Why do relationships with MIL and DIL get so difficult after we've had children?

[IA71]

Do you think it is the MIL trying to keep her position as top dog in motherhood? Are they trying to keep the DIL 'in her place' ie below her? What is the point in all these insults and jibes? Should a DIL keep her mouth shut and let the MIL say what she wants just to keep the peace?

I sympathise...We're not talking to the ILs which makes it slightly easier, MIL still manages to send long letters to DP listing all my faults as a mum and as a human being depsite having never "seen" me in action (as a mum).
To answer your question, I think my MIL is a narc, I think she hates that she can't control me or DP or DGS. DP was the scapegoat in that lovely family, I was offered a role as second goldenchild until I dared not to do what was expected of me and was then reclassified as second scapegoat.
The ones who love their MIL must have a "normal" person in front of them, the ones struggling I bet you a dime they have a narc of some sort as a MIL....

Ashamed to admit im probably the defensive one......after a bitter experience with an overbearing, violent bully of a woman (ex's mum) of course not helped by the fact dp never ever sticks/supports me when I feel it's appropriate for him to. His loyalties are with his mum and I resent that.

Mil not too bad although she can be judgmental and gossipy about another dil....which makes me wonder what she says behind my back iyswim.

Mine is a gem, but we did fall out when I was pregnant over the fact that we wanted to do things our way. Now she's a brilliant and loving grandmother and we get along really well.

IA71

Wow you have really attracted people who have great mils!

I asked this same thing a while ago - I wondered if better mils had more to do - my mil is certainly a classic bored housewife with nothing to think about or occupy her.

She recently stalked us at the school gates.

Mine certainly went into over drive maddness after dd1 was born....

Loads of comments like " when you come to MY house....I will feed you....decent food."

and

as soon as she saw DD only hours old - racing into the room " oooooohhhhh noooooooooooo she looks like you eliza"

things then progresed to a full on shout at me - alot of it for what she sees are her sons failings - things she should have taught him herself and other emasculating things....

i suspect alot of it - if they dont like you is that you are somehow joined to them for life now - shared blood! cant get a stronger link than that....you have thier son, but now your horrid genes are mixed with thiers....the over bearing feeling that they cant control the gc....even though part of them...the feeling of being past it - thier time is up?

usualy alot of childish and sheer un controlled jealousy....also perhaps not great relationships with thier husbands?

I LOVE a physcologist to come on and tell us!!!

I think the MIL-DIL changes completely when GCs come along. Depending on the MIL and DIL. If MIL insists on behaving like the parent then that can cause ructions. If she treats the DIL as an adult, I imagine things would go better.

My MIL simply isn't the kind of person I'd choose to spend time with. We have very different opinions on many things. She is glass-half-empty, I am glass-half-full. Our tastes in pretty much everything are polar opposites.

Before we had DCs, we used to see both sets of parents a few times a year at most. Since having DCs, it's once a month, and MIL would like it to be once a week. She tries to parent me, and seems to be happiest on the very rare occasions when we ask her and FIL to babysit. It's a huge favour when they do this for us, but on our return we get lots of crappy comments making us feel like bad parents for not realising x or y about our own children.

I think my MIL has been forced to confront her own ageing, which I understand. She used to always host family functions at her house. But since having DCs, it has been far more convenient for us and SIL to meet at our house. It's like she is being made redundant. That can't feel very nice.

Well I have to say I am pleasantly surprised that so many people have such good MILs! Every mother I know without exception is having problems with their MIL and I assumed that it was a problem for most people.

In RL I find that people get on fine with their MIL. You tend to get a skewed view on MN because people post if they have problems. It is refreshing change to get posters on here who have a good relationship. I love mine-we got on even better once I had DCs but maybe that was just because we had known each other longer.
The ones who have problems will be the mothers who won't let go-with DSs who haven't stood up to them.

JollyJumper, elizaregina and seoladair, I can relate to everything that has happened to you. elizaregina you have given me some great insights.

The one time I did stand up to her she denied saying anything and everything I accused her of: jealousy and being a liar she accused me of doing the same. She is a very tricky person.

And he's just put pictures of her and my son on facebook all of a sudden! His parents have obviously been speaking to him while I've been speaking to all of you!

My MIL is a sweetheart, BUT she brought up all 3 of her kids to be spoilt, entitled little brats, and despite being aged 30s-40s they all still behave that way. My SIL lived at home until she was in her 30s, and didn't lift a finger to help around the house, or pay her mum board, or even do her own laundry. The sons are even worse.

I can imagine we will clash when mine arrives as I have no intention of following her parenting example.

*elizaregina ? I suspect alot of it - if they dont like you is that you are somehow joined to them for life now - shared blood! cant get a stronger link than that....you have thier son, but now your horrid genes are mixed with thiers....the over bearing feeling that they cant control the gc....even though part of them...the feeling of being past it - thier time is up?

usualy alot of childish and sheer un controlled jealousy....also perhaps not great relationships with thier husbands?*

I totally agree with this!

I know some of you have had horrific experiences and I'm sorry for that, but do all MiLs have to be tarred with the sane brush?

Also with my DH he is very very different to this DF DM AND ds.

they are all very much singing from same page - very arogant and very sure of themselves and their values and how they live.

My DH is totally differnet - differnet values - very relaxed etc....

Now with me - he can live in a way thats more natural to him, as obviously he and I share same values and live how we want too!

So Mils control over way he lives is even more lost.

ie, she takes cleanliness and holes very very serisoulsy - its how she sees herself as superior to others by being the cleanest person she knows with the cleanist house....she is truelly disgusted by cobwebs and dust....I mean " revolted"....

