Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships:22

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Alice do you have support in RL or anyone you can trust? He's deliberately trying to make things difficult with buying chocolates, it gives him the chance to be like "I'm trying to be loving I made an effort an brought you chocolates" when really it's jus to put you in a difficult situation by tempting you

oh alice thats awful and yet unfortunately so familiar. hope your dc was ok. know what you mean about acting out aggression as well.

so, had the chat with fw. unfortunately he is not agreeing to leave the house voluntarily. he seems to grasp on some level the damage he has done and wants to work on things. he is going to get help apparantly.

not sure how i feel now or what next step is. even though i hate the way he has been and know he probably wont change i feel like i have to try as unfortunately i still feel somethingfor him. dont know whats best really but i know he is def scared of police and knows if he dares anything again he will be prosecuted and lose his job which he doesnt want.

have set some boundaries lets see if he sticks to them. aaargh i do feel like screaming as i feel trapped and know i dont have the strength at the moment to deal with the big legal stuff right now.

yummytummy I don't feel like I have the strength either, but unfortunately I think for my own health and the safety of the children, I'm going to have to simply find the strength. If that means going to a solicitor with 2 noisy children in tow, then that's what I'll have to do.

He's working this evening and tomorrow during the day. I think the best time to discuss it with him is tomorrow just after he finishes work and have him ring MIL to come pick him up. Feel all hyperventy, and not sure I can do this. I keep reminding myself that I cannot live like this, I cannot live like this.

Aw yummy could you maybe try an use this situation to be very clear about boundaries and tell him it's one more chance and if his toe crosses the line thenyou will go to the police ect.. I'm sorry i don't think it's good advice and I don't know your situation x

alice My FW was also like that. Cooking me big portions when I'd asked him not to. Making me huge packed lunches for work when I'd asked him not to. If I'd even ask what he was cooking for dinner he'd say 'surprise'. He said he wanted to cook dinner, I'd ask him to do a weightwatchers meal, he'd say I was fussy and ungrateful. Oh and buying me chocolates so i wasn't depriving myself. Grrrr.

In the end I said I'd sort all my own food - he carried on cooking anyway, knowing I hate waste - if he stuck it in front of me I'd eat it anyway. Or he'd cook twice as much as he wanted and say would i like some, otherwise it would go in the bin.

So I stopped eating anything he'd cooked. Said that I'd asked him not to, and put it in the bin. He was fuming but had no right.

Don't stand for it. Don't see this as a battle against your weight, see it as a battle against him. Put the chocolate in the bin, and say that you asked him not to. Sneak some later if you want lols...

pony I've tried to work out time and time again whether or not FW does it on purpose, or is even aware that he's doing it. I've decided it's wasted energy trying to work it out. It doesn't matter - they do it and that's what matters.

alice sorry just spotted you're thinking of splitting up with him in the very near future. Whether or not the chocolate goes in the bin is probably the least of your worries! Good luck -once he's gone you'll regain control over what you eat.

Noregrets - you are right, it doesn't really matter why they do it at all.

Alice - you are a fantastically brave woman in a horribly difficult situation, with an abusive husband and two lovely DCs (one with SNs), who are both in the situation too. I am cheering you on to speak to him tomorrow and get him out. For your own sanity.
If you need to chat to someone, I could PM you my number?

pony, that's fantastic about ds1. Think FW probably did him a favour in the long run by leaving his life so completely, despite how horrible and cruel it was at the time.

yummy - you had the talk! That's a great start, well done you. A very important baby step. (I'm not surprised the legal stuff looks overwhelming. That's a whole series of baby steps for another time!) You DO NOT owe him another chance just because he might try - whatever he might say. And feeling something for him isn't a reason to stay trapped, either. Is leaving the house an option for you?

Alice, good luck for tomorrow's talk. I have my rolling pin at the ready! :o Hope he goes quietly - what will you do if he doesn't? Do you have rl support for the first few days afterwards? Maybe take the chocolates to school gate and share them out to build a quick support network! sorry completely facetious

Noregrets, reading through your description of your FW and food, it seemed similar to how my FW is with my wish for a separation. I said, "I'd like a separation," and he has cooked up a perfect marriage, with a side of attentive care of the dcs. On the surface, it looks so loving, but there is the small problem of ignoring what we said and wanted. And giving us something that's bad for us in the long term!

I'm still feeling churned up about the email from FW's sister. I looked back at sent emails in March when I first split up with him and see that I emailed his dps (they asked for more information, what was going through my head) a bit of a torrent of examples of what was wrong with our relationship and must've at the last moment decided to cc his sisters. They talk through all crises as a family, seemed like a good idea at the time. So easy to cc, isn't it, and it doesn't feel anything like writing a long letter three times to three different recipients. I'm cross with myself for doing that - airing my dirty laundry. I know at the time I didn't really understand what Leclerc was saying about maintaining a dignified silence.

