support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships: 20

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

hey eternal, glad you are posting again. It's so hard, I can feel your need to make him see what he's done. But he never, ever will. That's why it's so important to detach from him, because you are expending valuable energy and head-space on him (and it's like banging your head against a brick wall), and also he will be getting a little kick from seeing you get distressed and upset. Stay strong, not long to go now.

butterfly I like your new name, is purrrrrty. Keep taking those deep breaths - you are doing the right thing, hold that thought of what it feels like to be with him in your head for times of wobbles.

Evening everyone, I hope everyone is OK.

MrsM about the house, just something to ponder. My fw refused to budge. But I could not really afford the mortgage payments on my own comfortably. Since he is and will refuse to pay maintenance (without a fight) I am waiting for a house purchase via my parents which I will rent back.

Initially I really didn't want to move mainly for stability for my dd, but then as the weeks went by, I don't think I would ever be able to fully move on had I stayed here iykwim?

This house was to be my forever home, but with constant reminders I came to the conclusion my soul and sanity come first.

My new house with have nothing of him, no reminders, no memories. It will be for me to fill with my things, my memories and my future with dd.

It is easier to stay put, but would you be able to move on emotionally?

As for here, no date for the house move yet, and after some serious fwittery at the weekend, he is all sweetness and light again!!

I hope all are well and the good news is spring is on its way! :)

pony thanks. I'm thinking of cutting and pasting my posts here together to remind me! Plus, the feeling of sheer physical anxiety means that there is no way back. I guess it will just be difficult until things are sorted. But I do wonder how on earth it got to this.

Dillie, interesting thoughts re the house. This morning when I was out for a walk with DC2, I was looking at other properties, something I had previously discounted, as - as I said above - I put my heart and soul into doing up my house. I do have a time in mind where I could move, iyswim, and I am not discounting it any more for some of the emotional reasons you say. I will see how I get on with the reclaiming.

bounty, reflecting on the mirror thing, the EA aspect is that you feel you cannot tell your partner/husband (can't remember if you are married) because he will be nasty. Therefore, it is a stress you carry alone, and it would be easier to have someone with you to help you decide whether to push for a second quote etc.

Eternal I hope you are okay. Hang in there and stay strong.

Sorry, hang in there was a bit ambiguous. Hang in there for your journey out, if that makes sense.

see if you can keep silent instead of telling him how you feel. I know this sounds easy, but is so hard in practice when the hot bitter hurt is welling up inside you

see if you can keep silent instead of telling him how you feel

That's an amazing insight fly Along the usual lines of "detach detach detach" but with an instruction manual! I used to jump to my own defence so quickly I lost sight of what was happening and blamed myself for over-reacting. But if you stand back and observe you can see how your partner is pressing the buttons knowing how to upset you.

Now when I meet my STBXH and he tries to get a rise out of me I just laugh inwardly and thank heaven he is an Ex !

Eternal we are all here cheering you on and willing you to be strong

Oh, I was quoting silvers sage words. I am going to paste them inside my brain. I was the same, leapt to my own defenve quicker than the sentences were out his mouth. When I stopped doing that, I could feel that I was provoked but by not responding, I could also see why. I need to remember this.

Fly I am trying hard to remember when in our relationship this way of reacting started. I remember very early on when we first set up home back in ?1985 he upset me so much I thumped him in the chest. I blamed myself and felt guilty for years. Hindsight is a wonderful thing!

MrsM re house ? my thoughts exactly from my position too. I love this house, my vision got us here but I know I can only get him out after costly (in terms of money and kids? emotions) battle. The temptation is to fly away to a new place but even that?s fraught with problems as fw is SOOO manipulative and will be bound to stay in family home until I take extreme measures, meaning dcs will be yearning for home all the time.Which is why I am divorcing whilst under same roof (but separating house) but I can see that being an emotional bloodbath too

Pony I sympathise re your last baby and not wanting to let go I?m the same with my big boy of 9 but he?s my lickle one and he?s lying right beside me, snoring away with a little smile on his gorgeous face (couldn?t sleep without climbing into mum?s bed, ahh, can?t be annoyed coz I love him being in with me )

Alice for you, lovey.