As years went by - it was harder and harder to be in her " domain" it was worse than Hycinth Bucket....house full of surfaces you couldnt walk on - couldnt put a cup of tea on, and my DH seemed to develop loads of twitching tics when there - so would swing on back of chair or fiddle with things and knock them over! Certain sinks we couldnt wash hands in - rooms we couldnt go in....everything had a strict rule, after every meal a PANIC to get "dirty" plates into dishwasher.....a panic if a handbag entered the kitchen.....

Constant critism of my Dh - dont scratch that - dont touch this - dont use that cloth - dont take that glass there....

Intense mico managing....

So of course - she was invited here- she couldnt bear it - the look on her face when she saw ONE cobweb! Our filthy this and filthy that....

She takes such pride in her house and how clean it is - i think its insulted her even more that DH and I live in a much more relaxed manner....

The FIRST THING SHE wold do to DD when she went ther e- was wash her - in the bath - hair as well - and all clothes...

As if to say - we werent washing her and she also didnt want our dirt in her home.

needless to say visits there have been majorly cut down now as I dont want DD exposed to such extremes...

Nanny0gg ? I assume you are a MIL? I'm not tarring MIL's with the same (sane, loved the freudian slip!) brush. I asked the question as the 4 mothers I know were all having problems and got the answer here that no you aren't all the same.

This is mumsnet and this is our forum to vent.

The problems with MILs seem to be an age old problem. Who knows what we are going to be like but hopefully we will be a bit more sensitive. I know that I wouldn't want anyone else to go through the stress that I have been through while I have been getting used to be a mum of two.

This thread seems to only be discussing the problems with mils, and not dils (who Im sure can be just as difficult) whereas i think the problem is the dynamics between the two.

From the many, many threads I've read on here it seems to me that a sort of competitiveness arises that wasn't there before. This seems to be triggered by the dil becoming a mum and i don't think the problem is just mils at all, dil are just as guilty.

It reminds of the way women often fight over men. You know those threads where a man is unfaithful and the wife blames the other woman? Or the way women in groups (particularly teenage girls but i know plenty of grown women like it too) who are supposedly friends but still bitch about each other or look for one to exclude? The way women are so critical of other women, particularly the looks of women in the spotlight?

Its like there's a natural competitiveness between women. Perhaps that's the cause of the problem.

I get on well with my mil. She knows her place

She actually knows to check with me for things, and runs things past me if whatever is ok. This has been made clear since the day dd1 was born.

PooPooOnMars I think you make very good points.
IA71 I know this is the place to vent and I appreciate that some MNetters have had horrific experiences. Pop over to Gransnet and see some of the sad stories from the other PoV.
I do wonder if some of the problems are caused because of the ultra-defensiveness on both sides?

I have TWO MILs, one is a step and both of them have been fine since DD came. They will offer advice if I ask for it but don't overstep the mark.

Once boundaries are set and both sides are happy then it can be absolutely fine.

This took us a year or so. But they are great and I see them as my dc gps rather than in laws that I am at odds with. They are brilliant for babysitting too.

My mil is a lovely woman, and she has always taken our wishes into consideration first - not because I made anything clear - just because she's like that.

I never have to express any wishes anyway - she and her dh and sound as a pound and I trust them both implicitly.

Tbh I think some dils that post on here about their dreadful mils are the ones who are uptight and competitive. I am sometimes made sad by the vitriol directed at their mils.
Some dils have no respect for the fact that the woman they are sick to death of, is their husband's mother. That he loves her. That she loves him. And his child.
It's all "If you want the privilege of looking after my children, you'll do as I say mil!"

Fuck off those dils. Hope I don't get one.

It does help to let go a bit. The dc love their gps and get very excited when they visit. It's their relationship and I'm happy they've got it. More people that love my dcs the better.

(I know some have more difficult ones than I do).

Yes I accept that too. I'm just flipping the coin because it is relevant.

pictish, you are simplying to a great extend the issue. I (and others I believe) was referring to a MIL who has a personality disorder called NPD (Narssistic Personality disorder) and DP has suffered at her expense since he is a child. To paraphrase him he has not felt loved or understood since more than 3 decades.
Since he has become a father she has picked up a fight with him, has refused to accept his apology, has refused to speak to him and has refused to meet him face to face to discuss the issues they have and then has blamed me for her choices.
I'm upset with my MIL becuase she's a toxic woman and I do not want my son to suffer at her expense too. She can't even ackowledge having hurt her own son!
As I mentioned, some women do suffer from PND and are not great company. You may not be able to relate to someone going through this harrassement but it is devastating for everyone....

I think those who have nice/good/normal MIL without any conflict are lucky and I'm envious. I'd settle for one I am able to talk about conflict/differences with.

My relationship with MIL is very strained but she isn't a bad person and neither am I. She is too cautious of me and needs so much reassurance that I disappoint her when I can't talk on the phone or I forget to let her know something.

I get very wound up with her (them...) because they live far away but still want to be involved with the children and it upsets her. There isn't much I can do about it so she jibes at me because she's unhappy with it. You'd think they'd visit more...?

It's a shame & I'd love it to be better but at the moment I've kind of given up and stopped stressing about it. That's what I'd do if I was you IA71 - try to ignore it & distance yourself emotionally. I think that's the only way if conflict resolution fails...

Yes...I've heard of NPD and know something of it.

I was just observing in general though. Those NPD mils were once NPD dils.

Are you sure she wasn't joking?