Leaving an emotionally abusive relationship - my story

[preciouslittlegems]

Sorry, this is long! I'm just not sure what to think about a conversation I had earlier with DH. He was not joking and this is set in the context of a relationship that has broken down and we no longer share a bedroom. He is bitter as he wants things to return to the way they were, for us both to compromise. I don't want to because he has been quite severely empotionally abusive and I don't want to get emotionally involved with him again, as I feel it is not a good place for me to be. I am being supported the local DV service because of the abuse. I am finding it really hard to leave the relationship because I don't know how he will react and today's conversation has made me even more uncertain (he has also threatened to kill himself many times).

I was preparing dinner with a sharp knife. He came up to me and told me not to stab him with it (he said the same thing last week). I took it as a joke and replied I'm not in the habit of killing people. He, speaking quite seriously, told me that he often thinks about killing people and asked if I do. I said no, of course not. He said he was surprised given the state of our relationship. He said he thinks less about stabbing people and more about suffocating and poisoning people. He said he lays awake at night thinking about it a lot. I was stunned at this point but decided to find out more. I asked if there was any one in particular he thought about killing (I could see where this was heading) and he said it was me he thought about, in particular poisoning. I calmly told him that he would go to prison and he said only if found out. I told him that he would be a prime suspect and he then went on a bit about things I do that upset him, including sharing with family and friends things he would rather I didn't (the abuse). I asked how he planned to poison me he said he wouldn't tell me because I would run off and phone someone and tell them. I asked if that was the only reason he wouldn't tell me, as I would not have a clue how to poison someone. He said that I have no idea what he knows and that he knows a lot more than I realise.

I sound very calm above but I don't feel it. This has freaked me out and is the reason I don't leave as I am unsure what he is capable of. He has mentioned poison to me a few times, e.g. told me there is poison in my cup of tea he has made me as he hands it to me (for no reason).

Am I being paranoid? Should I laugh it off? Am I unable to take a joke? He was definitely not joking but if I asked him about it again or involved other people, he would say I couldn't take a joke. He regularly makes really nasty comments to me. Since the incident he has been in a bad mood and barely talked to me apart from to shout a bit and criticise various things I have done and the state of the house.

I would just value any views. Do you think he has said this to frighten me to behave and be a proper wife again and not leave, or is there something more sinister to worry about? I feel this is the last straw but I am scared. I feel trapped.

I really don't think I've done that much - would hope anyone would help someone in this situation... It has to be said though, my DH has been much better behaved since I've had a divorce lawyer's business card in my purse!

Hope to get the applications issued tomorrow and served in time for the hearing on Friday. Once we get Precious and the DSs back into the house then she can catch her breath.

Following this thread Precious and am absolutely rooting for you and your Sons. Sending you strength and hope.

Ravenous has been fabulous - so take the praise, Ravenous!

Abendbrot - he actually robbed me of 19 years of my life, not just 3. It is so upsetting to realise this but i wouldn't change my DS's for the world.

I just hope that I can get back in the house very soon, as our current living arrangments are not easy for any of us, although it has been lovely to have my friend to stay with. Her BF finished with her on Sunday, so she is upset too. in the long term I really just want to move to a smaller house that is mine and the DC's. Our house has too many difficult memories. I want a fresh start.

You've gone through so much, precious. You've had to hold it together for the dc when you were living in the marital home and you've had to be doubly strong over the past 10 days or so for them, and to undertake all of the tasks that have been necessary to ensure that you can look forward to a brighter future.

It's not surprising that you're feeling under the weather - your immune system has taken a hammering and what's held in in one place, comes out in another.

The tears you shed today are only to be expected; you became immured to living the way he wanted, abnormal became normal, and it's only when you began to look at the way you have been living in detail that you began to see how much he impaired your life and impacted on your pysche.

Those tears are healthy; you can still feel despite his best efforts to turn you into a subservient shadow of the woman you are. All you have to do now is to clear the hurdle that will determine where you will be living in the foreseeable future and, once you have a permanenent home again, you'll be able to let go and cry yourself out.

At some point in the future counselling may help you discover why you gave away your power and why you tolerated such abuse, but I suspect that you already possess the insight to make sure that you don't make the same mistakes again.