Butterfly that was truly creepy what he did when he thought you were away ? assuming I have the right butterfly ? I don?t blame you for feeling anxious and creeped out.

Bounty for you re wing mirror-gate. But kudos for being so honest. I had my new (to me) car keyed on four panels, the excess cost me a fortune, so it?s lovely that you are so honest but awful it?s so expensive. I agree with others re trying for another quote.

Hello again ER

dillie interesting thoughts re house, I am pondering that re my own situation?.

My fw is back to being bad tempered and nasty, such a relief coz I KNOW what?s what IYSWIM but when he?s being all Disney it makes the fog thicker!

Yes, I hit mine too early on. I thought I was just troubled and depressed, and that it had nothing to do with him. But I think perhaps I had already blinded myself.

Hello, thank you so much for the replies.

I hit mine a long time ago too, I felt sheer frustration everytime. I am not proud of it, and I know I will never do it again in another relationship. Last night I went to bed and had a good think. You are right, I need to stop responding to some of the things he says. I realise all this time I have been really DESPERATE for attention. So, lashing out and saying nasty things has probably been because I wanted a reaction out of him. I feel ashamed at how different I have become...

TheSilvery- I too thought it was because I was troubled and depressed and that I am overreacting. Usually after the event, I would feel racked with guilt and then the cycle of depression and self loathing would continue.

My ex admitted a couple of weeks ago now that he emotionally unavailable. This was a breakthrough in my healing really it was.

eternal hope you are feeling better today. Please try and look at the positives that you have all your wonder life ahead and it will not always be this way. I know that is easier said than done. especially when you are exhausted.
bounty don't you just wish it was your FW with the bill for car damage
alice I hope you are feeling better today.
Pony I think do the nursery route if you can. I look back at how I battled with that and now my DS is older, he has no idea when he was there and when not. I should have taken the time as I ended up so ill. I do worry that others will not take my view point when I get to court. I didn't sleep well last night with Boston and all my worries of being called unreasonable at court. I know he will not see the problem at all. Please let them at court see it.
Today will be a long day and DS has some activities tonight so will got back home until very late. I need to smile and be thankful for what I have.

Just popped in after not being around for a while. Sat in coffee shop waiting for my solicitor appointment in 45 mins. Feel so nervous and like I am about to ruin his life. Why I am I more worried about him than me????

lahit because FW made you feel guilty all the time so that you meet his needs. Good luck - it will be fine. This is your life don't let other people spoil it.

I never struck my FW, but I did do a bit of crockery slinging on two occasions. Both times was me at the very end of my tether, sheer frustration. It wasn't done to upset him, intimidate him, bend him to my will. It was just about me venting my frustration and upset (caused by the things he was saying to me). I felt terrible, absolutely awful, after each time.
Then I think of all the times FW hurt me physically (never more than a poke or a push but still), or yelled at me, or slammed his fist down or slammed doors. Every single time it was specifically designed to intimidate and control me.
And that is the difference between us and them. I'm not saying that lashing out on one occasion is something to be taken lightly, but it's not part of a deliberate campaign to control and undermine.

I have now made an appointment to go and see a nursery. EEEEEK! It's the one DS1 went to, so it's not a complete unknown. I just feel that I am all over the place with work at the mo, I need to control it and marshall into my week rather than letting it run free reign into every spare moment I have. I used to be ok with working evenings sometimes, and I still am, but it's the sense that I am doing about 16 things at once - I'm answering a work email, I'm making a snack for DS2, I'm phoning the dentist for an appointment, I'm playing with DS2, I'm trying to grab half-an-hour to finish a project. I have no sense of how much working time I actually spend every week because I always seem to be working here and there! It's wearing me down, I'm permanently shattered. Does that make sense?

better - it doesn't matter at all if he calls you unreasonable. He will do that if you were to deviate one iota from what he wants. He has no interest in compromise, or about seeing things from others' viewpoints, only about what he wants. I think the court will see that you are not being unreasonable, and that's what counts, not him.

