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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

"Daddy dropped me on the floor"

441 replies

gladiolus · 22/05/2012 10:19

I have been having some problems with my dh - we're going to relationship counselling after he admitted he needed help. He can be verbally abusive and manipulative, twisting my words to mean something other. I can give as good as I get in return, but I would rather not have to, KWIM?

I've been on the verge of leaving him so many times, but this takes the biscuit.

My youngest dd is 4.5 and when I met my dh she was not quite 1, so she thinks of him as her daddy. She can be very willful and is testing her boundaries at the moment.

Last night she was being an absolute PITA, refusing to put her colouring pencils away at bedtime and basically having a tantrum. After we had given her repeated chances and warnings, my dh finally picked her up bodily and carried her upstairs, saying she was going to bed with no story and no song as punishment for her behaviour.

So far, no problem, she really was being a little madam and I had smacked her bottom. I know some people don't agree with smacking, but that's another discussion.

Anyway, when they got upstairs to her bedroom I heard a big thump and a cry from her. I am familiar with my dd's cries, this one was her "You hurt me cry" but her "I fell over and hurt myself" cry, which is totally different. I hear the "you hurt me" cry when I smack her bottom and when I accidentally pull her hair when I'm brushing it (she has very long curly hair and it gets knotty easily - I do try not to pull but now and again it happens).

The point is, this one was definitely the "you hurt me" cry, it had that undertone of accusatory aggrievedness in it.

My first thought was, "OMG, he's dropped her on the floor," as that is exactly what it sounded like. Then he started yelling at her to get undressed. She still needs a it of help getting undressed so I went upstairs to help her as it wasn't fair for him to yell at her to do something she can't do.

So, we got her to bed and she went quite docilely, no protests at all.

After, I asked him plainly what the noise was I had heard and he said she had thrown herself to the floor after he'd put her down.

But this morning when I was getting her ready for school, I didn't put words in her mouth at all, I simply asked her, "Last night, when Daddy took you upstairs, what happened?"

And she instantly replied, "Daddy dropped me on the floor."

I know sometimes children can be aggravating and she really was at her worst last night, but this is really too much, isn't it?

I haven't spoken to him yet. I took her to nursery this morning and went for a run and he's still in bed.

OP posts:

HecateTrivia · 22/05/2012 10:26

Do you think he threw her to the floor or she wriggled out of his grasp and fell?

To a child, they would both probably be 'you hurt me', but one is unforgiveable while the other is an unfortunate accident.

What is awful, even if she wriggled away, is that he didn't pick her up and comfort her. Does that mean he did it on purpose though? (dropped her I mean)

bumbleymummy · 22/05/2012 10:29

As Hecate said. Was it an accident because she was wriggling away?

Original poster

gladiolus · 22/05/2012 10:31

I don't know. There is a difference between throwing and dropping, though. One is just gravity, the other is using force. I tried to ask a few other questions, but I was worried about putting words in her mouth. I picked her up and held her against my hip and said "Did Daddy drop you from up here," and she said, "Yes." I also asked her to show me how she landed and she assumed a position on all fours slightly to one side.

Whether that's true or not I don't know, it's difficult to gauge whether she's actually telling the truth or just agreeing with what I've said, which is why I deliberately just asked her "What happened?" first time, so as not to put ideas in her head.

Dropping her from an adult height though, is just as unforgivable as throwing.

It didn't occur to me that she might have wriggled out of his grasp - that is possible. I think he was far too angry about her behaviour to pick her up and comfort her. Admittedly, when I went upstairs, she wanted a hug from me and I refused - only because she had been such a little madam, although it killed me not to give her one.

OP posts:

Dropdeadfred · 22/05/2012 10:36

Did you check her for bruises? If she had been dropped from adult height I think she would definitely have had bruises... But why would she not have told you straight away when you went to undress her??

AngelWreakinHavoc · 22/05/2012 10:36

I would have dragged his sorry ass out of bed to find out what happened. If she says 'Daddy threw me on the floor' at School you will more than likely have SS calling round to say Hi.

akaemmafrost · 22/05/2012 10:38

I would have hugged her. She was hurt why wouldn't you hug her, that has nothing to do with her being naughty. She's only 4.

Orchidlady · 22/05/2012 10:41

So you hit her, your DH is yelling @ 4.4 year because she would not put her pencils away and drops her on the floor, you both sound delightful, maybe you should be doing parenting classes rather than counselling

AngelWreakinHavoc · 22/05/2012 10:41

What akaemmafrost said!

squeakytoy · 22/05/2012 10:42

I am not against smacking but I do wonder if the atmosphere in your house is contributing to your child's behaviour. It sounds like a very volatile environment for everyone.

akaemmafrost · 22/05/2012 10:42

I agree entirely with orchidlady she is 4 fgs! Not much past being a toddler. I think you both sound awful.

bumbleymummy · 22/05/2012 10:43

Angel, I think that's a bit extreme. Children's versions of events can sound worse than what actually happened. I embarrassed my mum when I was younger by screaming 'no, no, don't beat me again' when she took me by the hand to take me away from the swings after I had refused to come when she called.

