Support thread for those in Emotionally abusive relationships number 7

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Financial abuse Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.

Little its not you who's failed. You tried. He didn't. Just cos he says so, don't make it so...

Little, seems like they come to you for emotional support, which is so important.

How do you know if it is EA? I have just left someone because I just knew I wouldn't be happy. We used to fight a lot about the way he spoke to me, but I ended up thinking I was crazy and just let him do it/behaved in a way that avoided him being that way. I felt scared of his reaction every time I did something wrong (like left something in the wrong place)

Everyone says he is controlling and abusive. I still can't properly see it and end up defending him. Because I behaved badly a long time ago I think it's not being able to confront my behaviour that makes me want him to be 'bad' too so I don't feel so bad.

I just don't know. I know if I list examples people will say of course that is EA. So I don't want to do that. My other question is....how long will it take to look back and realise? It's been 10 days. I have been with him since childhood and feel like I am totally conditioned...but what if I am wrong, and he is a decent person, and I am just mad and misinterpreting? I'd like some clarity...I really hope it comes soon. I need to know either way.

Littlebouse provide them a place to chill with their friends and order pizza late at night and you just might be remembered forever

niffler welcome.
Have you read the links at the top of the thread? You will probably find your Ex there somewhere. Also the Bible of this thread is the Lundy Bancroft book. Once read you will never be in doubt again. And you will feel better quite quickly if you can keep away from him. Detach!

I think I had a bad time today because for over a week I was with normal happy people and I took my armour off. Then my family came back and Whoosh I am back in crazy land... all the past conditioning triggered me off again.

I know I am OK now with the VNM. Seven months together without a cross word or an upset. It seems like a miracle but that is just what a good relationship feels like!! And his family are so relaxed, nobody takes umbrage or gets hurt feelings or snaps. So I don't either! This is a first for me as my parents and sibs trigger me and my FWH and DC do.

I'm planning pancakes and go karts Pink!

niffler hello! I think your confusion would point a lot of people on here to the conclusion that he probably is/was EA...we call it spaghetti head.

Personally i don't think people jump to label others EA and if you "know" we all would then he probably is and you are just not ready to let it go and see it yet....we defend ourselves so well from the truth to survive in the relationship that 10 days is nothing to undo all the odd double think that helps us to survive.

We all have to forgive ourselves, we've all done bad things...perhaps it's time you let go of your own guilt?? Then you can see what was going on with him?

For me I was not sure until I read Lundy Bancroft "Why does he do that" and found that he had been inside my head rummaging around...such an accurate description of my OH that it was slightly spooky (and weird because I had just accepted it as normal)

I agree; for me it was hearing/reading other people describe the things which went on in my own relationship, exactly as it had happened to them. The degree to which they seem to operate almost to a script is quite something to get your head around.

Hi all, thanks for the welcome :). I have looked at the links but still unsure. Lots of it is him, but I find myself grasping on the bits that are NOT like him or that he isn't like that all the time. He is so clever and inteligent that he would never do anything too overt, and could always explain why he did it in such a reasonable way that I just had to agree. I did have a mini breakthrough today where I showed a colleague a text he sent and she said: "that is emotional abuse and you do not have to take that" then made me delete the text. BUT....I still defend him as he was lashing out in anger and hurt.

I am trying to detach, but struggling as I know how much he is hurting and it is all my fault (for the guilt thing I have another thread in another name - PM me if interested to know). He is very insecure and part of me just wants to make him feel better.

I have ordered the book. Spaghetti head is such a brilliant way to describe how I am feeling foolonthehill

Niffler you have stayed with him because you accepted the abuse which others would not. There will be a reason for that which will become clear. Making him feel better when he is treating you unkindly is a sign that you are probably a rescuer.
Keep reading and posting. We all know how you feel.

I would like to bet that he is a "victim" in the Lundy book and that you are a rescuer.

Join the club

Ha ha X post Littlehouse

yay for pancakes and go-karts ...don't let him have you play a walk on part in your children's lives...they need you, and don't you ever forget it.

at your DDs assessment of her own cake...she has no doubt forgotten at whose knee she learned (for the moment the arrogance of youth!)