As for how he'll react when notice is served on him, as I've said he'll be incandescent with rage but I suspect that he'll try to play the 'broken man', bewildered and confused as to how his marriage has reached such an impasse when all he'd tried to do was work hard for you and the dc blah blah, his mother's death, blah blah, grief and depression blah blah, denial/muddying of the facts as stated in your affidavit blah blah, and promises by the score that he'll have no intention of ever keeping yada, yada, yada.

In short, he'll appear to be a reasonable man overwhelmed by what's happened and is happening, assuming some responsibility (that he doesn't feel) while simultaneously subtly blaming you and your unreasonableness in leaving the marital home and causing the (in his mind, temporary) breakdown of the marriage.

Please ask your solicitor to phrase your affidavit in such a way as to make it clear that after years of emotional abuse, you left the marital home in fear of your life.

Good luck tomorrow and in the days ahead - you WILL get through this and you WILL come out stronger the other side.

Izzy - you have given a good description of how he is currently behaving, from what I have seen from his communications. He has also played it this way for the last 2 years, admitting a bit but saying he wants the marriage to work and that I am not trying. I was really no longer interested and I do feel guilty that I did not just finish it 2 years ago. I did try to end it but he begged for 6 more months but I could never see him in the same way again after the way he had been treating me and the DC's. His current communications are admitting a bit but then saying that he really wants the marriage to work and that marriage guidance is the answer. He seems to take little responsibility for his actions.

and luckily you also have Izzy on side who can tell you everything you need to know about the man who has been stifling the life out of you for so long, so you won't be taken in by his nonsense again. So it's hurrah for Izzy too. (You prescience is uncanny, Izzy!)

Sleep well, precious, and good luck tomorrow.

Yes, I agree totally - thank you Izzy - you're observations are really valuable. It's a shame that the professionals he has gone to did not consider something more underlying than depression and only humoured me when I suggested other possibilities.

Precious, what you said about his professionals echoes other similar things I have seen on here. I am incredulous that so called therapists/counsellors/psychiatrists etc are so easily mislead. I remember seeing a post from a woman on here recently having therapy because of MH issues that were exacerbated, if not caused, by her DH. He was getting directly involved in what should have been private sessions and the therapist allowed it. He was telling the psychiatrist what was wrong with her and the psychiatrist took his word for it!

Surely part of the training (and the whole fucking job!) is to be able to spot manipulative people with genuine personality disorders or mental illnesses who are trying to hide it?

It worries me how many people like your ex are slipping through the net because of incompetent so called "professionals". If he does at any point get any evaluations of his mental health done due to this (unlikely but still) I would ask if you can have a second opinion!

DISCLAIMER: Not saying they are all like this but there seems to be a worrying number who are, if the posts on MN are anything to go by!

thinking of you precious.

you've come such a long way in such a short time and i'm so glad you got out that night.

even if you weren't in immediate danger at that moment (and who knows maybe you were) it was your moment you know? when things dawned on you as to just how bad/mad/whatever he was and that you were not safe in that marriage - you seized it, communicated with people here and left! thank goodness.

i hope people reading this who are in abuse situations take note of how once you get out your mind can start working again, you can start to see the bigger picture and put pieces together and have some space to start feeling your own feelings and making your own judgements again. i hope it inspires someone else to leave and get that space and distance.

everything crossed for the occupation order (or whatever it's called) going through in your favour and you and the kids being able to return home, change the locks and have a safe space of your own again. i'd recommend changing things - as petty as it sounds even if you can't redecorate move the furniture around, buy one thing that is totally you and he wouldn't have liked or you wouldn't have inflicted on him if he was still there and put it in a prominent space. make the house your own in whatever small ways you can and encourage the kids to too maybe - let them pick something new for their rooms or something - mix up the routines and do things differently and your style iyswim.

keep going x

At the end of the day you dont need to feel guilty about anything, and it takes 2 people to want to make the marriage work. He had those last 2 years to prove to you that he was willing to try - yo gave him the chance and he made life worse, which is hardly the actions of a man desperate to save his marriage. Its no wonder that you dont feel anything for him - you wanted him to step up and take responsibility and change how the dynamics of the relationship were. He didnt do it. You are not in love with him, however much you might feel about him as an individual with any 'problems' You cant build a marriage on pity, you both need love and commitment. You did plenty of years of love and commitment before the last 2 years, it was his turn. He is only saying the things he thinks you want to hear but its 2 years too late. No one can force you to stay in a marriage if you dont want to, its your choice. You dont NEED any reasons (although you have plenty) you just dont want to be with him any more. end of.
so pleased you got out. so pleased you are naming what he has done. so pleased you are allowing those in 'authority' to say what will happen. Often passing the torch to the solicitors is the greatest relief. They have the power to enforce what he has not been listening to from you for years, and they will MAKE him. Then he knows that you have the power of the law behind you. Good luck xxx

