Update on EA

[faulkernegger]

I posted some weeks ago about DP's suspicious friendship, and even though we have talked about it (I've said I feel uncomfortable, children have noticed etc) it's still going on.
He has been attentive and loving, and when I asked if we were ok he looked me in the eye and said 'yes'. However, a few evenings ago about 11pm he took his phone into the loo. When he came out I challenged him - why on earth do you need to take your phone into the loo at 11 o'clock at night? to which he replied - I had it in my pocket on the way upstairs. Well he didn't - it had been on the bedside table. So I said - you;re not telling me the truth and I want you to think about why you're not telling the truth.
A couple of days later he took me aside and said he'd made a decision to step back from this woman, because I clearly thought that 'something' was going on. I felt so relieved.
But, having a gnawing feeling still, I did some checking on his mobile phone bill online ( about the only thing he's forgotten to change his password for) and he seems to have called her more often and for longer, since that conversation!

What do I do now? confront again and ask exactly HOW this is stepping back? or, as my sister says, back off, be sweetness and light and give him more time to end it.
I have been for an initial assessment at Relate to see of there's anything I can do about 'me' that will help the relationship, but I feel there's no point if his mind is elsewhere.
Help!

Not sure that it's karma, but it's definitely good timing- get all these issues sorted out while your partner is there to make a practical and financial contribution. Might be worth making sure everything in the house is shipshape while you are considering your options.

Sorry , that sounds really cynical. Guess I've read too many posts on here from women who've been left with major maintenance or half-completed work on a house after a separation, and it creates a big financial headache at the worst possible time.

Glad to see you are feeling better today :)

Hey Faulk/Dusk. How great to see you posting on Abney's thread.Well done you. < shit, hope that didn't sound condescing > :)

maras - thanks. It's comforting in a bizarre way to know other people are going through it too, and also to stand on the outside and be objective.

Faulk, when you look at others threads and see clearly that an affair is ongoing and that OP is in denial, it can be very uncomfortable to see that others said the same on your thread. ( been there, done that!)

How are things going Faulk? Did he agree to more counselling? Is he still doing the lessons?

This is the most depressing thread I have read in a while (sorry OP).

Your partner chose to have an emotional affair.

He has not admitted guilt let alone apologisedl; he has done nothing to make amends including the most obvious thing (cancelling lessons) despite how much he knows this is hurting the OP.

OP - I know it's easy to sit behind a computer when it isn't your own life but what on earth are you still doing with this man?

He's putting a kid's music lessons above his partner. Please, please, please stop burying your head in the sand.

Have just been trying to console ds (9) who is in floods of tears in his bed saying that he doesn't want his mummy and daddy to split up. Apparently we are always arguing (we're not, but that's how he sees it).
This was brought on by dp speaking harshly to him about doing his homework. I had a go at dp for being over the top ('who's the adult here?') but when he tried to make it up to ds, he got rejected. Ds now saying ' he's not my dad, he's a stranger who shouts at me'. When I said this to dp, he did his now usual 'huff' and said ' bloody ridiculous'.
What the hell do I do now?
taking - he has admitted guilt and he has apologised in counselling last week. keep up.
My head is not in the sand. I know what he's doing. if it depresses you, stop reading. I choose not to explain myself.

Hi dusk, it sounds like you're having a really tough time. Do you generally feel you have to be a peacemaker or translator between your DH and his son? Why? What happens it you don't? Is this related to the stress of the affair?

Why, considering the altercation was between DS and Dh, were you involved at all? was it front of DS, presumably?

I understand it's very painful to hear your boy talk that way. But all kids do feel this and worry about this stuff and all kids have altercations with a parent about homework. Your DS will have some idea there is something going on and he will be manipulating and frightened and trying to work out what's going on.

What do you want to do now? Do you feel like this particular situation is yours to resolve? Why?

He didn't admit it Faulk because he refuses to call it what it is, a emotional affair, and he refuses to stop the lessons.

His lips are moving but it's just hot air coming out.

Your ds is picking up on the atmosphere. Children are very sensitive to emotions. Remember, your ds was aware of the affair before you were. He was the one who told you about it.

I work with children in school and one of the things that comes up time and time again is parental separation. The separation itself is not the most difficult time for the child.

The time that they find hardest to cope with is the time leading up to the separation. This is a time of high anxiety, great stress and emotional upheaval.

The child is so uncertain of each day, they live in a kind of limbo, just trying not to rock the boat or do anything that might tip the fragile balance of their parents' relationship. Of course, it's nothing to do with the child but they don't know that.

The longer this phase lasts, the harder it is for the child. They are often unsettled at school, become withdrawn, or tearful, or possibly act out their anxieties in unwanted behaviour. It's all a normal reaction.

Once the parents separate, the child starts to settle down again, especially if routines are put into place fairly quickly. One of the parents moves out of the family home and the atmosphere clears almost instantly. The child can relax because the tension is broken. Even if it's not what the child would have chosen, sometimes, quite often in fact, separation of the parents is the best choice for the wellbeing of the child.

Anyway, I'm only telling you this in case you aren't aware of how a long, drawn out affair like this can affect the children.

tessa you're right, I do feel that I have to act as peacemaker. I can't bear to see my ds being shouted at, and then running upstairs in hysterics. It breaks my heart.I feel that he's being picked on/bullied by his dad and want to defend him. Maybe I should just stand back and tell them to sort it out between them.
It's calmer now. DP and I have had a talk about homework and what to do and he has agreed to try not to shout. He wishes that he'd done more homework as a child, and then maybe he wouldn't have been a musician, who now has fewer gigs and more teaching, which he resents.
Fairenuff - message received and understood

Hi inthedusk. Sorry your DS was so upset.

