To think DH should be able to control his temper and not smack DCs when he is angry?

[xeno]

I know I'm not perfect. I spent several years with severe PND so bad I felt DCs shouldn't be left alone in my company. Gradually I have climbed out of my hole and had them for longer periods by myself and am now taking on much more housework and childcare and beginning to be a proper SAHM. Unfortunately I also have fatigue and pain which I am battling to overcome and currently I have some "normal" weeks but am still incapacitated some of the time. We still have a child carer three days a week and a cleaning lady and help from parents&MIL.

But all this has taken its toll on DH. TBH it would help if my parents didn't come round (whole other story) because they are stressy so I am trying to get up in mornings (my worst time) so DH not alone with DCs at breakfast/school run. But I do play my part during day with DC2, after school, cooking meals, evenings, bedtime routine, housework, organising paperwork, banking, etc. and we both do childcare at weekends. but when I am ill I do have to go to bed. Usually for a few days during which the entire house gets trashed.. I have learned to control my temper and now deal (IMO) very calmly with tantrums and stressful situations and keep my temper.

But When DH is angry (most of the time) he smacks DCs for being annoying, or really minor naughtiness. I think he is out of order. He thinks it is because he is under so much pressure. I try to take pressure off him by looking after DCs so he can have a few hours to do his own thing by himself, and he then tells his DM that he has "done everything" and is very stressed and tired because he "hasn't had any rest". I am pissed off that even though I have been getting better and have been much better for last 5 months (apart from physical illness) he seems to be getting worse. Sorry this has turned into a huge rant!

Hmm...I don't see where anyone has said 'Beaten' but I may be missing it.

Smacking is not on a par with beating. However, smacking used to the extent where children are terrified of one of the two adults they should be able to trust most in the world is, imo, on a par with beating.

Slapping hitting and pinching an under two year old is certainly child abuse in anybody's book. Don't see where this thread is going I'm afraid.

"you lay your life down for your kids , you move heaven and earth to protect them , you stand in the way and put yourself in the firing line if someone even tries to hurt them... You go to a refuge with the clothes on your back and your kids hands held tight. You dont waste time on a forum asking if you are being unreasonable for letting their so called father batter them because he cant control his temper....I just want to scoop these little mites up and give them the life they deserve. I hope SS or someone rescues them.."

pinching

OP your dc1's bad behaviour may very well be down to the fact that you and your husband have used violence against him, since he was a tiny baby It is a vicious cycle that needs to be broken. Only the adults can do that, not the child

Just to clarify, I did pinch and smack (on bottom) in anger when I was very ill, but this was very rare because I very quickly asked for help and as a family we arranged things so I was very rarely left alone with them. The number of times I was actually physically abusive to DS1 was probably about 5 times in total. The rest of the time I managed to put him down and leave the room before I lost it.

I asked for professional help and saw a psychiatrist before DC2 was born because I knew I wasn't safe with them so I didn't allow myself to be alone with them for more than a few minutes at a time so DC2 was never harmed by me.

I have smacked them both as a discipline for seriously bad behaviour but never for minor things or because they were annoying me. I have been to parenting class and keep trying to use the methods I learned there but DH was inconsistent at doing the same and now doesn't seem to trying at all.
I have lost my temper with them and shouted (but who hasn't). My concern is that DH has now got to the point where he will smack for really quite minor misbehaviour or because their naughtiness is annoying him. I never did this.

They have never been beaten, please don't twist my words.

ninedoors contraception doesn't always work. Finding out I was pregnant again was a pretty nasty shock, but I knew I could never forgive myself if I had had a termination, and if I had offered him up for adoption do you think SS would have let me keep my firstborn? With both pregnancies I carried on having periods so didn't know straight away. So it would have been hard to do anything about it anyway.

I probably haven't made this clear, but I love both my children, and my DH, very much and the thought of losing any of them fills me with terror and dread.

"The number of times I was actually physically abusive to DS1 was probably about 5 times in total."

XENO I am sorry but that is five times too many, physically abusing a child, who is only just five now. What must he have felt, both physically and emotionally.
This is just heartbreaking, I promised myself I would leave this thread alone but I just can't seem to. No wonder he is lashing out, he is probably hurt and confused. Pinching him when he was a baby. Now his father is at it as well.

In situations like this I often wonder how this child's life could have been so so different with the right love and care and without the painful 'physical abuse- 'ONLY five times in total' and fear of violence and bad tempers within his own home. The use of the word ONLY does not even belong in that sentence!
I really hope something is done to turn this boy's life around and give him a chance to live the life he deserves. Call it smacking. call it beating, call it what you will, I am not sure there is a word to dress it up and make this all sound any better.
Parents are there to nurture and protect, illness or depression does not make abuse right or relieve one of their responsibility. If you can't care for them, please find soemone who can

apologies , I see you didnt use the word only, I think I am getting too emotional for all of this, and your DS1 and the others will be on my mind now I am sure. Def hiding the thread now

I didn't "let this happen". But I could hardly stop him smacking if he is between DC and me and I didn't see whatever behaviour caused DH to lose his temper. It's not like he is shouting or screaming at us or anything like that. But he does have a really short fuse at the moment and reacts to things before I could stop him or intervene. I am trying to step in and calmly take over when DCs are being naughty/fighting each other/having a tantrum/being completely and loudly irrational and crying for no good reason. (By that I mean really silly things like DC1 wailing "but I wanted to open the door" when I open the door to get a parcel off the postman or something) But the situation has been gradually getting worse up to this point.

