have given DP an ultimatum.. stand up for me and not his mother or we are over!

[fairybubbles]

Ive been with my DP for 9 years. We have 2 children aged 4 and 12weeks. i have had endless issues with his mother since we had our first child. She is a very controlling and bitter old lady and has insisted on seeing our DS once a week every week and put up such a carry on about making sure she gets her wishes. Ive never been happy with her demanding behaviour and have had many arguments with my DP about this. He will not stand up to her or his father. DP works full time mon-fri so the only time we get as a family are weekends. I have tried so hard to get on with them and be flexible i am even suggesting sometimes they come here mid-week when DP is at work on the one day our DS is off nursery in the afternoon.
She also tries very hard to divide our family. when she arrives she tells DS she is taking him out for a walk or to play and often im feeding the baby so im not able to go, she doesnt ask me first before saying to DS. The latest argument arose because she and DPs father took it upon themselves to buy a car seat for my DS. I told my DP that I was not happy for DS to go out with them without us there and therefore they did not need to buy this car seat. He refused to acknowledge my concerns. I decided to call his parents i tried to tell them camly that when they come to visit and if we are going out for the day then our children will be traveling in our car as they usually do. She then started shoutin down the phone saying how he is her grandson and she can do what she likes. her husband (DP's father) then took the phon for her and shouted abuse at me saying i should " go F@CK myself" and the call ended

she called back later and i answered. she demanded i let her speak to her son. i said he was busy and to wait as he was holding baby at the time. she screamed at me to get him on the line. i told her to mind her manners when she calls my house. i then heard DP agreeing with her on the phone and saying it was nothing to do with him and he doesnt have a problem. i am disgusted at his lack of respect for me. he then came off the phone and started an agument with me for phoning them. i said this was because he wouldnt listen and i needed to get my point across so i spoke to them myself. DP then shouted at me to "F@CK OFF" in front of our kids and stormed out the house, not returning until midnight.

this all happened on saturday and we havent sorted this out. i wrote him a letter yesterday and said that this was it, i have had enough and if he didnt support me and respect my decisions as a parent and stand up for me, getting his parents to apologise for there absurd behaviour towards me, then i dont see any future for us. we have 2 beautiful children together and we are a little family yet he cant seem to stand up to his maipulative mother. she has had her children and made her decisions and brought them up as she saw fit, why cant she allow us to do the same.

i really dont need this right now< im 12 weeks after giving birth> and still sleep deprived. ive had enough and im not backing down this time.

Did your DH see his grandparents every weekend? This is perhaps his family culture and it will be quite a shock to all of them to get used to the change? You see yourself as a "little family" when it is just you two and the DC but maybe he views family as including the parents? Every other weekend sounds like a good compromise as a start.

Your fear of the GP taking DC out alone - is it really reasonable? They managed to not harm your DH as a child, is there any reason they suddenly would become a danger? There were fast cars in their day too...Although, I might contradict myself but you are right that a WeightWatchers yoghurt is not for a child, the jury is out on artificial sweetners but for sure low fat dairy does not allow good absorption of vitamin D and hence lower calcium absorption. Your DS isn't overweight is he? Is MIL trying to get something across here although in a totally misguided way?

Agree that swearing at you was totally unacceptable and all should apologise. Perhaps the occasional explosion was also part of the culture of your DH's childhood and hence he did the same to you? This he really needs to stamp out if he doesn't want his DC to continue the cycle.

that sounds good fairybubbles, going in the right direction. i was bit of a mess when ds2 was little and feel so sad i didn't focus on him more when he was tiny so make the most of your little baby!

i hope your dh sticks to his word - it'll be really hard for him to speak to his mum and suggest changes but just remind him about how you've been made to feel by his and his parents actions and words. plan some nice family activites too with him and your kids too to have some positive things in your relationship.

Actually - I have a MIL like yours.

To an outsider it can seem like I may be being a bit precious over the kids etc but when push comes to shove its because of the way my MIL goes about things.

Refuisng to listen to what I want for my kids. She has a plan in her mind and no matter what it is that plan will be done just the way MIL wants it to be done. For example a typical one is - turning up 5 minutes before a meal with sweets. I am in the kitchen preparing or even dishing up the meal. I have been out of the kitchen and greeted MIL and said " i will be with you in 5, am just dishing up lunch/tea/dinner". Mil then proceeds to show DC the sweets. Then opens them for them and start giving them to the kids. I go out and say that lunch is ready can we leave the sweets until later but its too late, the DC start grizzling etc etc and it all descends into chaos.

Another example: MIL decides she wants to take DC to local park to feed the ducks. Fine I say, they can go after lunch that I am again about to dish up. Whilst I am in kitchen, MIL is off down the road with DC enroute to park with bread for ducks.

This is a few years ago now, my DC are older now. This behaviour used to totally fuck me off big time. It was not a case of me being awkward, just following basic parenting skills. Its also plain rude and ill manners to just walk in and take over aby situation and at the end of the day, it was always the DC that suffered. MIL would bring them back from the park, hungry and tired. They will have grizzled all the way home as they had no lunch, or with the sweets they would then get so worked up it could end in a tantrum and they would not eat their meal.

These are just 2 examples of a pushy "do it my way" MIL.

I admit I did become angry and really start STAMPING my foot down and refusing MIL basics little things/time with the DC as my blood pressure would start rising the minute she started trotting down the driveway.

I can empathise with the OP here. I dont think she is being awkward par se, just sick of being ignored and spoken over and her opinion on anything to do with her DC ignored.

