Putting 2+2 together and coming up with ....?

[Imonlydreaming]

I can't actually believe that I am typing this but I am getting myself in a real tizz about this situation.
My DH has recently begun working a bit further from home and pretty soon after that he started to "stay over" first in hotels, and now in a work colleagues house. (A man if that makes a difference) 2-3 times a week.

The other day our phones were on the side and one of them went off - he said was it yours - not actually asking me to look at his but I did and he had a text that said "I love you xxxxxxxxx" - not from me.
He got up and came over when he saw me open his phone and said straightaway - I used to work with her. Then told me a story about another friend who'd done the same to him. I thought it was strange, but people do make mistakes like that don't they?

After that his phone has had a pass code on - which he told me was because someone at work had taken his phone and left it in a communal area - possibly as a joke. Perfectly plausible of the place he works at.

Today he was having trouble with the signal on his phone and I asked if I could have the number where he's staying and he said that his own mobile would work there. Not actually refusing to give it to me - said he'd do it later (but hasn't).

Well of course the reason I'm writing this down is that I'm suspicious - we haven't exactly been that physical recently - but with 2 toddlers who don't sleep through and lots of illness and other family issues/ illness it's just been a bad time.

Am I reading between the lines and seeing an issue that isn't there? I know that a bunch of strangers on the Internet can't tell me the answers. I just know I couldn't talk to anyone in RL and to ask him would open a can of worms - that I'm just not ready to face.

Thanks for reading.

Try and see him from the position of a detached observer, if you can, for a few minutes. I know from experience how hard this is. Look at it from his viewpoint.

He knows he is in the shit and that you are not rolling over too easily. He is surprised, in shock and wrong footed.

He knows that he has been sleeping with her for a while, or worse. He has borrowed money to finance this double life, on the basis that you can't date and spend like a single person and support young twins.

He knows that the financial information you want will incriminate him further.

In my view, there will be a number of further attempts to spin you. Ie emails, letters, maybe each revealing a little more, or focusing on telling you how much he misses you whilst telling nothing.

I think your only option is to tell him not to contact you at all unless he plans to tell the full truth and hand over bank statements.

When I was dealing with my own H's infidelity two years ago, I had MN posters foaming at the mouth due to my silly view that I could coax honesty out of him with the gently gently approach. Sadly they were right and although he gave me a bullshit version, it took a further 18 months for me to get the rest, after a further split.

What happens if you move to fast to the believing or accepting half truth stage is a period of hysterical bonding and him on good behaviour, followed by a long and sorry time where he considers the subject closed and you continue to puzzle out and obsess on the inconsistencies in the story. Increasingly you notice crappy personality traits to which you had been hitherto blind.

It is no way to live, and comes to grief down the line.

As for today, it would be best to call a friend I think. Failing that, go to a spa or get a massage- anything to make you feel more human in this troubling time. So sorry.

And please force him to take them out next time. The last thing you need is to be walking the streets at the moment, I'm your exhausted state.

Anyway, a morning at a soft play or a trip to the park would be good for the twins and tire them out nicely.

please just remember that the posters on here are real women and genuinely wishing you the best

and for every one who posts, there are many others who lurk and wish you well.

I have just read the whole thread.....

Dreaming.......you have come SO far from the start of this thread. You have been so strong and dignified throughout. You sound such a great mum and a lovely woman. Look how far you've come in the space of a few (hellish) weeks. It's important you recognise that and feel proud because its an indication that you WILL be ok. I know (from experience) how painful this is.
I know how hard these early days are without your young dc's while they see daddy. People used to say "use it to relax etc" to me but I couldn't. It honestly gets better. I hope your return to work goes ok (teacher here too). Make sure you do tell your head and closest work mates....it's really helped me.
Best and warmest wishes.......I'm right behind you x

Good morning Dreaming

His nerve at suggesting you were taking things to the brink by talking to friends. Calmly referring to the "conversation" he thought would never happen. You really took the wind out of his sails but now he's regrouping.

He almost acts as though the matter of the secret loan and hidden plans for the bonus were somehow trifles or a fait accompli and none of your business. Pregnancy or deposit for a place together or investment in some venture with OW, you have to steel yourself.

