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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Am I being selfish guy here? - sex after pregnancy issue

188 replies

blueeyedguy · 27/11/2013 20:53

Hi all,

wondering if I could get some advice from a females perspective.

My partner and I have 2 children, one 3 and another who is 13 weeks old.

After the birth of our second it became apparent that my partner had an issue with a bladder prolapse which has become an obstacle in getting being able to get our sex life back on track. I have been supportive with this and tried to keep my own high sex drive under control and not been a pest to her.

Penetrative sex would be difficult for us, but am I selfish for asking for her to perform oral sex or handjob on me in the meantime?

On the occasion I asked, and tried to be as tactful about it as possible, I was told "why, what am i going to get out of it"? Also, understandably so she says breastfeeding our little one doesn't really make her feel sexy.

Now I understand her position, it must be very frustrating for her, and I am happy to wait if it needs to be like that, but I cant help thinking that helping me out wouldn't be really a big deal?

If roles were reversed I wouldn't mind easing her frustrations as making her happy makes me happy.

OP posts:
Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 15:54

In order to be clear, my interpretation is (and always has been) that the op should self service and give his wife a break. That's it.

I don't think though that it's acceptable that he's vilified in this way, having already conceded that he was in the wrong. Jan45 stands out (almost alone) as the sole voice of female reason.

I personally don't feel that the op's unreasonableness has warranted this backlash. I just don't.

Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 15:55

oh Christ, and so the bullying of anyone with a contrary view begins/continues.

Jan45 · 28/11/2013 16:02

working: all the fancy words in the world won't make me change my mind, on anything that's gone on here - the OP has already accepted that he was being selfish - what's gone on since can only be, IMO of course, has been a tirade of abuse towards him, and in fact at times, men in general. I'm happy to say I'm a woman and I was trying to help the OP understand what he needs to do, not crucify the guy for having a sexual appetite.

TheXxed · 28/11/2013 16:11

Jan45 the thinking behind his OP was fundamentally flawed and revealed some dangerous views regarding sex and consent.

The importance he placed on his own sexual appetite over his wife's vulnerable condition is selfish and unacceptable.

Then going on a public forum to solicit opinions from other people in order to reinforce his views and take away her agency is wrong.

Imagine if we all agreed and said yes even though she is pain dealing with prolapse she should still suck your dick!

He would use this to reinforce that there is something wrong with her and everyone else thinks you should suck my dick. This undermines her ability to consent.

Offred · 28/11/2013 16:19

Classic piggery from a man who feels competitive with his own baby I would say.

Easiest way to exercise control over a woman's attention after having a baby is to badger them about your sexual needs IMHO.

I don't think it is about being selfish at all. It is about being a pig. It cannot be about having an orgasm or you'd just be wanking, like you do when you are single. It is particularly about forcing the woman to service you, that's why you don't mind that she doesn't want to do it. Like I say - a pig. And a red flag.

I'm with the poster who said I'd never forget or forgive a man who started pestering for blowjobs when I'd said no to sex in these circs.

Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 16:20

Yes, but the op's opener was framed as a question. He conceded he's in the wrong. A public forum, but behind the cloak of annonymity. I don't believe that it would have undermined her ability to consent (or otherwise).

I sought the views of people here becasue I honestly didnt think I was being unreasonable. I was seeking validation of my arguments and any nuggets that I might have used to convince my wife that she was being unreasonable. I know that was wrong but it didn't feel it at the time but when I thought about it (and the same goes for the op I'm sure) who would want to coerce someone (their own wife) into having sex. Encouragement - yes. Coersion - no.

Give the guy a break.

Jan45 · 28/11/2013 16:22

XXed: the OPs wife I bet doesn't think he's flawed, she has two kiddies now with him, I don't think he's flawed either - misguided, ill informed and selfish yes - which HE HAS admitted to and will endeavour to rectify.

I doubt his wife sees him as dangerous either, FGS....Hmm

Andy1964 · 28/11/2013 16:26

I've seen this type of response from posters on here many times.
It's not helpful and it makes you all look like manhaters who are never satisfied with thier men. Maybe that's why so many posts in here are about women who snoop on their husbands, want to leave their husbands, dont trust their husbands...I could go on and on.
Some of you really dont come across well at all on an internet forum;

"It's being a selfish fucking wanker whose response to his wife's birth injury is to wonder what other functional part of his wife's body she can continue to use to pleasure him."

"I sorry but you sound like a selfish prick!"

"So what if your fanjo is injured and you don't feel like sex, you still have a mouth and hands don't you?"

"Awww poor ickle man with his high sex-drive and only two free hands.
Such a shame that humankind need sperm from men for the species not to die out.
It is about time that evolution evolve a female brain in every male head."

FWIW, if my DW is feeling horny and I'm not and she asks me for some relief I do oblige. On many occasions even after having the snip so for some of you that argument just does not wash.

Jan45 · 28/11/2013 16:29

Andy, I don't always agree with your views and that's fine but I agree, all this, wanker, fanjo, selfish prick.....just reads like a five year old writing down naughty words, just to get a reaction....Confused.

Anyway, I'm now leaving the playground to go join the bigger kids.

TheXxed · 28/11/2013 16:29

Instead of accepting that she does not want a sexual relationship at the moment he is instead soliciting opinions which in best case scenario for him would concur with his opinion.

