"Daddy dropped me on the floor"

[gladiolus]

I have been having some problems with my dh - we're going to relationship counselling after he admitted he needed help. He can be verbally abusive and manipulative, twisting my words to mean something other. I can give as good as I get in return, but I would rather not have to, KWIM?

I've been on the verge of leaving him so many times, but this takes the biscuit.

My youngest dd is 4.5 and when I met my dh she was not quite 1, so she thinks of him as her daddy. She can be very willful and is testing her boundaries at the moment.

Last night she was being an absolute PITA, refusing to put her colouring pencils away at bedtime and basically having a tantrum. After we had given her repeated chances and warnings, my dh finally picked her up bodily and carried her upstairs, saying she was going to bed with no story and no song as punishment for her behaviour.

So far, no problem, she really was being a little madam and I had smacked her bottom. I know some people don't agree with smacking, but that's another discussion.

Anyway, when they got upstairs to her bedroom I heard a big thump and a cry from her. I am familiar with my dd's cries, this one was her "You hurt me cry" but her "I fell over and hurt myself" cry, which is totally different. I hear the "you hurt me" cry when I smack her bottom and when I accidentally pull her hair when I'm brushing it (she has very long curly hair and it gets knotty easily - I do try not to pull but now and again it happens).

The point is, this one was definitely the "you hurt me" cry, it had that undertone of accusatory aggrievedness in it.

My first thought was, "OMG, he's dropped her on the floor," as that is exactly what it sounded like. Then he started yelling at her to get undressed. She still needs a it of help getting undressed so I went upstairs to help her as it wasn't fair for him to yell at her to do something she can't do.

So, we got her to bed and she went quite docilely, no protests at all.

After, I asked him plainly what the noise was I had heard and he said she had thrown herself to the floor after he'd put her down.

But this morning when I was getting her ready for school, I didn't put words in her mouth at all, I simply asked her, "Last night, when Daddy took you upstairs, what happened?"

And she instantly replied, "Daddy dropped me on the floor."

I know sometimes children can be aggravating and she really was at her worst last night, but this is really too much, isn't it?

I haven't spoken to him yet. I took her to nursery this morning and went for a run and he's still in bed.

God I feel for her She is getting smacked and being called a little madam for what seems like nothing. And as for teh shouting

OP if that's what YOU want to do fine but remove him from your babies. Tell him to leave and take it from there.

Everyone on the thread is in agreement with your daughter too.

I think your frustration last night where you ended up smacking the dd was due frustration caused by the dh (who no doubt is hard work all the time) rather than frustration from your dd.

As I said above he sounds like another child for you to deal with - a hindrance not a help.

You need to start having a good, clear look at all his behaviours. They way you reacted to thinking the worst had happened last night means you are at least subconsciously on hyper alert. Today you maybe beginning to realise your unease.

You say your elder dd was easygoing and didn't cause a fuss. However that doesn't mean she didn't resent his style of parenting too - just that she found a way to bury it. The younger dd is acting up because of the tension caused by dh is clearly everyone's guess here.

You being the only emotionally mature adult in this house know what needs to be done. Take a step back from the control games with your dh and observe him at work. You'll no doubt lose respect for him when you see a bit clearer.

I would not currently let him be involved in any discipline of my dd until there was a big change in his attitude.

The fact you started this thread speaks volumes that you want to do what's best for your dd but I think you're drowning a little but didn't even know until you started the thread maybe?

Why doesn't your other daughter like him, do you think?

No, no you don't have to work at it anymore you really, really don't I promise you because you HAVE worked at it, you have tried hard to do the right thing haven't you?

You are unhappy with the way he parents your children, your children don't like him. All instinctive reactions to this man.

