Divorcing Dad: Should the engagement ring be returned to me?

[Freshlygroundbeans]

This is my first post on this website-

I have been married for almost 10months and am about to get a divorce. My partner is a solicitor and has drafted the Separation Agreement. The separation is by mutual agreement and will be uncontested.
The reasons for divorce are very complex. They relate to the children of a blended family and mental health issues. These issues were prevalent before we got married but became exacerbated after the wedding . There is a mutual feeling that we should never have got married.
Within the agreement she cites : ?The parties agree that she keep the engagement ring given to her by DH?. The ring is still being paid off and is a significant amount of money. Both parties will be undergoing financial strain when moving on. I will be leaving the home with my son and do not particularly want to be continuing making payments on an engagement ring !
I have asked her to return the ring whereby I will sell to retrieve the expense .My own reasons are that the ring is now meaningless and has no symbolic value. A sham. For my mind it would be an honourable gesture of her to return it to me.
Her response is that it is a gift. She even cites a law case stating that legally she is entitled to keep it .In this regard she may be correct. However, I think this is a ?moral issue? more than ?gift issue?. I intend to remain friends with her but I know my friendship will be determined by her attitude to this issue.
What are all your thoughts? What would you do?

Thanks Clam - god knows if he's reading it. All I've had is endless crap about how he considers he shouldn't pay any money into joint account for rent, bills etc, despite living here and the outgoings remaining the same. Quite how I'm supposed to pay bills from thin air I don't know.

Wanker, wanker, wanker

FL, I am so sorry you are having to deal with him.

What are his reasons for not splitting bills?

Jesus - just came back to this and am horrified about how you are being treated FL. why is he cutting down on the bill paying? Just incorporate that debt into your divorce agreement!! What a wanker he is!!

It was a gift so she is entitled to keep it. It was greedy of her to choose such an expensive one, though, and morally I think she should return it. If she was my friend I would be disappointed in her. Does she say why she wants it?

Oh god, just caught up with thread. I retract previous comment!

Xmasbaby Out of interest, how did you manage to catch up with the thread in the minute between your two posts?

I don't know the reasoning. Have been trying to ascertain it for the past four weeks and I would have been better hitting my head against a brick wall.
Doesn't answer questions, stonewalls and won't respond to suggestions or come up with alternatives.
Point being, he has more to lose if he wants to play games as if I choose to twist knife I could be a really vindictive bitch. In theory I should be the bigger person but there is only so much crap one can take.
So, if he won't pay rent, maybe I ought to change locks and shove his stuff on the pavement.

Presumably the house is in your name? I know you're a lawyer, but I would say take advice on this.

Best way to remove a leech. Don't read the bit about what to do if you have a leech up your nose, it's gross (and takes the metaphor further than I wanted to go).

I just knew that Freckled's wedding post was going to be that one - I remember it vividly from last year as it seemed so outrageous!

OP, you are a complete and utter dick and Freckled, you have my sympathies. I can't imagine what it must be like still having to live under the same roof as this loser.

Out of interest though - has he sought any opinions from people in real life that know you both? Other than his family of course?

I don't think you'll recoup the value of the ring if she gives it up for sale.

I do think there is a smidgeon of pettiness and meanness on your part.

I do hope that you are not going to let your 'principles' stand in your way of being friends with your X - after all, you will be divorced from her forever, and your son surely has a relationship with her, and her kids with you?

If he isnt paying rent or bills then he has no right to be there so bin bags on the pavement gets my vote!

What an utter prick!

Yikes I've just caught up on the three pages I didn't see. Shame on you OP!

Pack fuckwits bags, and chuck him out!!!!
Change the locks, that should help.

It's irrelevant whether OP is still reading, the ring is a red herring anyway.

The OP has achieved his objective, which was to metaphorically piss all over the ground where Freckled had previously felt safe; to show her that he would track her in order to continue to bully her; and that he would manipulate the truth in order to turn people against Freckled. She had found somewhere to vent and seek advice- and now this pathetic freeloading excuse of a husband, having bullied Freckled into paying vast amounts of money to his family and friends for a wedding she didn't want and a holiday for them that she didn't want either, is still trying to intimidate her.

Freckled, I hope you are in a position to get advice from colleagues to reinforce your position- your husband is a manipulative snake.

Even without all the (shocking) back story, what strikes me is the contempt with which this poor woman is held for daring to take anti-depressants. He quite obviously - and ignorantly, and pathetically - sees this as some sort of weakness on her part, despite, presumably, the fact that these were prescribed for her by a fully qualified medical practitioner in order to treat a genuine medical condition. "Mental health issues" are then cited as one of the reasons this marriage has collapsed .... FFS. I find that aspect of this sorry tale alone very chilling and it shows this "man" up as having no common sense, intelligence or empathy at all.

The only mental health issues that freckled has would seem to be in the shape of her STBXH. Once he goes, and takes his ridiculous and discriminatory attitudes with him , I anticipate her feeling a lot better.
(Am not dismissing the depression, just the attitude he has towards it, as she seems to have had it all under control)

Freckled, I really feel for you having to deal with such an unreasonable man. Funny thing is, even before you joined this thread (and just going on his dubious side of the story) there was a mixture of responses about the ring, with plenty of people saying it was a gift, so you should keep it. Your STBXH obviously only saw what he wanted to see on this thread, just ignoring the responses that didn't go along with his view.

I totally agree that he has invaded your space by coming on here. WHo does he think he is not contributing to the bills and rent when he's living there?

I don´t understand why you still have a joint account tbh.

Get on the phone, change all the DD to his personal account number and empty the joint account!

I cant find it in all the pages, why are you still living together until July?

FGS, close your connection with the joint account now. Then he can do what he likes with it. Why can't you sling him out, or go yourself?

Bills are in my name as I was the one that set up all direct debits and standing orders when we moved in together. Therefore, I cannot simply change them to come from an account in another name entirely. Joint account is overdrawn so not much point trying to empty it.

Still living together as I can't move owing to DD's school, whereas he can move as he has no ties to the area. I moved to new area, new school for DD in order to accommodate him and his son who had to stay living in that particular area owing to residence arrangements with step-son's mother.

Therefore, I'm not in a position to be able to move whereas he is. But notion is that he has to find a place, I have to find someone to move in to help with rent, and colleague/friend who is going to move in isn't leaving her place til end of July. Also, we were endeavouring to have a civilised separation .

Freeze the joint accounts so nothing leaves the accounts.

Open a new account & transfer all DD's to come out of the new account ensure your pay, child benefit, tax credits etc go into new account.

I don't know how you'll sort out the overdraft on your joint account if he's not being cooperative.