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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: 11

999 replies

foolonthehill · 10/09/2012 10:02

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

OP posts:
NiniLegsInTheAir · 08/10/2012 19:02

Afraid not, Bertie Sad but sounds like you've been having a hell of a time!

Shellshocked after our counselling session today. Counsellor delved into our childhoods, and when she was talking to NSDH about his he burst into tears (which backs up my statement to her during my individual session that he has issues he's never dealt with). I was actually a bit hopeful that it might trigger something with him but it didn't seem to.

Both of us said that we didn't feel the counselling was making a difference. We talked (yet again) about me needing him to help out more, and I mentioned that he does so little I feel like a single parent. This seemed to cause more trouble than it solved as his ramblings went downhill quickly - he isn't happy, he's lonely, he thinks nothing's changing, he's doing everything he can and can't give me anymore, everyone needs a piece of him. His emotional needs aren't being met (cuddles etc) and he wants me to 'own up to my feelings' (I think he means he wants me to admit I don't love him anymore, which made me Sad and Angry). And he thinks I don't give 100% to the relationship. I was only trying to explain to him that I need to be shown more through his actions and by him helping me. He apparently does something alone with DD 'every' weekend and when I challenged him he said "I have to deal with such LIES in these sessions!". I was fucking livid when we left.

The counsellor seemed a bit concerned when we went and said we needed to let her know if we felt the sessions weren't working. I don't think it's her, it's HIM, but he then said, while looking at me, that it isn't HER that isn't making it work (meaning it's all my fault).

I'm really upset and even more depressed about things now than I was this morning. My head is a mess.

NiniLegsInTheAir · 08/10/2012 19:04

Oh, and according to him we havn't talked about his emotional needs enough (the fact it comes up at least every 5 mins and has done since the first session isn't enough time). So he demanded we deal with this next session.

iponder · 08/10/2012 19:10

Sorry have been lurking here- I have a question about ea but couldn't post it here so asked it in another place iykwim

ponygirlcurtis · 08/10/2012 20:32

hi iponder, what's your question? Ask away, we'll do our best to help (or give you our perspective). have you had a look at the links at the top?

bertie, I'd be really interested to know what the outcome of you phoning the financial helpline. Obviously, I have moved out of the family home that we jointly own. NSDH is asking demanding that I pay half the mortgage (in addition to my own rent, which is nearly 50% more than the mortgage). I don't think I'm legally obliged - the mortgage company don't care who the money comes from, and if he doesn't pay it'll chase both of us equally (that might be relevant for you, if FW is likely to default on payments). I hope I am not prejudicing my share of the equity should we sell as a result of us separating (especially given that I was contributing more financially before I moved out than he was, despite my vastly lower income). I do know, however, that although we put in different amounts as deposit - mine was over double the amount he put in - he is entitled to claim half of the total equity amount, not just what he put in then half of the rest. That leaves me potentially out of pocket by £15k immediately - it's not just imaginary money, some of that's my own savings and money my parents gave me. He could choose not to do this, of course. But he wont.

Nini, I am feeling so Sad for you. I think completely detaching from him (emotionally, and physically too, if possible) is the only way to go, but not sure how you go about doing that, or even if you're at a point to be able to. Am so frustrated for you that he's being so blind to his own behaviour. You're right, the counselling is just not working. Can you contact the counsellor for advice, tell her how you're feeling? Hope you get some space tonight to let your spaghetti-head settle. Brew

tryingsoonflying · 08/10/2012 21:19

Hi I wrote a long post, chatting to all and responding to lots of stuff and it's disappeared completely Sad Bugger!

ponygirlcurtis · 08/10/2012 21:47

Aaah, trying, hate it when that happens!

Am in a funny place today, with all that's happened with NSDH. Not feeling great anyway (sort throat/losing my voice), and I've also felt a bit sickie, anxious, all day. I nearly called the police non-emergency number to talk about the assault incident a couple of weeks ago, but bottled it.

