to feel really threatened by my OH's dead fiancee?

[badabing123]

Feel horrible writing this but it's beginning to eat me up inside.

Am a late 30something who is in a 1.5yr rel with a man whose late fiancee passed away with the Big C while she was in her mid 30s.
We actually met not long after she's passed away (4 months) - I'd come out of a 10yr rel which had been abusive and very sad-making six months earlier. But I pulled myself together and got out and since then have worked on getting my self esteem back and my life on track.
I'm happy, for the most part I am.

There may be some who think we got together too quickly; maybe we did who knows, but it felt right and we've largely kept under the radar and moved at our own pace. It is what it is.

We have a good relationship. In many ways, both our experiences of 'loss' have given us an understanding and greater compassion, I suppose. Or at least a determination to want to grasp happiness when it comes along. We both want to build a future together and one that involves kids which, as I am in my late 30s, is in some ways something of a relief.

But - and you knew there was a but coming! - however good our relationship is (and there are times I am so happy that I can almost touch the happiness it's so tangible) I am just eaten away by the thought, the fear that however good our relationship it will never bear the same significance as that with his dead fiancee.

1- I am happy for him to continue a relationship with her family, im supportive of this
2- I'm ok with photo of her out on show (i wouldnt think of objecting, though I'm relieved it's now only 2 photos instead of the 7 on the living room shelf when we met)
3 - Ive been supportive of the charitable fundraising he did in her memory.

I am saying the above to make clear that I dont think I am a 'bad person'. I am fair. But I just wonder where I fit in - sometimes there is just no space for me.

Things I object to (and yes, HATE)
1/Her facebook page still up and replete with photos of them together, beaches at sunset, Paris etc etc. Getting friend suggestions with her photo. (nb there's no way I can ask to take this down, it's not my place to do so, but its tremendously hurtful to see this and realise that the affectionate gestures I thought were for me are just replicas of those he gave her)

2/OH telling me that her final request had been that he call his first daughter after her. I replied 'No way'. Not doing that at all. His retort was that he wouldnt push it, was only repeating what she had said.

3/OH wanting her family to come to our wedding. I'm not happy with this; it's our day. I don't want to be there thinking that there are people there wishing I was someone else.

4/Gravestone wording: this was somewhat of an unexpected surprise before xmas as I had assumed this had all been done. Im absolutely sick at the prospect that the wording is going to include wording such as 'fiancee of'. I dont know, Im just dreading the worst what it could be.He doesnt know; its anyone's guess at this point, but it makes me feel sick even thnking about it. Even in death, it feels, she is still 'the one'.

I'm a good person: Someone dying of cancer at such a young age; it's deeply sad. I am sorry for her, Im sorry for her family and I am very touched by how my OH stood by her and supported her during such a difficult time.

But I'm not a stand-in; Im not a replacement.
I have talked these fears through calmly with my OH, he says I am absolutely not, that it's about us building a future. That our pasts are our past.

Yes, I totally get this. I mean, it's not like I had an easy time either (violent ex, mental cruelty) but I got up and moved on. It's not unreasonable to want to be 1st choice. Im not trying to vanquish his past, or remove her memory (not at all) but I feel there is no space for me.

He says he loves me and wants to have a future together - but you know, these things make me feel awful!!! I feel so awful.

What I am scared of most is how his past is not his past; it is always going to be part of the present and the future. We were getting on so well before xmas and then whoosh! news about the gravestone and all the fears (still unresolved) about that immediately surface. It feels like something to do with his past is always going to 'pop up' out of the blue and make me feel sh*t.

AIBU to want to be 1st choice? When I told him I wanted to feel this, for him to tell me that - he said I was being 'ridiculous', no one says stuff like that'. He says I am the one he wants to build a future with, but faced with a %$££%£% Facebook page filled with reams of endless romantic photos and other things besides - I am scared that eg even if we got married and had kids - I could never 'be enough'. I would always be thinking he was wishing I was her.

I am scared that because of my age I am settling for something that say 10 yrs ago I would have walked away from. I love him - but I hate his past.
I can accept that it's his past but I loathe the way it's coming into my present and my future.

Even worse, it is making me dislike HER (ashamed to admit this). As much as I objectively feel sorry for her I cant bear the hold she has now, even in death. And you can't compete with someone who is dead.

At least with an ex who is alive you can b*tch about them - but you can't do that when someone is dead. You just have to ...eat it?

AIBU? or how can I possibly deal with this better (without resorting to the vodka bottle :) )?

I'm not sure AIBU is the right place for yhis as It can get a bit heated. I suggest asking mNHQ to move it to relationships :)
That aside, I think you need a frank and honest discussion with your OH about how this is all affecting you. Obviously she was a big part of his life, but he needs ro move on if he wants his relationship with you to work. If he can't move on, then harsh as it may be, I think you would be better off walking away.

Agree with Lack, maybe couples counselling would help

I'd second Daisy. The responses here are heated and, um, not always best for those looking for support.

