To think DH should be able to control his temper and not smack DCs when he is angry?

[xeno]

I know I'm not perfect. I spent several years with severe PND so bad I felt DCs shouldn't be left alone in my company. Gradually I have climbed out of my hole and had them for longer periods by myself and am now taking on much more housework and childcare and beginning to be a proper SAHM. Unfortunately I also have fatigue and pain which I am battling to overcome and currently I have some "normal" weeks but am still incapacitated some of the time. We still have a child carer three days a week and a cleaning lady and help from parents&MIL.

But all this has taken its toll on DH. TBH it would help if my parents didn't come round (whole other story) because they are stressy so I am trying to get up in mornings (my worst time) so DH not alone with DCs at breakfast/school run. But I do play my part during day with DC2, after school, cooking meals, evenings, bedtime routine, housework, organising paperwork, banking, etc. and we both do childcare at weekends. but when I am ill I do have to go to bed. Usually for a few days during which the entire house gets trashed.. I have learned to control my temper and now deal (IMO) very calmly with tantrums and stressful situations and keep my temper.

But When DH is angry (most of the time) he smacks DCs for being annoying, or really minor naughtiness. I think he is out of order. He thinks it is because he is under so much pressure. I try to take pressure off him by looking after DCs so he can have a few hours to do his own thing by himself, and he then tells his DM that he has "done everything" and is very stressed and tired because he "hasn't had any rest". I am pissed off that even though I have been getting better and have been much better for last 5 months (apart from physical illness) he seems to be getting worse. Sorry this has turned into a huge rant!

I am not going to enter a smacking debate with a vehement anti smacker

I am not anti-smacking. I have smacked my dd1 in the past and I would do it again if I thought there was need. But she is 7 and I can remember each time I have smacked her, and why I felt it was appropriate.

In this family, I do not think it is appropriate or harmless;

The children have shown that they are scared of their dad. They have experienced physical 'punishment' from their parents since birth, on a weekly basis (although I suspect this is actually more frequent-Partner probably down playing it seeing as how OP is challenging him about it) in anger and frustration. OP thinking ds is behaviourally difficult......

Bejeezus,

"The children have shown that they are scared of their dad."

I have just been through this entire thread and can only see two things that Xeno said that you could take to mean that, but could also take to mean quite the opposite.

"Daddy is the naughtiest because he hit me when I was little and I did not do anything"

Well, the fact the child said "when I was little" kind of indicates that he is dredging his memory to justify his argument, rather than actually being worried about anything imminent.

"don't go downstairs because Daddy will hit you".

This could be interpreted as being worrying but also could be completely normal toddler behaviour. Toddlers often exaggerate and just make things up to play parents off against one another. If you substitute "give you a time out" for hit, you would probably view the whole thing completely differently.

Why don't we wait for the OP to clarify things, rather than making assumptions. Several people have asked but she has not returned.

Hello, I've been very busy and only just read last few posts. I think he is probably smacking them more often than I know about, and it is usually a smack given out of irritation and frustration because the DCs are being naughty, winding each other up or being very slow at doing what he is asking them to do or doing things when he tells them not to. I don't think he is smacking all that hard, but I am trying to bring the children up to think that fighting and hurting others is wrong and their own father is smacking them for things when I believe that an alternative method of discipline would be much more appropriate! The times that really bother me is when he is obviously really angry in his behaviour and reacting IMO very harshly by smacking when the children are annoying him. Sometimes I really think their behaviour is just normal boys mucking about and arguing with each other (which can be annoying when you are stressed) but which is not actually bad, they are small children! For him to smack in that situation just seems completely out of order. I think he expects them to behave much better than a child of that age can, all the time, and he doesn't seem to be able to cope when they get noisy and fight each other or are difficult to reason with. He has also smacked when DC2 is having a tantrum because he is overtired and refusing to go to sleep. This has the effect of making him cry harder initially but then stopping and going to sleep. So DC2 did stop crying and go to sleep quicker than when I was dealing with him in same situation but that doesn't make it right IMO. I used to just cuddle him lying down in the bed with him and just hold him firmly enough that I stopped him getting out of bed, so I was gently restraining him from sitting up. I would only hold him very gently and keep releasing him but grab him and lay him down again every time he got up. Eventually he would give up and I could just cuddle him normally and he would turn over, snuggle down and go to sleep. But it could take hours... Now he is much easier to get too sleep and I can usually reason with him a bit and talk gently and firmly to him and he will eventually give in. It hasn't helped that we are a very disorganised family and routines keep slipping and are not consistent.
Since I challenged him on Saturday he has been more controlled. I don't think he has smacked either DC at all since sat morning. He is still stressed and pretty upset with me for getting at him (how dare I when he has been doing "all the work") but he is listening and talking about it to me and asking for time to think about it and how he feels. I haven't heard from HV or GP yet but I'm not so worried now as my words do seem to have got through to him and he has started to have more self control. I think he still disagrees with me about what is acceptable discipline and finds it extremely hard to admit he might be wrong.

I think the things DC1 said are concerning because he is not the sort of child to make stuff like that up. He is quite a sensitive child and has a strong sense of right and wrong and fairness. He does lie sometimes (to get himself out of trouble) but it is usually obvious. He is not afraid of his father as far as I can tell and he likes to be with him, but I wonder if partly this is because he is trying to be cheerful and make things ok. From quite a young age he would come and cuddle me or pat me on the back when I was very distressed and weeping. He would often come to me and give me a kiss and a cuddle and say "there, you are better now mummy" when I was really depressed. I think he did feel like he had to look after me and help me.

I really have to go now, but I will come back later
Thanks

A man who hates to admit he's wrong, drives too fast when you have asked him not to, brings up your MH issues and hits the DC when you have asked him not to... this is an abusive bully who thinks he is your boss/owner/superior.

Or a man who has a job,a sick wife and two children under 5 for which he has to do the majority of the care. It is hardly surprising that he is stressed and occasionally an imperfect parent.

Anyway, the important thing is that Xeno and her husband are talking and will hopefully find a solution that works for them both. It sounds like their children need two functional parents pulling together.

And here I suggested moving your thread to Relationships, OP, as I thought you might get balanced, helpful advice. Ooops

Well in a sense I think you have, except the argument has become somewhat diverted from what you're actually saying, and more about some people looking for emotional abuse red flags, and some deciding that he's an imperfect angel and you're the big bad wolf. I'm not sure how relevant any of that is.

I do think that sometimes in relationships it becomes about who's more sick; when the pressure is taken off I'm sure it's common for the person who has been holding it together (not that I'm for a second suggesting you were ill through any fault of your own) to then break down. To me, it seems like your husband needs help of his own, he's signalling that he's not coping emotionally. It's great that he has stopped hitting and is more in control. I think it has probably been reassuring for him in a way that you have stepped up and pulled him up on it, you know, you're being the strong person he married. Your illness seems to be festering resentment and guilt, when the better thing would be to try and see that you have overcome (largely) your MH problems together, that you still have difficulties but you're working through them.

I think it would be helpful to encourage him to see his GP about his panic and stress problems.

To try and talk through, without judgement, how you've both been feeling now and over the past few years.

And to decide - together - on a solid, calm, discipline strategy, when that's applicable etc. Maybe parenting classes or books would help there. And I think he needs to count to 10 when he can feel himself reaching breaking point with stress/temper with them, if possible leaving the room for a short time if he still feels like he's losing control.

HTH