I'm meeting my mum for a coffee or lunch tomorrow. I thought it was going to be helping us be 'talking' again. But now I think it's more sinister. My Dad's been for a few hospital tests, all very low key, I was only told after the event. But then last week he had a CT scan. And now he's booked himself a two-week trip to Canada to see his older brother, who he hasn't seen for about 6 years. When he told me on Sunday, he said 'thought I'd better go and see him' in a slightly 'you know what I'm really saying' kind of way. Thought at the time he meant because my uncle's health hasn't always been good. But now I think he was talking about himself. I've googled it all (I know, I know...) and it looks like it could be cancer. Oh god. Feel even more sick. Not sure how I'll get to sleep tonight. Argh!

tryingsoonflying · 08/10/2012 21:58

Oh Pony I am so sorry for your distress. I really hope it turns out not to be what you think. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow. Let's hope it's not that, and he may just be feeling blue because of worry. I felt like that when I was hospitalised, very doom and gloom and it turned out not to be anything "sinister" in the end. Fingers and toes crossed for you and you DDad. Your mum may be meeting you to discuss your situation and the dsis situation, rather than anything to do with your dad. Keep us posted. xxx

hildebrandisgettinghappier · 08/10/2012 22:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

arthriticfingers · 08/10/2012 22:46

Nini As is often said here, couple's counselling is something to be avoided like the plague approached very carefully.
In an abusive relationship the only 'issue' is the abuse.
Your FW may well be fucked up, but it is the fact that he is an entitled tosser that is the problem.
Did you notice that you were talking about 'him' and 'his' 'issues' in 'your' individual counselling?

arthriticfingers · 08/10/2012 22:50

Nini As is often said here, couple's counselling is something to be avoided like the plague approached very carefully.
In an abusive relationship the only 'issue' is the abuse.
Your FW may well be fucked up, but it is the fact that he is an entitled tosser that is the problem.
Did you notice that you were talking about 'him' and 'his' 'issues' in 'your' individual counselling?

arthriticfingers · 08/10/2012 22:52

Well done! Hilde :)

TheSilverPussycat · 08/10/2012 23:01

nini the question that came to mind immediately I read your post was - does he mean emotional needs or sexual needs?

tryingsoonflying · 08/10/2012 23:05

Hilde, in my previous (lost) post, I mentioned how your idea of church elder sounds good and wished you luck. It's given me an idea too - to involve my fw's church when I leave, to act as mediators or at least communicators to avoid nuclear explosion from FW. FW has a set of people who he respects and are untouchable - his family and his church. (I on the other hand, along with my family, who have helped him and been there for him for last 20 odd years, are a bunch of arses as far as he's concerned. But then he is a fw)

tryingsoonflying · 08/10/2012 23:07

silver good point - my entitled fw always puts his perceived lack of sex as the excuse behind all and every fwittery and dv from him to me - now he has that excuse good and proper as his fwittery has meant we haven't been near eachother for over a year. One day he may realise that what he sowed, he has reaped [grim emoticon]

littlemisspumpkin · 08/10/2012 23:13

Hi all, it's me sunny under a name change!

I had a reply about the counselling today, they have sent me an application form, and there is a couple of months wait, which I don't think is a bad thing to be honest as things don't seem as bad today, but I know it won't last!

I don't think it can do me any harm to have counselling even if they don't think it's EA, once again the doubt is creeping in, but I think it is going to do me good to talk to someone about it, it won't be easy, but I need to do it.

tryingsoonflying · 08/10/2012 23:18

Hi Littlemiss well done! Who did you apply to? I would like counselling but can't afford it, is it something from WA? Or Relate (in which case I've done that, by myself as fw wouldn't come, and it was very hepful, though they told me they couldn't keep seeing me as there was the hint of dv --and they had to cover their backs-)

Whatever it is, good luck with your big step forward, I am sure it'll be a positive one.

littlemisspumpkin · 08/10/2012 23:26

Thanks, it's with the local women's centre, don't know if they charge yet, but am hoping it's minimal cost. If they are too expensive I am hoping they can recommend a cheaper or free service!