Clearly you don't trust. If this happened in our house (just the dh dropping/ throwing the rest tbh wouldn't) I would ask dh what the noise was and then leave it. I wouldn't then question dd in the morning, I trust dh implicitly. If dd then came to me and said different, I would speak to them both together and I know dh would be mortified if he felt dd had taken it the wrong way and hurt her on purpose. She actually said daddy dropped me, that's not the same as throwing. Its possible that he was putting her down as she stripped and threw herself on the floor and sees it as daddy doing it purpose. I really don't get that you accept smacking is not a way to deal with the issue, but do it anyway, and judge your dh so harshly for shouting. There is a difference between a person who doesn't praise and one that purposely hurts a child. I remember shopping with dd she was about 3. She fell over (didn't hurt herself) while 2 women were walking past she insisted that they had pushed her over and was really upset. I saw the whole thing they were about 3 foot away. But she genuinely thought they had. Sometimes kids do things and think it must be the adults fault. Sometimes its not. I can't say what happened but it sounds like you both have issues with anger and behaviour towards your dd.

Forgot to add, he does sound like a complete tool, but you need to look at yourself as well. You are both treating, imo, this child very harshly. I don't think you can blame smacking a child on the fact he has wound you up. How would you feel if he said yes he threw her on the floor as ypu had wound him up. You would be telling him he should be able to control himself, which would be right.

I don't recall blaming myself smacking her on him winding me up

I already agreed that both of us dealt with last night poorly.

op that was in respond to kettle. I didn't mean to imply that you had said that
I should have been more clear.

okay - sorry :)

Its not a problem, its mu fault. I would have assumed the same. Must re read my posts. I apologise for the confusion. :)

Actually, no, I DON'T THINK you have to work at it. If your husband hurts your child you get the fuck out.

"I have seen threads on here where the first course of action recommended is counselling."

NEVER, EVER, EVER EVER WHEN THERE IS AN ABUSE DYNAMIC!

Stop the counselling NOW. He does this to you and to your DC, because he WANTS and CHOOSES TO. He could stop any time he wants to... he doesn't.

IMHO you need to trust your instincts. I am reading between the lines and this man is battling for control of your family. This DD is not his and he has no business swooping in and countermanding your parenting. Even if he were her father, he'd be wrong to usurp you in such a way.

If he had accidentally dropped her, if she had have wriggled you would have heard him say something, or you would have heard a struggle. And YES he would have comforted her.

I think you know deep down she didn't wriggle, it wasn't your first thought. If your first reaction, your GUT INSTINCT is that he could have dropped her on purpose. A thought that SHE herself told you later on, there are 2 ducks lined up in a row. What WILL it take for you to realise that you need to protect her?

What has happened now is that you have had the talk, he has come up with a story and you have swallowed it whole, because the alternative is far too scary for you.

The fact that he didn't comfort her (moreover neither did you, out of fear of confrontation with him?)this is both sad and significant (in his case) You seem to be preoccupied with not rocking a boat here somewhere and you yourself said that maybe your DD was scared to tell you.... If there were a healthy dynamic, she wouldn't have been scared of the man in her home.

You also say you are used to being told how horrible you are. Your DD seemingly is also getting used to adults (him) being mean.

Stop the couple counselling, start personal 1-2-1 counselling.

You have hit your child because he has wound you up? that is wrong. You know this. I'm not judging, I have been there too, I was in an abusive relationship and the fear of him drove me to try to control DS. I'm out now and my son and I are putting our lives back together. 1 year on, immense work done, much more immense work to do.

This man is not her dad. This man is not a good man to be with, there should be no power struggles, you are equal beings, you and DD are a unit, you are her only chance of protection. If you were in a positive partnership with this guy, he'd not be laying in bed until gone 11am, he'd be up with you. You'd not be scrabbling off the internet the minute he gets up, you'd be free to be online. Your scurrying speaks volumes.

Right now you are in denial. I know because I spent NINE YEARS in denial.

However, you need to understand that you are being abused, it's serious, and it will only get worse, He's already started on your daughter. She's not even 5 FGS. What hope of a normal life are you giving her? Only YOU can save her and yourself. Act NOW. Please.