I think there definitely needs to be more conversations and compromise from both sides wrt your future togetheer. For example, I completely agree that naming any child you may have after her would be inappropriate for you, however you could let the FB page go? I appreciate it must be a difficult time for him but he is the one who has chosen to get into a new relationship so must accept that certain aspects and wishes of his late fiancé may now not be acceptable. However don't hate her, that makes you sound bitter, when you have sounded really supportive so far.

I'd agree that AIBU is maybe not the best place for this. Your feelings are very understandable, as are his. You definately need to have a long talk about all of this, open and honestly - counselling may well be the best place to start.

I don't think that you are being that unreasonable, actually.

Fair enough if you'd said that there were no present-time factors making you feel like this, it was just your mind leading you to your partner's past, then I would say you were BU. But yes, the fiancee's family still being involved in your lives so heavily when he has no children with his deceased fiancee (I am right in saying that, aren't I?), the photos still up in your home, the name of any future daughter (WTF?!) I think I would be rattled by this, too.

I think that you need to have a frank discussion with your partner. Tell him that whilst you are sympathetic to his memories and to his fiancee's untimely passing, you think that a lot of his behaviours aren't allowing him sufficient closure which in turn is harming your relationship.

In the short term, I would block her Facebook page. You can't make anyone remove it and nor should they (her family, I mean) but you are just tormenting yourself by looking at it. Block it from your page and stop looking at it. He is clearly still close to her family which in a way is a nice thing; he shouldn't have to stop contact with people that he was close to because the person that connected them has gone. However, I think that inviting them to your wedding ceremony is inappropriate. I would suggest inviting thrm to the evening reception only. They probably don't want to be at the wedding ceremony anyway. Not being harsh on you but I imagine that seeing your dead daughter's fiance marrying someone else would be unbearably difficult. Evening reception invitation would suggest that your DP is thinking of them but showing respect to you at the same time.

Sorry, it sounds like a rotten situation.

I really really really understand.

I met Mr House a few months after his first wife died. As with you, everything just felt right. I had severe misgivings about the short amount of time since she had died but she had been ill for a long time (about 15 years) and in the last five or six had needed round the clock care, couldn't speak, walk etc, so in many ways he had done his grieving already.

No one would have blamed him if he had styled himself a widower even before she died but he didn't: he remained faithful to her right up to the end and built his whole life around their unsought circumstances. This to me is one of the best things about him, the fact that he was so loyal and devoted and yes he is doing it all over again. The fact that your DP's love for his former DP did not die with her is a GOOD thing.

Of course your 'jealousy' (for want of a better word) is understandable and you hit the nail on the head when you say you can bitch about a living exP whereas you can't about a dead one, but honestly he is the man he is because of his relationship with her. I do hope in time you will be grateful.

Yes there will be obstacles to overcome but his real friends will be happy for him that he has you and grateful to you for making him happy again. The others you don't need to worry about.Our wedding was stuffed to the gunnels with their friends who bore me no grudges whatsoever.

And yes, there are negotiaitions to be done: (e.g perhaps his late P's name as a middle name??) but it sounds to me like he is open to this.

Ultimately if you are uncomfortable with it you may have to walk away, but enough of this nonsense about your age . Time is on your side whatever you may think!

You are absolutely not unreasonable to be feeling as you do (perhaps as with me there is a bit of you that cannot believe your luck so is trying to sabotage it?). Sound to me like you've found a prize. It worked for me,I can see no reason why it shouldn't work for you.

Take care

yes, it's not a great situation. No kids from the OH's relationship, I have no kids either. To all intents and purposes, this out to be a clean slate, but it's not.

My dh's girlfriend before me died, so I suppose I understand a bit of what your feeling. He'd only been with her for about 3 months, so not as long as your partner, but I sometimes feel that she was much better suited to him than I am (I knew her a bit too) and that if she hadn't died they'd have stayed together and he'd have married her.

However, my answer to you is a (hopefully nice) YABU. The vast majority of people have serious relationships before finding the person they marry, although usually they end through breaking up. Would you have any objection to there still being facebook pictures of them together if they had broken up rather then her dying? The fact that he put his arm around her (for example) as well as you doesn't mean he loves you any the less.

Dh's girlfriend's mother came to our wedding, although just the service, and I have to say that I didn't have any problem with this, I thought it was a nice thing for her to be able to do. Although I'm sure it was a hard day for her I am sure she wasn't wishing I were her daughter. I'm sure she was happy that dh had found me.

I agree that expecting you to call your daughter her name would be a bit unreasonable, maybe you could use it as a middle name?

Where I think you are being unreasonable is not really how you feel but the fact that you seem to be going on about this to your partner. Do you really want to make him feel guilty that he loved her and grieves for her? What do you actually want him to do - pretend she never existed? I don't think he can do that.

I do understand how you feel though and I occasionally feel similar but try to remember that his time with and feelings for her have no bearing on how he feels about you.

Thanks Sarah.
I take great comfort from your words. I am struggling with HOW exactly to overcome these obstacles. I am mostly logical, calm and rational about this and try to be fair and compassionate. I am just struggling with the jealousy. I cant bear feeling second best.

I think, from reading your post again, that what you actually want is for him to say 'I love you more than I loved her'. Do you think, perhaps on a subconsious level, that this is what you want?