Littlehouse: Mine are smaller than yours (under 10) and I've only been gone for four months, so it's all new to me... our XHs do sound pretty similar though - staying in the family home, taking them on holidays etc - and only TODAY DH has just scuppered a weekend away that I had planned with my family by saying that he 'needs' them on the day I had planned. I cannot fight him because it is so exhausting and I just don't have the energy for it. Also, I know he will not let these things go - I will say no but he will send email after email telling me why I am wrong, until I just give up and end up in tears, feeling like I'm being an unreasonable bitch.

I know I win though, because I also have a Nice Boy who thus far (although I fully acknowledge that my Twat Radar is f*cked) has just been an ocean of calmness and niceness. (Like yours, he also seems to have an extended family who are all nice and like each other...) I was ill at the weekend and he just sat by me for hours and stroked my head and told me to sleep. I apologised constantly. He was just... concerned. It felt weird. I felt like a baby, being mothered. I guess that's just normal compassion...??!

ANYWAY. I can't do the nice holidays either. Or provide the nice calm family life for them that I wanted to, or be the 'home' that they 'return' to. That part breaks my heart and I feel like a failure too. I wish that XHs house wasn't their main 'home'. And those normal doubts, they surface all the time: maybe it was me... How can I pretend to be a good mother when I 'left' them? How can I fail at this BASIC thing? Why couldn't I stick at it for longer? Why didn't I give XH more chances?

My plan is to provide a nice kitten (eventually), and to just let them chill out. The other day I gave my older one a 'luxury bath'. I put out candles and bubble bath and soft lighting and let her read for an hour in the bath. She loved it. I've also let them get into a routine of watching tv in bed with me. Crap telly that DH hates (girls' stuff!). The other night we also ordered a pizza in too. I try to connect with them emotionally and let them express their emotions in healthy ways (I bought the older one a posh diary, and she writes in it every day). The younger one I try to give some attention to where I can (not always easy). I read to them at bedtime (I never used to). I just try to be a BETTER mum than the one I was (pretty much drunk or working all the time). I don't know if I will succeed and it is hard to fight those feelings of failure all the time. We can just do the best we can, I guess, and model a good (and calm) family life...

xxxx

Mr BigHouse and Mr LittleHouse must be related!!

Big you are doing exactly what I do on bad days which is to beat yourself up over having to leave when you did it to save yourself. Nobody leaves their children unless they are in extreme distress. We both know that but we don't believe our own feelings really matter enough to justify our actions. I can see that YOU really had to get out, but I can't see it for myself.

Like niffler I still can't see clearly what FWH did to me to make me so distressed. FWH is so clever, so popular, so rich and famous that nobody sane would leave him for a life of struggle and relative poverty. But I was behaving in a way I didn't like, and I was angry and hard and bitter. What model was that for my girls?

The VNM and I have a long term fantasy that we provide a large rambling country eco-house for all our (6) DC and elderly parents. All will be welcome to drop in and out, to work there or to stay as they wish. It may happen, but even if it doesn't the fantasy is a comfort to me.

Hi all,

Apologies for not posting in a while.
I have been lurking occasionally but not been in a strong enough place to offer support.
SS and police involvement regarding past incidents with ex & ds has been hard as it has again driven home the seriousness of where I had been.
I was filled with self-doubt as to whether it was the right thing to do (As it is such a BIG thing).
With a fence that high - people HAVE to choose a side. It hurts when people choose (even if it makes them wankers). Ex's sister and dad sent dd an easter present but not ds. THIS WAS NEVER DS FAULT. Shame on them for making that choice. And SHAME on ex for letting them.

Aside from that life with my two little ones is a happy one, they are what matters in all of this - to hell with everyone else.

big & little house I'm sure you find your position very hard.
Never give up or let your exH making things difficult get to you (although easier said than done). Your little ones have a strong mummy who love them and want what is best for them - They need you.

I think we all feel guilty (even parents in non-abusive situations) for not doing enough for our kids. Its is all relative. Mummies who have been with an abusive partner like us, feel guilt for being there and in some way being responsible for having this person in our lives and childrens lives.
Getting away is the first step. Being the parent we could and should have been if they had never been, without the guilt is where the work takes place.
(For me anyway)

Love to all xx

Hi Bobs sorry they are being fwits over the Easter eggs...we've had something similary here. So spiteful!
I am just trying to be the best parent I can. Not perfect, but good enough, and a darn site better than fwit. Have asked him to move the rest of his stuff out, and will see the solicitor on Friday.

similary....?