I am sorry if BF is falling for his persuasion and has begun pushing for reconciliation. As has been said already surround yourself with allies. Be cautious disclosing tactics (sorry that sounds cloak and dagger) with anyone you're not paying to give professional assistance.

Dreaming it seems very likely H will see counselling as a platform from which to spout his version of events, thinking a third party will somehow lend his spiel credibility.

Your DCs are a little older than I realised. They are still so small. Stupid, stupid selfish daddy.

You have many many of us (hundreds? thousands?) feeling for you and wishing you well. Many of us know first hand how shit this is.

From my experience the only way you can reduce the pain in the longer term is

1. No contact (except minimal emails re DC)
2. Solicitor
3. Divorce
4. Remember that living well is the best revenge

Anything else just prolongs your suffering.

Little by little (it may take years) you will begin to realise the sort of person your husband is.

From what you have told us here he is certainly not someone it would be a good idea to have any sort of relationship with.

Fuck Me! He's really scared to death about what information you'll ask him, isn't he?

He's terrified of having his bodylanguage give away the fact he's lying through his teeth, withholding and being stingy with the truth.

Tell him to shove his letter, or better, write to himself to tell himself what a twat he is. It'll save you having to do so.

Bless you. Can you go to the cinema? I find it's a good way to kill a few hours if I'm on my own at a loose end. Next time make him take the kids out for the day, your dd will probably be happier with that too, more like something to look forward to rather than you just going out and leaving her at home.

The purpose of his letter will just be to make him look and feel noble, to feed the drama (with our hero at the centre) and keep you engaged.

dreaming

A small point. In about 2 or 3 days, this thread is going to hit its max and be closed to new posts. (Just a numbers of posts thing.) It might be a good idea for you to start a new thread (linking to this one) before that happens so that you aren't caught in mid discussion or something.

Hope you've got yourself round a coffee and a nice croissant in a cafe!

and for every one who posts, there are many others who lurk and wish you well.

I'm one of those lurkers who have been watching this thread from the beginning and willing you strength to cope with what you're going through. You have been so dignified, so strong, so undramatic about it all. I'm SO sorry you're going through this. There has been some fantastic advice given here. This thread is what Mumsnet is all about, women supporting women.

This too shall pass, and in a few years time you'll be one of those women who tells someone else going through it that they'll be happy at the other end. You'll get there. I wish you nothing but good.

sweetheart, make this the last time you are forced to leave your own house and walk the streets to facilitate this twat's contact with his own dc

from now, on, he takes them out and establishes the zoo/soft play/McDonald's Daddy relationship he so clearly wanted by dint of his actions so far

I'm getting a bit worried you haven't planned to seek legal advice, you must please do this, I fear the covering of tracks may well have begun. Obviously you want to read the letter but its going to be lies and trickery to get inside your head. You need to get the truth now with or without his assistance. The computer needs scanning by a professional. Once legal advice is sought is start asking his friends colleagues what they know, see if someone slips up.
Please don't trust him he's lying to you and clearly not prepared to tell the truth yet.

And I agree with other posters, sitting in your house with the DC is too easy that's not spending proper time with them he must take them out! Make it harder for him!!

Seconding all the last few posts. Especially that you need to tell him to make his own arrangements for contact... and you need to find out what the hell has been going on financially, and to seek legal advice.

I'm afraid he doesn't really sound like someone trying desperately to win you back. He sounds like someone scrambling to get his ducks in a row so he can cover his own backside as much as possible, financially and socially. I'm so sorry to be that brutal, but you sound such a truly decent, honourable person, and to one who is anything but that leaves you wide open to exploitation. Please, please seek legal advice asap. And get the computer seen to as a couple of the posters more knowledgeable on the subject have advised. You are so in the dark, and he is deliberately keeping you that way.

I hope you are back home now with your children and you take AF's advice. Don't do anything that makes life easier for him. He has and deserves no consideration at all.

You need to get yourself into gear with legal stuff as the longer you wait the more chance he has to shaft you and your children financially.

Hope he has no access to the computer right now.

I agree with Triggles' post wrt let him shove 'what he wants you to know' up where the sun doesn't shine, and to focus only on the money.
The loan you know about was taken out to pay cc bills?
How many?
How much debt on the ccs?
What expenses is he talking about?
What is that figure?

As soon as you can, do a credit check on him.