Oh well. Putting the stick down and moving on. That was me two months ago. Today we have been playing happy families and I feel rather that I'm overplaying the problem and I'm just not cut out for relationships. Whatever. Soon I won't be in one so I won't need to worry!!

pony He'll be home soon, so I can't talk on the phone at this point. Thank you though. He's started asking who is texting me lately when friends text as well. I actually was told by a friend the other day that she was worried about texting me and what to say as she was worried he might read my texts! It was a bit of an eye opener tbh.

Charlotte I know what you mean about the family stuff. H's family will be a difficult thing - his mum will be very hurt, as she tends to overlook some of his behaviour (although she has bollocked him for some of it too). But she is older and I understand that this is difficult for her. His sister will be livid and won't believe he could behave this way. She doesn't like me anyway and this will just be more ammo to blast me with - not that I intend to be anywhere near her to hear it.

H tends to say over and over "i'm working on it" and "i'm sorry" and "i'll try harder" but he just doesn't. There's just no point in going over it over and over again IMO. He's not going to change - I mean, why should he? He doesn't believe I'll ever separate from him, as I've just taken it so far. And I suspect he thinks I wouldn't want to have to deal with the children alone (very hard work due to SNs), but actually they're much easier to deal with when he is not here, due to less anxieties, less upset, less shouting, less winding up. He doesn't realise it, because, well, he's not here then.

I think he will go quietly eventually, after a huge flare up blaming me and saying I never really meant to give him a chance to change anyway. I keep telling him that regardless of having depression and stress, that doesn't excuse treating your family like shit. If it was anger management or severe depression, he'd be getting in trouble at work or shouting at everyone else as well. He's not. Just us.. at home... alone. Except for recently when he's spilled over into a few embarrassing scenes in front of others. (which of course is all my fault or the children's fault) He's either slipping a bit or getting too confident that he has us where he wants us.

I have a couple friends locally that are brilliant - one has just gotten out of a very similar situation and the other is so incredibly supportive. I just am very aware that they both have children (and the one has a DH as well) and I don't want to infringe on their time too much.

Alice I, too, have rolling pin at hand for tomorrow.

Charlotte I've just looked back for your post on email from FW's sister, I think that would bother me too. I bet them saying you've been abusive has made you totally over analyse everything that you've done. But I honestly don't agree. It sounds like his parents would have forwarded it onto his sisters anyway, so that's not the issue. You told them what he was like, because they'd asked for more information. it's up to you whether his family takes that on board or not. i'm also no good at dignified silences - once I start talking it all tends to flood out.

Did I see you say that you planned on sending a brief response just saying you weren't defending yourself to them? It sounded good to me. Distance yourself - they're really not your problem.

I will point out that the "I'm sorry" is the small child "I've been called on the carpet by mum and told to say I'm sorry" one. He's not REALLY sorry, just irritated that I've called him on the behaviour and demanded a response. Very sulky and defensive. And means nothing IMO.

arth

Alice I had that situation as well, my good friends never texted anything contentious because they knew he was watching. It's no way to live.

Charlotte - forget any allegiances you may or may not have had with his family - it'll all change anyway, and they will all side with him, so no matter what you do/how reasonably you put yourself across you it wont matter a jot in their eyes. So save yourself the trouble! But I know it's hard to see that now. But do steel yourself.

Not much to add tonight but have been catching up on the thread and sending support and strength to all who need it.

It's been a bit of a rubbish week here with nsdh dropping lots of comments into our conversations about what his life will be like without me ie how he'll have a new family; how lots of his friends won't even really remember who I am . Lots of fuckwittery, made even more so because he just won't leave.

With the counsellor, I'm trying to work out why it's important to me that I'm not seen as the instigator of the split. I think partly it's because it seems unfair when he is being so objectionable and constantly (and consistently) undermining. Ultimately, though, if I have to leave then that's what I need to do. My dsis reminded me that I'd given myself a deadline of the summer. I really need to make a lawyer's appointment.

Anyway, sorry I'm rubbish at offering any valuable contributions just now. It seems all my energy is focused on daily living at the mo. I'm sure it will pick up.

tether are you me????

That sounds soooo like me before I left, I really did have to double check there. FW to DS1: 'You'll have a new Stepdad soon'. FW to newborn DS2: 'Who's your real daddy? Who will be your new stepdaddy?' spot the theme?

Don't worry, daily living is haaaard work. Save your energy. And eat dirty wotsits. (Are you doing fast-days too? Don't make one a Saturday, fgs! Mine are Monday and Friday.)

