support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships: 20

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Mink your post made me (phone made post oat just then...). Catlodger you've coined it. I adore my cat lodger but he ducking well takes me for granted and walks all over me (literally) last night the catwit was out all night, never told me where or when he'd be back, his OW from next door was waiting, calling suggestively every time I opened the door to call CW home (unsuccessfully) Fastforward to this morning: he's slept all day AND on my first day to myself since God knows when... He sweet talked me into lying down for a cuddle and then I fell asleep for two hours and got nothing done

ha ha bless him it's funny how it's cute when THEY do it

Nini so good to hear from you lovey. Well done on the retake and good luck for the summer exams. You're a total star- finding concentration to study and pass and deal with heavy fwittery. Your timetable for escape is your own and only you can set it- you've a lot on your plate to say the least. Take care and keep cuddling the dcat I agree I get more understanding (and rational conversation ) from the cat than the fw!

Butter me too with furniture jumping (kids not me I mean). When we moved to a place with a garden a few years ago (phone auto'd tears in place of years- yeah v profound phone ) we got a trampoline which is still the main form if entertainment for our dcs plus neighbours' teens ha ha

Bloody hell, I'd better actually do something with my day off I spose. Much nicer chatting to you lot!

at Nini. I've ended up with an irrational dislike of cats. FW is so lovely and affectionate to any stray old puss, yet no affection for me.

Text conversations and phone calls exchanged - all saying that I need to change. I just go semi catatonic. I really cannot find any words.

Hope the day is going well for all.

we have a trampoline too but it is a bit small (wee garden). so I spend the whole time policing it to make sure they don't go on together and break each other. and anyway now they have broken the (second) trampoline (sigh) not their fault really. bad design.

I could send them to gymnastics but I fear it will just make them worse and I warped myself permanently doing gymnastics and swore I would never let my kids do it.

lol at your catwit and his OW though breath

I have not conveyed your opinions of the feline race to Queen Midnight. But she would doubtless say that we are misunderstanding the relationship between cat and minion. It is based on mutual respect, even though she is of course queen and I am chaletaine.

FW relationships are Not based on mutual respect. And they are supposed to be equal partnerships, it's totally different...

FW was adamant he didn't want a cat. DC and me over-ruled him That was 17 years ago. Throughout that time QM has been a huge source of comfort :)

Silver very glad you over rode him all those years ago. QM has catsplained the dynamic very clearly and I now understand

Ooooooh, lovely ladies, I have just had a good half-hour should be working spluttering and cackling at last night's antics! Naughty Bernard!!!! And Fi - your lexicon is almost writing itself, I should think!

Glad to see you popping in Tis . Thinking boutcha lots. Am sending evil-eyes at your FW, wherever he may be. back under his stone, hopefully

Hello to the new visitors, welcome one and all! Colin, can you just ignore his texts and not reply at all? Turn your phone off?
Wednesday seems to be our Vixen/Vices night of choice, doesn't it? Works for me - I see FW on a Wednesday, and somehow, despite my best intentions, I always need a wee snifter afterwards!

Nini - good to hear your update. I read a post from you on another thread recently, and noted your change in attitude and determination to get out! Hurrah! And well done on your last exam. Maybe try not to worry too much about the next one, sometimes other things are more important, especially if a retake (when your head is less FW-filled) is an option.

(And Silver - I love your cat's name! Not sure if it's an online nickname or her actual name, but it's superb!!! Conjures such a proud, disdainful cat that's like a hole in the dark of the night. Brilliant!)

just wanted to add about the furniture jumping, as my childhood extreme sports seem to be manifesting in DD too! I only recently discovered why my DD was forever falling down the stairs!! It seems when she was really quite young it was her challeng to walk the tightrope across the ever growing gap created down the stair-well and commonly not making it! ... Now she's tall enough there's no challenge, hence she's stopped falling down the stairs all the time.

She's also with another cohort in crime friend, climbed across a church roof! She was 7, maybe 8 at the time. I don't know if I can bear to hear any more of these kind of famous five style outings! .

lovely to see you dipping back in Tis enjoy your days off ladies Hoping FW is feeling very shit, but I bet not. and I bet his pants are on fire big time! and I suspect his nose is far longer than the average beak.

In terms of stickers/wall painting, etc. and roof climbing friends can be such a terrible influence right?

Glad we are talking Ducks today ;)

A revisit later Colin should give you a taste of the Vixens [yay] snax always very welcome

sorry, doh! last comment for on last post was to Patio, inadvertently put Colin because the names are so similar

dirty minded wotsits on order.

friends can be a terrible influence. sadly with dts they already come with a bad influence supplied. have decided next time (fingers crossed never) there is any wall 'art' I am going to have to divide and conquer as they totally collaborated last time. half the time they both simultaneously point at each other the rest of the time they both confess and you never get to the bottom of it. Once, one of the wrote the other one's name on the wall. I think she had absent mindedly (as you do ) drawn on the wall and then thought she had better put her sister in the frame rather than deliberately setting out to get her as it were.

valium first. divide and conquer later.
I would make them repaint the walls but they would a) get it everywhere b) think it was so much fun they would be doing it every week.

Yes I'm going to switch my phone off for the evening.

Its infuriating and mind boggling. There was a heated exchange all of which was along the lines that I have got to change and he is done with being with someone who sees the worst in him. He's right. I do think the worst of him. With good reason. Anyway, apparently I can have him back but I have to change. Something is just niggling at me what's behind this. It has come from nowhere. Anyway, tonight should be quiet as he goes out with his mates. I on the other hand have been instructed not to go out. Apparently I have to give up going out - which I hardly ever do - while he drinks most days.