Thank you again for your very wise posts. NettleTea I like the way you described this, that I tried for 17 years but gave up on the last 2 years, and placed the emphasis on him to change his ways or we could no longer have a marriage. It makes me feel less guilty. Up until that point I had been an attentive wife, who tried hard to make him happy. Our sex life was not great but quite a bit of that was down to him losing interest (I suspect the porn viewing contributed to that). During the last 2 years he needed to show he could be consistently pleasant. That pleasant, calm behaviour was his normal way of being, allowing for a calm and happy household. Sometimes he would manage a week or two of near normal behaviour and then he would be keen to point out that I hadn't noticed how hard he was trying and then often revert back to a bad mood. i wanted pleasant behaviour to be his default position, whereas it seemed a real effort for him to maintain this. It annoyed him when after a short while of behaving well, I did not rush back into his arms and invite him back into the bedroom. That's because I knew it wouldn't last.

Anyway, the papers are served and it's off to court on Monday. I feel really mean but, as you say, I did give him 2 years to change. I am also looking at alternative accommodation in case I'm not successful, as there are no guarantees.

What has your solicitor told you, precious? Is she confident? And has it been made clear in your affidavit that you fled the marital home in fear of your life?

They have the power to enforce what he has not been listening to from you for years, and they will MAKE him I'm sorry to say that you are so very wrong, nettle. No one and no body can MAKE another person do anything they do not want to do and the law can only act against those who have broken it.

Precious's post is littered with responses from those who laboured, and are most probably stll labouring, under the misapprehension that all she had to do was leave the marital home and her dh would apprehended by the police, his computer seized, he woud be arrested and/or sectioned, she could move back to the marital home within hours of her departure, etc etc.

Maybe in some parellel universe our species has learned how to instantly diagnose and administer zero tolerance to socio/psychopaths and other abusers, but this does not happen here and now nor will it in my, or your, lifetime.

Precious found the courage within herself to embark on the well-trodden path of victims of domestic violence who find that leaving the scene is the easy bit. Although they may be in fear of their lives and on their knees with stress and truama, they may then have it all to do and may have to pay to access legal advice and due process of law - I make no apology for the fact that I am passionate about this subject as, without her very good friends, precious's situation may have had an entirely different outcome.

This is not in any way to denigrate precious's achievement in breaking free of an abusive twunt, but what happens to those victims who are friendless and/or do not have the strength of mind or werewithal to resist the temptation to simply return to their tormentors?

i do wish that we had a bit more awareness about what shelter a
i agree we don't do nearly enough to act against abusers and support their victims in getting justice. reality is though we don't even 'make' men pay for their children so women can't even be confident that they'll be entitled to financial support for their kids let alone retention of the family home or support in dealing with an abusive ex who won't respect boundaries. sadly it is true that a lot goes in these abusers favour

i think Nettle is absolutely right about the marriage side though precious - you gave this man a large chunk of your life and put up and put up before you finally reached your limits and the onus was on him to be a decent human being consistently to save the marriage - he couldn't do that - not only could he not pull of just being a normal, decent person he started issuing weird death threats and the like!?!? you have nothing to feel guilty about.

i so hope the judge is decent and the ruling goes in yours, and more importantly, your children's favour. it is insane to me that the unit of mother and children should have to be homeless, uprooted and needing to find accommodation after having to leave in fear of their safety whilst their abuser sits cosy in the family home. i'm hoping against hope that the judge feels the same.

don't feel guilty - feel proud of yourself for getting yourself and your children out of that environment. even if they don't get it or articulate it they were living in a shitty atmosphere and it will not have been good for them to continue doing so. things weren't getting better they were getting worse. you did the right thing.

ignore first line - i wrote a paragraph and then thought i deleted it but obviously missed a bit.