When you get away from this man, your parenting will improve, you will be less stressed, and you won't be so harsh on your DD. It will get better.

If he takes responsibility for being abusive, HE himself will take himself off tot a program, he will call RESPECT, he will go to ADAPT, he will do all this. HE will offer to leave the house so that you and the DC are safe while he fixes himself.

there is a minuscule chance of him doing this, but it's your deal breaker. Any less, no deal.

YOU and YOUR FAMILY should settle for nothing less.

I think you have an instinct that you have to get out and if he had dropped her on purpose it would give you a solid reason.

But you don't need that solid reason if he twists your words and is controlling, as that is damaging to you and your children, but harder to explain as a reason.

Couples counselling is not advised where one partner is abusive and controlling. He can twist your words and the counsellor's words as well. And use it against you.

I haven't read much of the thread yet but what sprung to mind is that you smacked her, she went without song and went without story. That's 3 punishments for one thing!

:( I see a lot of over analysing, jumping to conclusions and projecting on this thread that I really don't think are helpful to the OP.

Yes hissy I suspect OP is in denial but luckily for her dd she is beginning to open her eyes. I agree most important to see dh in cold light of day and disengage from him rather than work with him.

Obviously no-one condones OP's reaction last night least of all the OP. however I do believe she knows she''s capable of better parenting without dh around. We all know hitting dd last night not good but repeating it won't change the fact that the dh is behind the OP's frustrations -not her dd.

x posts with happyhissy. She put it better.

I stayed for too long, trying to make it work as you are. I regret it and especially for my older DC (like your 11 year old, you need to give her a few years away from his controlling ways, before she reaches adulthood, I regret not doing that).

Haven't read the thread yet but my immediate reaction was the same as Hec's. I suspect she may have been fighting him and he lost his grasp of her. She said 'dropped me' not 'threw me'.

I'll read the thread now.

Again to clarify not suggesting you leave him. It do start process of recognising it's him causing your frustration not dd

I do praise her when she is good. Dh doesn't - he doesn't agree with praising children "for doing what they're supposed to anyway."

Wow that's really harsh!! That's damaging, seriously damaging to never be praised!

You say he has admitted to being abusive sometimes. In what way is he abusive?

'No, I told her initially (and calmly) that the punishment would be sitting on the simmer-down step, which is something we do when nothing else seems to be working.

But before I had chance to do that, dh swooped in and dragged her upstairs and told her there would be no story and no song. He explained today that he thought if she sat on the step for a few minutes, it would be putting bedtime off even further, which was what she wanted.

I don't agree, but if I argue with her in front of him, then we aren't presenting a united front.'

Your DH actually threw quite a tantrum there himself. He basically dictated to you how things would go and probably terrified your DD because of the physicality of it and the fact that his action effectively rendered you completely powerless. He took complete control of the DD and he reinforced his message to you and to her by dropping her (I am pretty sure this is what he did based on your posts here). He made her get undressed (humiliation) after she had landed on the floor.

He didn't listen to you and in fact it was him who prevented a united front from being put before the children. (He is not interested in putting on a united front btw, unless it is his dictat that you are following. A united front where he does things your way is not what he wants at all). What you got there was a tantrum by a grown up, never a pretty sight, a power play by him, an indication that he is not interested in playing nicely with you at all when it comes to the children -- in fact in doing what he did, he was asking you to choose between the children and him in a way that was not at all subtle. You said the DD is not his biological child?

The reason your H won't praise the girls for being good is that he thinks that would give them control over him. Nothing to do with old fashioned attitudes. He just likes being the authoritarian whom everyone is afraid of. Doing it differently would involve losing that power and that ego trip.

Your H and you are locked in a power struggle over your approaches to the children because he wants to control the home, you included.

I am sorry that you are going to give him the benefit of the doubt here because this will not end well at all for your DD.