Anyway, I'm in a bar, Cosmo in hand. fuck you, FW

It was her. SiL found me and apparently told FW. FW said 'but that wouldn't be her' and SiL said she was convinced it was. FW says he didn't read much as it was very hurtful - no shit sherlock. And he wouldn't anyway. Apparently

Why is his hurt so much more important than mine? Why is the hurt of an abusive man so much more important than the hurt of his 'victim'? Oh yes, because blood is thicker than water. Righto.

This totally explains her questions while I was there over Easter. I wonder if she's feeling all judgmental now because I wasn't totally honest with her. Well no - I wasn't honest with you because I would never tell you stuff before I told FW. That would be wrong. Just like what you did is wrong. I have no doubt you're still reading because human nature is like that. So, just so you know - I am really hurt by what you have done. Really hurt. As you have read my posts you will now know that it wasn't to do with his anger. It wasn't to do with the control. They both contributed to the issue, but it was the fact that your brother is an abuser. Plain and simple. A physical, emotional, financial, sexual and verbal abuser.

And now you know more than any other RL person and I can never look you in the eye again. It was a huge deal for me to come to you over Easter and now all trust is gone. It will not happen again.

Oh Tis I would be floored by such a betrayal. You must be so hurt. I know we should expect FW's families to distance themselves somewhat, this is not distancing, it's utter awfulness. Why on earth didn't she approach you directly? It sounds like you got on pretty well - after all, if you went there at Easter you must have thought that she was one of the good guys?

tis I agree with pati, betrayal is the right word. Why did she not come and speak to you? It is certainly true that you find out who your friends are, with friends like your SIL, who needs enemies? It does not matter how much FW read, the point is the betrayal of trust in telling him. for you.

Tis for you. You are spot on. You don't have to tell the world, or anyone, your life now you're free to do with it as you want.

My brother is an abuser, I have stood up for his fiance in the past, even though I thought he was going to strangle me when I did it! and even I never thought he would attack me! A rather huge and burly friend of his had to pull him off me. I guess his sister wouldn't imagine he's capable of it either, but, look out, he is, he so is. She possibly already knows of some instances, but has ignored it.

The hurts of the victim, nay Tis, THE SURVIVOR, are paramount and way over any of the abuser. He brought the whole lot on himself and thought he could get away with it... just like countless murderers and rapists in the past. Grrrr....

Oh Tis. What happened to sisterhood? Really, she puts a vile rapist above a kind and caring mother? If I was her friend, I'd be appalled at how she's behaved, throughout this.

If I found out that my sibling had abused someone in the terrible way that he brother did you, I would reach out to them, let them know that I knew and that I wanted to help. I certainly wouldn't take their side just because they were a relative! I think this says a lot about her (and possibly her own abusive tendencies?) that she told him in a way that judged you (ie not in a 'wtf have you been doing you absolute shit' way) and did not approach you in a kind and empathetic way.

Pati is right. The betrayal is would floor me. There's no recovering from this one for her.

I just need to say apropos of nothing, that I had cause to spend some time with my mother recently after being NC for some years. Oh my goodness gracious me. She radiates negativity. I am cleaning up the debris of the day reflecting on it and it is poison. What a mess. How grateful I am for everything I have learnt on these boards, and continue to learn. She is on another planet.
Probably no relevance but I wish I could wake up in a world where my significant relationships were not all so damaged. Though maybe relevant to the parenting discussion in so far as I need to not screw up parenting dcs and relevant maybe to the tis SIL discussion because women too can be emotionally abusive.

Wow only just caught up with thread. I am shocked too. There's something very inadequate and slimy about lurking and then shit stirring in RL, most particularly so when that person has read of the pain, humiliation and abuse that's happened. But if it's any comfort, I think what stands out about that sort of behaviour is the sheer stupidity of it; and let's face it, stupidity can't win, it's self defeating.

butter absolutely. I hope you're ok.

women too can be emotionally abusive

Oh absolutely. I have known my bestest friend since we were 12 (and we are approaching 21 40 now), and known her mum that long too. I love her mum, but, wow, is she a narcissist, and emotionally abusive too. She also radiates much damaging negativity.
Sorry you have had to be in contact with that again, butterfly.

Sounds very unsettling butterfly.

This tho: but I wish I could wake up in a world where my significant relationships were not all so damaged

I prefer to frame this as, I prefer to wake to a happier world where the damaged people are no longer welcomed into my life

Life is so much happier with better adjusted people around you .

Very rarely are the women the abusers, by comparison butterfly, yes they can be but mostly have a completely different take on priorities and care for children/others. Take it easy and hope that the unsettling debris of the day is being effectively cleared out.

tis - lovely to see you back. Hope you're still getting some strength from lurking here, even if you can't post. I'm so sorry that you're still (totally understandably) upset. As patio and everyone else say, the betrayal is the worst and no you will never be able to trust your SiL again. remember we are all here for you.

butterfly sorry seeing your mother was a bad experience. we really don't need any more negativity draining away at our lives.

I've had a normal (nice) day actually but I've been chuckling away at 'ducking bernard' all day.

Thanks . Yes, I think I am okay. More detached than I would have been before, but a bit mindblown in some ways that is was so obvious to me now.

fi, you may be right re women not being often the abusers, my dad was an alcoholic and my mum's own childhood was very difficult. She said some things about my grandad which I would not have expected and are either her reflecting anew or rewriting history. Whatever, it is all very complex. I am not sure how to make sense of it. Possibly one for the Stately Homes thread in time.

I like your reformulation of my statement though. Anyway not to divert the thread. Somehow all this is connected, I am just trying to work out how. I think I am okay.