Why? So he can go back and ask again. NO is a full sentence she said no. So why is he looking for ways to undermine her.

Offred · 28/11/2013 16:30

Can we please call it out for what it is. Simply pressuring a woman to provide sexual services when she has said no and doesn't want to is sexually abusive behaviour.

What he is doing right now is behaving sexually abusively towards his wife. He has not committed any crime, but it is a form of domestic abuse.

Just because it is culturally fairly normal and acceptable doesn't change the fact that it is sexually abusive behaviour.

A decent person who respected their partner would realise that is what it is.

The op thinks he is being a bit selfish. He has not thought about or accepted the idea that this is a totally unacceptable way to approach a sexual/intimate relationship.

working9while5 · 28/11/2013 16:32

Having the snip is an outpatient procedure Andy. Most men I know are out drinking and back playing sports within days. Birth trauma and prolapse are a little more involved. Prolapse in particular has associated incontinence issues. It's bloody soul destroying being incontinent and deeply challenging to your sense of self as a sexual being (and I have very very mild issues and no psychological birth trauma, happened after a beautiful birth for me).

My man sitting here beside me assumed OP was trolling as he was being so unreasonable. I guess he hates men too?

Offred · 28/11/2013 16:35

I'm very satisfied with my current man btw and it isn't specifically a gendered issue to me. It is about dangerous and toxic attitudes to sexual relationships. Where it becomes gendered is that society is preoccupied with controlling women's rather than men's sexuality and it is women's bodies which are normally and casually expected to be used to service the sexual 'needs' of men.

Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 16:36

I'm speechless.

Jan45, I'm coming with.

TheXxed · 28/11/2013 16:38

offred yes yes yes and yes to everything you have posted.

TheXxed · 28/11/2013 16:39

contrarian you are not speechless you just don't have a comeback.

working9while5 · 28/11/2013 16:39

Here Contrarian, take a Biscuit on your way.

HavantGuard · 28/11/2013 16:42

Now look what you've done with your opinions. You've scared people away with your notions of bodily autonomy and mutual respect. You should all be thoroughly ashamed of yourselves.

Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 16:42

It's not about having a "comeback" it's about being able to conduct reasoned and sensible debate. My views have altered as a result of some of what I've read on this forum (though not this thread).

That said, I do know when I'm flogging a dead horse. The op has conceded he's in the wrong for all you feminists out there that's surely a small victory but instead of congratualting yourselves (and him) on a job well done, you continue to spout all sorts of nonsense - and in doing so undermine many of your own arguments.

Offred · 28/11/2013 16:44

He hasn't understood what is wrong about what he is doing/thinking though contrarian. He thinks he has been a bit selfish.

bobbywash · 28/11/2013 16:46

I'm appalled reading some of this absolute rubbish.

Some of the advice is sound, and is what was asked for advice, some if it is just an excuse for general agenda comments.

By parents for parents, is the slogan of this site one parent is asking, he's given an answer and then some people who to paraphrase good will hunting:-

"you presume to know everything about me because you saw a post of mine and you ripped my fuckin’ life apart"

get a grip, you really have no idea at all

working9while5 · 28/11/2013 16:48

A job well done!!!!

You really are hilarious Contrarian. Plenty of men would see this behaviour as being unreasonable. The thread isn't flogging the OP but challenging the ongoing defence of the situation. Not sure why it's about 'feminism': it's about basic respect for a partner who is physically suffering, regardless of gender.

Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 16:48

Let's not presume to know what the op is thinking. He has been selfish. I think he acknowledged that. He mentioned it to his wife twice in a period of a few months, yet is being made out to be some sort of serial abuser. We just ought to get some perspective.

Contrarian78 · 28/11/2013 16:52

".......plenty of men would see this behaviour as being unreasonable."

and plenty of women wouldn't.

The thing is, you maintain it's not about flogging the OP, but I haven't seen anyone here continue to defending "the situation". All you're really doing is preaching to the converted.

Cheerymum · 28/11/2013 16:54

OP I think you sound like a very caring husband, who hadn't appreciated things from her point of view and have had that put right. I don't think you are horrendously selfish.
I second advice to keep pulling your weight on the domestic front and keep complimenting her on how she is doing. Talk to your wife, apologise for the previous sexual requests, say clearly you would like her to have cuddles/hand holding/ massage/ whatever physical contact she would enjoy without worrying you will interpret it as a signal to start sex, and that you will wait for her to initiate sexual contact whenever she feels ready.

IME (nearly 3 year old, birth injury after her, and now 10 week old twins) the fact my husband puts no pressure at all (doesn't mention it unless I bring it up) makes him much sexier to me. I know it's an important facet of our relationship which needs getting back on track in the medium term, and your wife will know this too.

I raise the topic at least to discuss our expectations once in a while because I want my husband to know its something I value too and I don't want him to feel this status quo is for ever more, and I initiate things on the rare occasions I feel up to it. I could frankly give it a complete miss on a physical level for the foreseeable, but the lack of pressure is by far the best tool to get back towards normality (no pun intended!)

Took us about a year last time to get back to something approaching normal (I had a surgical repair at 6 months). FWIW "servicing" her partner with an unpleasureable (for her) hand or blow job would also reinforce her likely despondency about her own body to being currently "broken" in this regard. So as others have suggested DIY for now.