I think you need to speak to your DH again. Tell him what your DD said and ask him again what happened.

Original poster

gladiolus · 22/05/2012 10:43

Did you check her for bruises?

No, I didn't. :(

But why would she not have told you straight away when you went to undress her??

I don't know - maybe she was scared.

She was hurt, why wouldn't you hug her?

I didn't know she was hurt at that point, otherwise I would have. I was also angry with her naughtiness, and I thought she was upset because my dh was angry with her. I thought if I hugged her I would be undermining his authority. I did give her a goodnight kiss and a hug once we'd put her in bed.

OP posts:

slartybartfast · 22/05/2012 10:44

why are you askign now - youshoudl ahve been askign ast night.
what did he say lst night?
did the familky make up last night?

BillyBollyBandy · 22/05/2012 10:45

There is no need to shout or smack when she won't go to bed - just carry her upstairs and put her into bed. Clearly the shouting and smacking isn't working.

I would never ever think that dh would intentionally hurt the dd's. The fact that you have considered it indicates you think he could be agressive and hot tempered enough to hurt a young child.

bumbleymummy · 22/05/2012 10:46

Oh good grief! As if none of you have ever raised your voice or gotten cross with your children for misbehaviour. We don't know if she was intentionally or accidentally dropped!

slartybartfast · 22/05/2012 10:46

sounds like you need a better bedtime routine
and parenting classes, a book or something.

Original poster

gladiolus · 22/05/2012 10:46

I said what he said last night. I couldn't ask last night as I wanted to hear what she had to say first.

I'm not sure what you mean about did the family make up. We both said goodnight to her and gave her a kiss and she promised to behave better today, so I guess so, yes.

OP posts:

slartybartfast · 22/05/2012 10:46

asking mumsnet isnt going to get you your answers op.

Original poster

gladiolus · 22/05/2012 10:49

Every night she has a book and a song - we normally have a very good bedtime routine. The removal of the song and the story was part of her punishment.

The problem arises when it's time for bed and time to put her things away and she throws a tantrum and won't cooperate.

My first dd wasn't like this at all, so we're struggling to find strategies that work. I agree smacking isn't the best policy, and I never agree with shouting at small children - it's not something I do.

OP posts:

akaemmafrost · 22/05/2012 10:49

She had been dropped. You heard her cry. You knew she was hurt because of the type of cry, you said so, but you didn't hug her because she had been a PITA earlier.

I think you both sound like your expectations of a 4 year old are far too high. Two adults hurt a 4 year old last night for being a 4 year old .

I don't like haranguing people on here so I won't say anymore but it wasn't your four your old at fault last night and I think you and your dh need to examine your attitudes towards the way you are parenting your child.

slartybartfast · 22/05/2012 10:49

positive parenign?
hopeuflly someone will come with advice on a good bed time routine

Helltotheno · 22/05/2012 10:50

The only thing I'll say about this is that I have a child who had regular, full-on tantrums from the age of 3 when things weren't going her way (has calmed down a bit now at 9 but still gets very stroppy when things don't go according to her plan). Looking back, a lot of it was down to tiredness which I didn't always realise at the time.

Many times, when I or DH would be lifting her (against her will) up to her bedroom or out to the stairs or whatever, the amount of struggling she was doing caused her to bash some part of herself against the wall or the floor and she would invariably blame us. There have definitely been occasions when she would've more or less struggled so hard that she fell out of my arms, and yes of course she hurt herself but we always talked afterwards and I tried to explain to her that her resisting led to her hurting herself... not easy for a child.

Just trying to give a different perspective to people who lucky them don't have volatile children prone to tantrums.

OP as hard as it is though, you and DH have to try and stay calm... eventually the storm passes and it's better if everyone hasn't lost the rag.

bumbleymummy · 22/05/2012 10:51

Good post Hellto.

Helltotheno · 22/05/2012 10:54

I agree smacking isn't the best policy, and I never agree with shouting at small children - it's not something I do.

Don't be too hard on yourself. I really, really sympathise with you, having a similar child, and any parent who says they never, ever blow their top with a child through sheer frustration .... well I find that hard to believe tbh.
I found that giving my DD as much ownership of decisions as possible (while still doing what I wanted to do) helped, and also a lot of negotiating helps too. It'll wear you down at times but kids like this just require more work, simple as that.

slartybartfast · 22/05/2012 10:54

ignore the bad and praise the good works, sometimes, taking a step back and not rising to the bait too,

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