Yeah, looks like you're right, pony. I got on quite well with both sisters and one has dcs the same age as ours, so lots in common... I feel really bad for putting this huge thing into their busy lives for them to deal with. They don't feel nearly as bad for me for living with it in secret for 12 years, though. I have probably always griped a little about FW to them, tbh. From sheer loneliness and confusion. They were good listening ears. It's all changed, as you say.

winnie I totally get the wanting to not be seen as the instigator of the split thing. I'm struggling with this too. But am slowly coming to the realisation that if I want the split to happen then it'll have to come from me becuase he certainly never will. Still hard though.

alice there are many people that don't text or email me what they are really thinking 'just in case'. Speaks volumes really.

yummy well done for The Talk. Keep going :)

charlotte agree with others that the SIL would have got a copy of that email one way or the other. The dignified silence can start now. But I also think there is nothing wrong with telling fmaily members some of the facts (partly to stop idle gossip and having to go through it many many times) Just lay as much of it as you want out on the table. That can still be classed as dignified if not silent. The whole loss of dignity is when you start slating your FW and name calling.

I'm finding the niceness so unnerving and suffocating. Am also feeling angry that he can apparantly become the perfect husband with such ease at the flick of a switch. It is like he has had a personality transplant. Why couldn't he have been like this before - prob cos he realised I was a whisker away from leaving.

I have made my decision. Am going to tell him I need to talk more about the texts and ask to see his phone. I realise that he has probably deleted anything dodgy although possibly may feel safe with the passcode on it. However I think his reaction will tell me lots. If he genuinely wants to be a good husband then he shouldn't mind about talking about innocent texts to put my mind at rest and allow me to move on with him. If he gets all defensive or angry with me then I know that my suspicions are true and he is only being pleasant to hoover me back in.

Am also weighing up whether I have the guts to tell him that I want it to end regardless of whether or not he is cheating and despite his recent good behaviour. Not sure that I do though :(

Noregrets and bounty, thanks for the sensible comments! I guess the problem is that I said, "I believe FW is abusive, so I have to go" and they read it as "he's an EVIL MONSTER who is INCAPABLE of ANYTHING good and is OUT FOR MY BLOOD!!!"

bounty - good luck, be strong! You do have the guts: remember he didn't even listen last time, so pretend he's not listening and talk away. :o I seem to be queen of facetious advice tonight.

charlotte I think the issue for me is that in a way he did listen because since I said that I can't live with him commenting on my figure and what I eat he literally hasn't mentioned it even once.

Mind you he hasn't apologised for what he has said over many many years. i don't think he actually believes he was wrong. More that not mentioning my weight is what he needs to do to keep me happy.

yy to not apologising, just acting differently if it'll keep the unreasonable little woman happy. I have got that impression so often over the past couple of months - of course, if I mentioned it I'd sound crazy. He's even attempted an apology, but a very vague one as he clearly has no real idea what he's apologising for.

Oh, but I look at some of the things I write on here and think I sound like such a bitch and impossible to please! Seems the fog's descending again... I shall stop wittering and go to bed, best solution for a foggy head!

Alice I can see my fw?s behaviour reflected in the dcs? too, it?s shit, isn?t it . I am sorry your are feeling so low

Re chocs, I love choc too and am also trying to be healthy. Each time I ask fw not to bring home cakes and treats, he says, but why don?t you just resist it? Simple! Idiot.

Yummy I sympathise. But don?t feel trapped and defeated (well try not to anyway ) because your convo with him is in fact a big step to freedom. These things aren?t often accomplished immediately ? we have their deep seated tentacles in us to dislodge, plus we have to overcome their mastery in manipulation. Well done for a big step forward!

charlotte I love your supportive comments to others but I also love your funny choc comment building a swift network, ha ha And well done for putting that stick down lovey. The sticks are the fws? tools and we don?t need to employ them on ourselves, that?s the fws? job, and the sooner they?re made redundant the better

tether I know what you mean about surviving moment by moment and having little mental energy ? no wonder when the fws hoover it all up like nasty little anteaters.

However, today was a good day over here. I had a very special day (fw free) that I can?t really outline as would out me to any hostile lurkers. But it followed my counsellor?s advice to treat myself and put something back in as I am being depleted all the time by fw (bad) and lovely dcs (good of course but draining at times).

charlotte what you are going through seems so similar to me. It's so hard to say that although they appear to be doing what we want I'm sure they are just going through the motions. If I try to voice that oud loud it makes me sound crazy and how can I possibly know what he is thinking in his head. I guess after all these years I just don't believe he can change thsi easily