" he'll try to play the 'broken man', bewildered and confused as to how his marriage has reached such an impasse when all he'd tried to do was work hard for you and the dc blah blah, his mother's death, blah blah, grief and depression blah blah, denial/muddying of the facts as stated in your affidavit blah blah, and promises by the score that he'll have no intention of ever keeping yada, yada, yada. 2

too true.
i think some court judges in my case saw a poor man who was broken by the stress of separation. he played that role well... it all depends on the judge on the day and how he presents.... also for example a CAFCASS report wrote
"ms cest is angry due to his behaviour..." judge read the "miss cest is angry" bit and saw me as a bitter ex.

more recntly i ended up being in a situation where i was being bullied by gp into agreeing to go to joint therapy with exP - it took a lot to point out why this wasnt a good idea.
also he gave one sob story to child psychologist from family mediation centre in which he admitted various things he had done but explained them off by the stress etc... (i saw a report of the conversation he had had..) and on basis of which they recommended joint parenting together therapy...

i had a long conversation with a pscyhologist from same centre giving my perspective - who then recommended to me against joint therapy - even "parenting apart" courses - as he isnt in a position to joint parent given he has only limited supervised contact....

precious do get counselling - if only to process what has happened.
telling someone what has gone on in your life is very helpoful - the counsellor might pick up on things you say, ask the right quesitons which help you to validate your decisions. talk to your dc about how tehy see things. if they also need outside help arrange that too.

wow - just finished reading the entire thread.

precious your so very brave and you are doing so so well.

Keep going.

No amazing experiences to share.

Nothing outstanding to say.

But just wanted to let you know that there are many many of us in the shadows here on mumsnet that haven't posted that are watching and hoping your ok.

Soon this will all be a memory

Wishing you the very best for tomorrow, precious, and hoping that you get the result that you need and deserve.

I shall be thinking of you, as will no doubt many others who've been following your thread.

BTW, I know you won't be fooled but, no matter how he behaves tomorrow, I further suspect that, if he's not doing so already, it won't be long before he's paying court to another unsuspecting victim woman and that he'll be confiding in her/colleagues/others that he believes that the only reason you left the marital home is because you've got another man in your life.

What Izzy said,

I am thinking of you x

Thanks Tetty. I haven't been on for a bit because we went away to visit my sister for the weekend. Back to reality now, with the court case looming tomorrow. I will have to face him for the first time tomorrow - it will be horrible. I broke down earlier today - all too much at the moment. To top it all, my mobile provider has decided to cut me off because of a mistake they have made and that I have been trying to put right. As my BIL said today, it can only get better and I have experienced the worst.

Stay strong, you've done so well. And be prepared for his 'broken man routine' as mentioned above.

Hey there, precious, good luck today.

If you feel yourself getting panicky, take deep breaths - in through your nose to the count of three and out through your mouth to the count of five (doesn't matter how fast or slow you count, so long as the out breath is longer than the in breath). A neuro-psych taught me that, and it really does work. Do it at least 3 times.

yep it switches to the parasympathetic nervous system i think - which puts you in rest and digest mode rather than fight or flight (longer out breaths. usually called 7/11 breathing but 3/5 works too).

good luck precious - will be thinking of you and hope you come on to let us know how it went. hope you managed some sleep x

Another that's waiting and praying in the wings, Precious.
I hope you've been ok today.

I'm sorted and I didn't even have to face him! He is moving out tonight and we are moving back in tomorrow and we have been given 9 months on this order. I have full residency of the DC, permanently, but we will need to arrange supervised contact at a later small hearing. I also have a non-mol order. I can't believe it! It's been a terrible 2 weeks but it is now all worth it. The best thing for me is safeguarding the DC's. I could have arranged alternative accommodation but the DC's were my main concern. That was the main reason I didn't leave in the first place, which sounds madness now looking back on it because leaving would have been the best thing to do to protect them. I was so afraid of him getting residency and me not being there to protect them. That is in the past now and I need to move forward. My life can start again.

I also can't get over all the support I have had from friends, family, Mumnet, DV workers, work, school etc. I can see why women who don't have this support return to their tormentors, because it is so hard. I just want to thank everyone who has supported me from the bottom of my heart.

that is great news precious I am so pleased for you. I hope you manage to have a period of calm now and the DCs can settle back home.