@MediumOrchid: No, I absolutely dont want to make him feel bad for thinking about her with love. I do understand that love does not end with death.
What I am struggling with is feeling that whatever I do, however good I am, this will never be enough.
I don't want to be a sorry consolation prize for anyone (I am not!!!!)

@MediumOrchid: do I want him to say that? Honestly, now you ask me that (and no one has ever put it to me before) yes, yes I do.
???? I know. It sounds dreadful doesnt it.

You are not second best!!! You are second chronologically. Not the same thing at all! .

I think Medium Orchid makes a very good point. If you have a RL friend you can sound off to as a sort of safe place, this would probably be better than risking making your DP feel guilty.

Also it is just possible that he feels a little bit guilty himself...you know he loves you to bits and if this first DP hadn't died he would never have met you. But we can't live in the realm of what ifs forever. We paly the cards we are dealt, and it seems you have both got an excellent hand atm!

What a difficult situation for you.

The naming your firstborn DD after her and inviting her parents to your wedding is too much. And thoughtless, has your OH not thought about their feelings on seeing someone else getting married to their DDs finacee?

I don't think that's really such a bad thing to feel. I think lots of people wish that their partner had no history of previous partners, and wish that their first kiss and experiences had been their very first. It is hard to accept that our partners loved people before us, and harder still when that person was taken away from them through death rather than through breaking up.

I think it's really good that you're working through your feelings and that you don't want to hurt your partner over this.

Good advice already given. I don't see a problem with the headstone, he was her fiance at the time of her death. I think it is unreasonable of her to expect another woman to name her baby after her, however, she was very ill so I would just politely refuse if the situation occurs. I think you are well within your rights not to have her family at the wedding, as you say, it is your day and you don't want people there wishing the bride was someone else.

You have been supportive but now you have been together for 1.5 years I think he needs to support you too. I would expect him to put her photos away where only he can go and see them when he wants too. He can have a relationship with her family but you don't have to, there are no children so I think their reationship will fade in time. I think it would help to have a professional involved, even if it is just for them to point out how it is effecting you, without you having to be the one to tell him you don't want to keep hearing about her so much.

Are there compromises to be had? E.g. Invite one or two members of her family who are particularly close to your DH to the ceremony (in capacity of close friends of your DH), and use the name for a DD middle name (or maybe a version of her name, depending on what it is).

I feel great sympathy for you.

I can understand your feelings about the gravestone, too.

He isn't her fiance any more. If he is to be your husband, to be named as her fiance on a gravestone is, I would have thought, inappropriate.

What I'm trying to say is, don't think that you're a bad person for feeling this way. It's natural, and it's a hard situation to be in. What would be unreasonable would be to let this seriously affect your relationship with your fiance. He has told you he loves you and wants to spend his life with you - believe him!

Also, I think that the concept of 'the one' and 'soulmates' probably aren't helping here (I know you didn't use these words, but with films and books etc these concepts sneak into our thinking!). If you think that she was his 'one' or soulmate, then you would have to be second best. But I don't think relationships work like that. He met her, fell in love, and had she not died he would have married her and probably been very happy. But she did die, so he met you, fell in love, and will now marry you and be very happy. It doesn't mean that he would have been happier with her, or that your relationship is second best.

oh, lots of good advice given already. Really feel for you.

Had a friend with a similar predicament, only the deceased woman had been the guy's wife and mother of his kids. It was different, this guy fought with his own feelings and kept pushing her away intermittently.

She walked away eventually saying to me 'I can't compete with an angel'.

But as I said, that was a very different situation.

I know it's trivial but on the Facebook point - have they reported her death to Facebook? This is the link www.facebook.com/help/contact.php?show_form=deceased. You can't be the only person getting inappropriate friend suggestions etc - this way they could keep the page (people can still post memories etc on the Wall) but it's a step in recognising that she is no longer with them.

Many people must feel like this too when their partners ex left them rather than died. It was not their partners choice therefore will they always think of you as second best? The difference is that, like you say, you can moan/bitch about them without feeling guilty.

The only way for you to move forward is for you to stop feeling guilty about feeling the way you do. Accept that it is only natural. The past can't be changed. Your partner has chosen you and is with you because he wants to be. It all happened less than 2 years ago, so it's still raw, but will become easier as time passes.

My uncle has stayed in contact with his dead wifes family (us) for more than 30 years. I remember a conversation with his new partner and she was saying the same as you.We reassured her that we wished him well and were pleased that he had found someone lovely like her to make him happy.

I think your feelings are natural but don't feel guilty about it. Talk it through with others but don't heap the guilt on to your partner. He probably feels guilty enough anyway but he has to move on and is happy with you. I second inviting the family to the evening reception only. His ex partners family should, hopefully, understand.

Don't give your any future DD her name at all.

You may come to regret/resent it and it would be awful for those feelings to be attached to your own child in any way.

Any children you have will be a person in their own right and not a tribute to a deceased ex of your husbands.

I think the gravestone wording is inappropriate too. Tbh. But I can also imagine that this would be less of an issue for you (as it only marks her life position at the time of her death) if there weren't so many other links to her in your life.

I also think the photos need to go.