an affair justifies domestic violence. That view is so messed up I don't even know where to go with that.