I don't know if this is the right place to put this but I have to get it out.

When I had been seeing my ex for a short time, nearly 3 years ago, there was a party at his house. I walked to the shop with a mutual male friend to get cigarettes. I had had alot to drink. When we returned, my ex threw his friend out. I didn't think too much of this as I had too much too drink. We went upstairs and I took my top and skirt off to get into bed. He started shouting at me. He was so angry. I was lying on the bed and crying and then I passed out. When I woke up I was confused. I asked if we'd had sex. He said yes. I asked if we'd used anything, He said we used a condom. I was still very drunk and confused. Three things bad happened. I only remember two, so almost couldn't comprehend the 3rd. I thought 'it's his first relationship, he was drunk, he made a mistake...'

But he didn't, I did.

We stayed together, he behaved so well until we moved into together and he started to become abusive and had an 'unhealthy relationship with porn'.
Oh my god I started to feel, the denial was chipping away, he didn't make a mistake, I did. And I've given this man a daughter. I am having such a hard time dealing with this.

Hasn't he given you a daughter?

Some of them are not fit to live with, but their DNA makes lovely children...

Hi Bobits and Pink

The "pancakes and go karts" recipe has been a great success and I am feeling SO much better about everything after some quality time with the DC.
You are of course right oh wise ones. My DC need me and love me to bits and I must never forget that even when I am ground down.

Bobits the strength of this forum is that even in the middle of a bad time you can see what other people should be doing, although your own life seems chaotic and shrouded in FOG. Now you have the power of MN and us to spot Red Flags for you you won't get caught out again. Your mistake was to give your heart away to someone who didn't deserve it and give the benefit of the doubt to a "twunt". Don't blame yourself - just move forward older and wiser.

Did DD share her egg with DS?

After getting abuse by email yesterday and then utter reason and niceness today I am excusing yesterday's behaviour due to him being hurt and now feel like I had no right to be posting here.

But I am sure I will feel differently again soon. I just feel so uneasy and confused.

You all sound like wonderful, strong women. I am grateful that I have done this now before children...though incredibly sad as we were about to start trying. :(

Yeah pink and little, I wouldn't change her for a moment - she's perfect :).

I'm just coming to terms with what happened that night - it makes me feel sick. After I had passed out unconscious, my ex had to remove my under wear to have sex with me. I was out cold. This was after throwing our friend out in jealousy. He got so angry. You don't have sex with someone when your angry, and you don't have sex with someone who is unconscious when your angry. :(

Niffler glad to see you here :)

Niffler you are doing fine. Just observe his behaviour and all will be made clear. he is doing the Mr Nasty /Mr Nice flip flop at the moment. If he had been Mr Nasty at the beginning you wouldn't have gone anywhere near him would you? The nice phase is called "hoovering" and they all seem to do it after a bout of nastiness to suck us back in. All will be sweetness and light for a while and then it all starts again. Round and round and round! It's not called a Cycle of Abuse for nothing.

But not for YOU because you have spotted what is happening.
Feeling uneasy and confused is how these headfuck merchants make you feel. You deserve better and you wouldn't want to bring children into a family where behaviour like this is normal would you?

Bobits it takes time to process these things. And to admit to yourself how bad it was. Be gentle on yourself!

Thanks Little...feeling a bit clearer now, I think.

Hi to Bobits

^You don't have sex with someone when your angry, and you don't have sex with someone who is unconscious when your angry^ no you don't. Unless of course you are an entitled twat who regards their "partner" as a possession rather than a sentient human being who deserves respect.

Also to Niffler...your Extwat has similar views about you and your body...the choices he makes are his and reveal him for who he is. Stay strong and stay away

fool is ...that these poor excuses for men do this...grrrrr

Morning all.

Lots of
Ove and strength to you all.

I am furious with my h right now. Have am appt with woman from safer places next thurs. I have to get out of here ASAP. I am not in danger btw. He is just a cunt who is driving me nutty.