Lahti - good luck! You are more worried about him because he has you thinking that he is more important. I know from my counselling I need to work on my own boundaries, my sense that what everyone else thinks and wants is somehow much more important that my own needs and wants. It's ok to put yourself first, nobody will think you are being selfish. except the FW, of course

Great words on everything pony well done Re: the nursery - I think it is the right thing to do. You get quality time with DC, quality time for work and quality time for you.
I think I need to try and make sure I talk about my DS's view point as much as I can, as I think if he was then to challenge things he would seem very uncompromising and uncaring towards DS and be drawn in more to talking about the affects on DS - thank you. Please pray that the court sees what my family and friends and all you wonderful people see.

I think you describe the crockery slinging very well in terms of you not doing it to control someone else. That is how my FW started to escalate his control over me by throwing something I had made for him across the kitchen as it was `the worst he had ever seen'. But that is very different behavior when it come with a personal attack. It isn't nice how we still worry about things when deep down we know the difference - our FWs have made us think this way to control and undermine us.
Thanks for sharing your councellors advice - I think that advice can be taken on board by me too.

Thanks better - and I think you are right in that if you focus on DS and the effects on him, you really can't go wrong.

And about that story of your ex throwing something you had made for him, and saying that. Awful, just awful. So glad he is your ex!

Read through and will write more later as am working and also getting ready to go to first FP - [scared]

Also had first counselling today - vv good and clarifying

chat later lovely ones

xx

so glad the counselling was a positive Fly, hoping the same for your FP.. xxx

Glad your counselling was good Breathe - reminds me, I must contact WA and ask about the FP they said could be running locally soon. Am determined to sort myself out!

Saw solicitor today, was hoping to sign our financial Minute of Agreement (which is kind of a basis for the divorce agreement) but it was sloppily written and full of inaccuracies and repetition. His solicitor is pants!! (good thing for me, though) So, no signing, but returning it to his solicitor for their perusal and hopefully agreement seems unlikely. This could drag things out with our potential vendor, but this is exactly why he shouldn't have been pushing to get the house on the market till all this was sorted!

Hi fi and pony thanks for the good wishes

pony I'm kinda glad for your sake that your fw's sol is pants . Fantastic step to freedom that you've made .

FP was good (terrifying going in!), such a wide variety of people and ages - that abuse is so widespread, but I guess we knew that. I sat there in terror for the first half, feeling on verge of panic attack, then calmed down. I feel that I've done a lot for "me" (sorry to sound a bit pukey ) today!

FP is great - I really rate it. I'm glad you found it ok fly - it can be very daunting

pony since when did logicality and sense prevail with a FW?

Pulling up a pew as need a handhold. He's EA. I don't live with him so not in danger. He's gas lighting, sulking and has broken up with me unless I change he does this from time to time.

I'm spaghetti headed and losing the plot.

Oh, and Colin Caterpillars are better than Percy Pigs

pony My DD started nursery recently and she loves it. I've seen massive improvements in terms of her confidence around other children. So I wouldn't necessarily look at it as a bad thing. It could be good for your DS2 and good for you to get your work done and good for all your DC in that you can give them your undivided attention at times.

lahti I totally get that guilt feeling. I sometimes feel so worried for H that he is going to end up a bitter and loney old man. But like others say you need to put yourself forwards. PS glad to see you as I was thinking of you the other day

better hope the long day has been ok. And yes make it totally about DS and nothing about FW!

breathe - hope FP is good. My local WA runs one too so I'm hoping to enrol once I get out. Would be interested to know how helpful you find it. I definitely learn to be less of a people pleaser in life in general.

Stick with it Colin. It's tough but really he's don'e you a favour, surely? In setting you free? Keep talking here.

Will he contact you now? Or do you normally do the running?

Ooooh lots of cross posts there!

Anyone having a ?

colin welcome. Tell us your story. Is him breaking up a good thing? Do you want to leave? Glad you're not in danger but we're all here to handhold and help