NiniLegsInTheAir · 09/10/2012 09:24

Well done pumpkin, loving the name change too! Smile

In response to a few questions. Contacting the counsellor is a good idea curtis, I know she doesn't work today so I'll give her a ring tomorrow. fingers, yes I did notice, I have said several times in counselling that they are OUR sessions, not HIS. He's fixated on himself. How odd for someone who refuses individual counselling. I know counselling in abusive relationships isn't recommended, but I didn't know what else to do. I mean, if a professional can't help us, who can? And Silver, he means both emotional and sexual needs, but he's a prude so won't say the sexual part at counselling. It annoys him no end that his sexual advances get spurned. I've tried to get this across to him at counselling - that I can't sleep with someone who doesn't respect me but abuses me, he just doesn't get it. To him, love is sex.

Having a really shitty time. I tried to do as he asked as 'show him more love' by cuddling as we fell asleep last night, but he was all tensed up. Thank God I'm alone in the office today so I can stuff myself full of chocolate and cry in peace.

MrsOscarPistorius · 09/10/2012 10:30

hugs and virtual choc Nini good luck with your phone call to the counsellor, sounds like a good plan. his outburst of tears may have been some sort of breakthrough possibly?

I have recently started individual counselling, second session yesterday.
Your post is exactly what I fear would happen if we had couples counselling. towards the end of my session we started to talk about childhood issues and why is it that I have allowed DH to treat me like a doormat. trouble is even when I have sorted my own head out I am still left with an FW who wants to treat me as a doormat...

NiniLegsInTheAir · 09/10/2012 10:51

I don't know Oscar but I think he felt he had to make up for crying by blaming me even more than he does usually Sad. I've had the same conversation as you with my own counsellor and you're right, it doesn't solve the problem when FW is still there.

fingers sorry I misread your post. Yes I did realise I was talking about him during my individual counselling, I think I had some things I wanted to say without him being there as I knew how he'd react. His childhood being one of them, he's very sensitive about it.

foolonthehill · 09/10/2012 14:06

There is a reason that we keep banging on reminding everyone that couples counselling where there is domestic abuse is like a red rag to a charging bull unhelpful as it will be used to the abusers advantage, and cause more head and heart ache for those suffering abuse in the relationship.

The best solution is INDIVIDUAL counselling for you and an abusers course for him what couples therapy does for an abuser and for abusers courses. Even if he won't do his part you can gain strength from yours.

OP posts:
foolonthehill · 09/10/2012 14:10

dearest ladies you have a hard enough time keeping your heads above water...please use your energies and resources wisely to make real progress for yourselves. Even if you choose ultimately to stay in this relationship it is better to find ways to gain strength rather than lose it...if you can't afford/go to your own thing the the freedom programme can be done online www.freedomprogramme.co.uk/ for a cost of £10.

OP posts:
foolonthehill · 09/10/2012 14:13

PATTERN CHANGING FOR ABUSED WOMEN

You have the right to be you.
You have the right to put yourself first.
You have the right to be safe.
You have the right to love and be loved.
You have the right to be treated with respect.
You have the right to be human?NOT PERFECT.
You have the right to be angry and protest if you are treated unfairly or
abusively by anyone.
You have the right to your own privacy.

You have the right to you own opinions, to express them, and to be taken
seriously.
You have the right to earn and control your own money.
You have the right to ask questions about anything that affects your life.
You have the right to make decisions that affect you.
You have the right to grow and change (and that includes changing your mind).
You have the right to say NO.
You have the right to make mistakes.
You have the right NOT to be responsible for other adults? problems.
You have the right not to be liked by everyone.
YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO CONTROL YOUR OWN LIFE AND
TO CHANGE IT IF YOU ARE NOT HAPPY WITH IT AS IT IS.

OP posts:
foolonthehill · 09/10/2012 14:13

.new thread 12.

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