And please make sure he can't get at the computer.

I agree also that he needs to take the DTs out of the house for any future visit.

You should not let him spend any time under your roof with them where he can go through your stuff or hide/destroy important information.

I suspect the cc statements would in themselves be quite revealing re the OW. Eg whether he took her out a lot, gifts, whether any so called work trips were in fact love-ins in Brighton kind if thing.

I think that is why he is secretive with them.

I think they need to be accessed sooner rather than later. When I found out H had moved credit cards a couple of times over the period, so maddeningly I have never been able to access them. Your H could easily effect a similar trick if he thought of it.

God why is this just so so hard?
I'm falling apart
He was here when I got back and the tears that have been threatening all day came
He told me that he'd loved being with the DCs but it was horrible (meaning not being with me as well) I just said good - I've not exactly had a brilliant day either
Then he launched into me - how it's "our" fault because of this that and the other - so so angry and of course making me cry
We ended up having a row basically where I told him I would not b held on anyway responsible for the fact that he chose to have an affair
I was also right about my best friend amongst other things the were said shouted it transpires that she's been texting to check he's ok - not one word to me and that really hurts
I've had to let him stay for a bit I was such a mess that I've hidden upstairs away from the children so they don't see me like this again

Dear Goodness. What an absolute shit.

Is he still there??

I'm sorry for the outburst, dreaming but I'm very angry.

Not one word more to your so-called friend either. Is there anyone else you can talk to fairly soon?

But it is true he is being a compete shit - he's so full of self pity it's almost laughable
I told him that he didn't need to bother telling me about OW as he obviously was never going to tell me the truth
That got his back up too because he's been composing his letter a fabricated story to placate me

The reason it hurts so so much?
my DH would never have spoken to me like this - but this man who lies and lies and treats me with contempt he's replaced him and I'm beginning to hate this version

He's a completely worthless shit. He left you for half the week to look after very young TWINS, for crying out loud! My God, caring for a small child alone - no adult company at all for 48 hr stretches - is hell on wheels, yet you have had to cope with TWINS, one with health issues, because their worthless cock of a father wasn't man enough to do his job and be a real parent to them. And he was spending FAMILY money on shacking up with his mistress half the week while YOU cared for his children! Where was your attention, love and support? Who was giving you emotional nurture, to replace all you were pouring into your babies? Nobody, that's who, because Mr Entitled couldn't be doing with actual reciprocity, could he now.

Dreaming, I am so sorry. Please, please get him the hell out of your home and then see a solicitor, because he has amply demonstrated that he is not one scrap interested in your welfare, nor your children's, and you need to protect them and yourself now. And I would insist that from now onwards contact is organised via a contact centre, so you don't have to see him at all, as he has behaved so atrociously to you today.

He wants to make this your fault so he can feel good about what he has done. Quite what depths of moral degradation it takes to do that I can't begin to understand, but NONE of this - NONE OF IT - is your doing, fault or responsibility, and his efforts to shuffle his choices into yours is just the final straw. He does not deserve you, and I can't imagine he ever did.

And your so-called BF is an arse. Dump her. Life is too damn short for that. Frankly, they sound about good enough to befriend one another.

Oh Dreaming, I'm so very very sorry you're having to go through this

If he hasn't already, tell the bastard to leave, now. You don't want him there upsetting you anymore.

He's on the defence, and lashing out. Unfortunately you're now beginning to see the real him, and it's horrifying for you.

You aren't alone, we are all here to support you every step of the way.

He is a total shit.

You are NOT responsible for his decision to lie and cheat.

Also, your so called bf- she is getting a high from the drama. Really. Some people do this, sadly, as it makes them feel important to cast themselves as advisors and central to the "story". She doesn't actually care about either of you as much as she says she does. If this happened to my bf I would be taking her washing, entertaining the kids at the park, a bit if shopping and a few ready meals, not fucking off and gossiping unhelpfully.

You need to see a solicitor immediately - and I think (subject to your actual hours) that you might be able to go at the end of the school day if you need to. I'm talking tomorrow or Tuesday at the latest.

It may seem like an impossibly huge step but trust me, it's not. Once you're actually sitting there across the desk from them, it will just be an inevitability. You absolutely have to have someone in your corner in real life.