How is your P as a father in general?

Noticed that when you spoke to DP about his treatment of DS he wasa dismissive at first, thrn gave an explanation for his shouting/harsh speaking that was focused on himself and his resentment of his personal situation (teaching / income). Similar to his dismissiveness and script about his disatisfaction with his life / you. He isn't taking responsibility for his actions.

I must say I agree with faire about atmosphere and about tension. Most people describe this as the most damaging period.

But this does NOT mean you need to just avoid conflict and tension. you just need to have it with your DH and not use your son as some sort of buffer or emotional conduit.

If you have problems with how your DH speaks to your son generally you need to address that with him. it is punishing for your DS to keep this until he is there and then make it a pubic event. There is nothing that will make your DS feel more guilty or like he is to blame for the relationship breakdown, whereas in fact it is all his father.

I think you need to think seriously about why you think it is your problem that your DH and DS had a set to. Of course I understand the basics of family dynamics but your plaintive cry of 'what do I do now?' really suggest like you are the only person in charge of resolving all this.

Firstly, look at your DH and why you feel the need to 'protect' your DS from him. If you really feel this then you have bigger issues than even what you've expressed here. Does he really pick on him? Why? What's going on there? Is it connected to the affair? Has it always been a dynamic?

Secondly, look at your own peacemaking urges, where they come from and how they can actually be damaging. There's no doubt it would be better for the two of them to resolve it between themselves if possible, for both of their development and learning about conflict, and definitely for your son's feelings of responsiblity towards your marriage. In fact your urge to keep the peace, here and, dare I say, in regard to not causing too much trouble over these music lessons, suggest a controlling, anxious or conflict-averse sensibility which might be much much more damaging in the long run and certainly damaging and exhausting for you.

If you feel your P is too hard your DS you shouldn't leave them to it, but support your DS.

Forgive me, loopy, of course in principle you're right. But this is a situation rife with an affair already that the child knows about. I'm afraid, hard as it is, the best course of action is to speak privately about what's happened, and get the aggressive parent to apologise or correct their behaviour. If a mother steps in to chastise the partner then the situation is fuelled, not calmed, and the child has very real and lasting feelings of being in the centre of and partly responsible for the breakdown and verbal violence.

he has agreed to try not to shout

try?

Not, he has agreed not to shout.

You know, when people say they will 'try', what they mean is I am not giving you any guarantees, I reserve the right to do it anyway.

This man has serious control issues.

this does NOT mean you need to just avoid conflict and tension

You might be able to avoid conflict, but you won't be able to avoid tension. In fact, ignoring conflict leads to more tension. There is a whacking great elephant in your living room Faulk and your ds can see it.

I'm sure you are taking this on board and having a bit of a rethink.

Btw, where are you at with counselling? You going on your own, together or not at all?

loopy I do feel he is too hard on him - I don't think he's aware how scary his temper is. DP did apologise to ds, but also tried to justify it with 'I'm trying to help you not make the same mistakes as me'

Please don't let this all get swept under the carpet, Faulk. It's clear it's causing huge tension and problems. Pushing it further down makes it much much worse, not better. I grew up in an environment like this. With an unhappy mother and a never resolved tension. It is the worst of all worlds.

I understand that the explanation for his shouting behaviour is winning in the moment for its teary, vulnerable, childhood-based honesty, but it seems incredibly narcissistic from the outside: "Maybe I shouldn't have shouted at him about homework and made him feel incredibly upset and vulnerable in this awful time when I've betrayed you and the family, but really it's all about me and the fact that I should have done more homework and then maybe I wouldn't feel a professional failure who feels the need to have a harem of women around my work adoring me to prop up my disappointed ego. Stupid son'.

Please continue with counseling. It feels at the moment like you are in a relationship with someone very entitled that you are going to 'manage' until one or both of you die.

Are you scared of his temper, OP?

See what you're saying tessa.

Don't think you've mentioned his temper before, inthedusk

He insists on continuing to teach OW's son (and doesn't shout at him!) yet isn't so great with his own at the moment.

Do you think it would be ok to write to the school and say there's tension at home, in case ds is upset/acts out? I don't think he'd want anyone to talk to him about it.
Should DP and I try to act 'normal' in front of dcs, or at least not disagree?

I wouldn't write. I'd go in to see them.

A poster wrote on 13th September:

"I also have a vague memory of an earlier thread where you disclosed your children were getting very concerned and scared about their father's attachment to this other family. I think you might be putting your head in the sand about their internal conflicts too."

and you rejected what she had to say.

I just can't understand why you are letting this all happen. It must be quite horrible to be a child in your house and it must be quite horrible for you too.

Please do something.

I'm sorry to pop up again with an echo, but it fits. At this stage, but before he would admit, the youngest two were very anxious, and the reason I went for it was partly because my 15 year old was acting out and demanding that " I didn't let him treat me like shit".

I truly thought she/they weren't aware. I thought that she saw me as a strong person. I was wrong. They see more than you expect.

All you need to do is burst the bubble. Give him an ultimatum, namely stop teaching her child and resume relate, or he can walk.

You will sooner or later, I promise. One day you will snap over maybe some small unrelated issue, as I did, and it will happen. It would help the kids ( and you) to hurry it along.

Meanwhile at least well done to avoid the Stepford wife routine! I can see you are trying.