Give the children to me and I'll give them the love and safety they deserve and are desperate for.

This is awful, you both sound as bad as each other, really. You are attempting to minimise everything. Those poor poor children.

I know I was completely in the wrong to ever hurt DC1. I was very ill. I know that is not an excuse but I did ask for help so that it didn't happen again and so DC1 was safe. I was terrified of the consequences of admitting to this but I knew his safety was more important than anything else.

Now I am in a similar (but not nearly as bad as) situation again with DH. I don't think he is feeling anything like as awful as I did, his smacking in anger is unacceptable IMO but I don't think he is in danger of causing them real injuries or anything like it. He certainly is not beating them or injuring them but I fear it must be causing them emotional damage.

I think it has taken me this long to see it for what it is because he is nowhere near as bad as my own father was when I was a kid. My dad rarely ever actually smacked us (as far as I can remember) but he used to have a problem with stress and blowing his top and I grew up in fear of his anger.

My DHs anger is nothing like as bad, and he children are not afraid of him normally. DH put DC1 to bed tonight and I could hear them talking together after lights out. I think DC1 was telling him a story about elephants.

The kids home life sounds awful
Neither u or your husband sound like you are coping,
That's not a critisism, it's a comment.
Surely you can see that the kids should not be treated like this,
And that something needs to done.
Tell your cpn / health visitor / gp anyone with some sense and responsibility what it like in your house.
.....or wait til one of your kids says to teacher daddy hits me and I'm frightened ....
Be proactive now,with getting some help, or I bloody well hope someone spills the beans on you.
Wake up you silly woman. That is a critisism, because you need to stop wingeing and take action.

I am not minimising anything. I just think some people have read more into this than there is. I realise there is a problem. I am going to see my gp ASAP. I have already told DH he is out of order and I am trying my damnedest to get well enough to look after my DCs and my DH and make sure this doesn't escalate into something really bad. You are assuming it is already really bad. It isn't yet, so please cut me some slack for trying to do something about it. I have been completely honest about what I have written. It's not code for worse things. What I have written is what actually happened. no more than that.

I don't think I was wingeing either. I only realised today, by posting this thread, that there is a problem and I have already talked to DH about it and intend to see my GP as soon as I can.

OP was ill with PND when she harmed her baby. She did absolutely in getting help and making sure that she wasnt left alone with the baby.

I think OP the fact that you were mistreated as a child is skewing your judgement. It doesnt matter that this isnt as bad as you had it...it is still bad.

Your sons behaviour cannot be expected to improve until your husbands does

Your dh is hitting your son in anger so you cannot be sure he wont 'really hurting' him. All you know is that he hasnt yet Anyway the psychological damage and negative impact on his esteem and behaviour will still be occuring

I dont think anyone needs to read more into this than you have written down-it is bad enough

Are you going to tell your GP or anyonbe about your DP smacking your son?

This thread has turned so ugly. She sees the problem and is asking for help for her children!

Please listen to bejeezus xeno, She speaks sense.

OP. I have massive anger issues due to my childhood but I have NEVER laid a hand on my child (or anyone else for that matter). I knew that I couldn't "control smack" don't believe in this either but that's another issue. I would also NEVER let his dad harm a hair on his head.

I'm sorry you're not well but don't let that be an excuse for what's going on. You are a mother.

You both need to go to gp together and ask for help for both of you.
Dh needs to say what help he needs to alleviate the stress . You both need counselling, support etc.

But in the meantime he has to stop hitting the children. . He can always walk away and not hit, whatever the child does.

Maybe you need a link with foster carers who can take the dc when you are ill as clearly dh cannot cope. or someone coming in full time to help you.

If your five year old is saying " nasty dad is angry he will hit you " then it is bad really bad and time to get more outside help than you are getting. And dad needs to learn to walk away

I am going to tell the GP the truth.
A member of DH extended family had terrible experience with SS 20 years ago and has never recovered (they took her kids away and never let her see them again) so DH is going to be pretty angry with me when I tell him. But as he won't admit he is out of order I think I must. Hopefully it will be a wake up call but I fear my DMIL will never forgive me .
I think his whole family will see it as a betrayal and me being unfaithful to my marriage vows. Feeling so gutted that my mental health has caused all this..

Put them all aside xeno, Do it for your children. No one matters more than they do.

A few hurt feelings mean nothing in the long term health and happiness of your babies.

Your illness caused nothing.

Lots of lone parents work and take care of children and don't hit them in a regular basis.