My DH used to pander to his mothers needs. He has improved over the years but can still pull a blinder out of the blue. The thing is over the years MIL has alientated the DC to a certain degree. She is so pushy and over powering that they now make a fuss when she visits and try and get out of being at home to see her.

OP - I think you do need to stand up for yourself. I feel very sorry for you and your DH is being a complete twat. Good on you for actually standing up for yourself.

i think your fil language is unacceptable. he should apologise. your dh should make it plain to him that this is not acceptable.

h was wrong to speaak to you like he did. he should apologise too.

mil has shown what her attitude is by her comment that he is her grandson and she can do what she likes. this is not acceptable. if she wanted to give you a break, she should ask you or h first. you are the parents. she should respect your wishes re safety.

it is awful when your h does not support you and stand up to your pils. you should be his frst priority, (leave and cleave and all that) though it doesn't mean abandoning his parents. he is betraying you emotionally and opting out of his marriage commitments. he is not honouring and respecting you. it is hardly surprising that you are fed up with it. follow through what you have decided, even if you don't make it permanent.

Not much kindness coming your way is there hon? You've just had a baby, people should be in awe of you and looking after your every need. When I had my dd , I had hoodie kids and everyone opening doors, clucking after me and all sorts. My ex husband told me to eff off, and his mum said it was OK because I'd wound him up. I wasn't bringing my dd up in a family where that was acceptable, so I did eff off. best day's work I ever did. It doesn't cost anything to be kind and even the worst people in the world go soft at a new baby and a new mum. What's up with your lot then? Not right hon, right across the board and it doesn't seem to me like daddy is stepping up either. trust your instincts xx

Fairybubbles, I am another one who understand where you are coming from. It is great that you are prepared to work something out which suits you all. I really hope your DH can agree to a fortnightly visit though he is probably terrified to ask.

I do think it would be an idea to go to Relate though to talk through all this. Your evening chat sounds promising but I'm sure it's not all going to be perfect just like that. This issue will crop up time and again and your DH could probably do with some outside help on this. You too :)

THis is one of those rare threads where I just can't believe you had so many unsupportive replies. There are a few of us here though who can see how your MIL is very controlling and isn't listening to you. I can imagine your MIL :(

I'm not quite sure why so many people are assuming that your post-birth hormones are making you behave unreasonably. Your MIL sounds like a nightmare, and definitely the most shocking thing is her belief that her role as a grandmother takes precedence over your role as a mother. The fact is, whether she likes it or not, you hold the trump card here- your DS. She knows this, and is trying to intimidate you into forgetting it.

Just refuse to engage, without proper discussion. Tell her that in future you expect the reasonable requests that you make to be listened to, and that if she doesn't do so, then you won't allow her access. You should not tolerate her shouting and swearing at you either. I've found an excellent phrase in these circumstances is to coldly ask her to stop behaving like a fishwife. It's stopped several aggressive, loud people I know right in their tracks.

And you're absolutely right. Your DH's primary loyalty should be to your family unit. This means that if 12 weeks after having your child, you don't want his aggressive overbearing mother shouting at you, and you don't want your DH swearing at you and storming out, then he should be understanding that.

On the other hand I would suggest you open a proper dialogue with your DH about this, one that doesn't devolve into shouting and accusations. Ask him to give you instances where you've been unreasonable and offer to try and mend matters with his mother IF she is willing to meet you half way and listen to your requests

Have you asked your DH if he would like to spend your remaining weekend day with your parents - every week? surely that's far

How are things today?

(Your PIL sound bonkers, btw. Swearing at you is not going to work)

Thank you for all those who have supported me and can see that I have a right to be upset and angry and that their behaviour is not acceptable. To those who think I may be the problem or PILs have a right to act the way the they, I sincerely hope you are never in this position yourself. Perhaps then your opinion would be different, who knows? Well as far as sorting things out, DP is going to phone them later tonight and explain that from now on we will be making arrangements to see them fortnightly. I know its going to be hard for him to stand up to his mother but he has agreed with me he will tell her. I will work on building bridges with them but in future when anything upsets me DP will be told straight away and we can address the issue together. ....again thank you for all your kind messages of support after what has been a v stressful and testing few days for me.

Well done fairy for standing your ground. I've had a terrible relationshipp with my mil for nearly 20yrs, mainly made worse by my DH. Once my DCs arrived, she became unbearable. We would occasionally have Sunday lunch there, but it became a regular event to which eventually I had to say woah... You'd have thought I'd said we were never going to see her again!!! We spent every Xmas for the first few years of our marriage at hers - until I put my foot down.

These kind of people are never satisfied with what you give them - they always want more and more and more and if you disagree, then you are painted as the awkward one. It becomes a totally miserable existence.

It's made worse by the fact our back gardens back on to each other!!! When I moved into DH's house, I thought we'd be moving to a different house, or I'd never have agreed to it.

I won't kid you, it's been hard and we've had some shocking rows over her. a friend who is a counsellor finally made me see sense when she said I possibly had misguided anger - meaning HE was more the problem and she was right, although his mummy loves the fact he's so needy. He's a mummy's boy and always will be I guess.

I don't speak to my mil now - it makes for interesting family gatherings!

The reason I stay and tolerate this is because I do not want my DC to have to choose who to live with in the event of a divorce.

OP-why don´t you suggest that you have a month or two of not seeing them?

Then it´s on your terms.

And if they are like this again-another spell of no visits?

well done op glad you've sorted something out

Good idea diddl!

You need time to get used to your own, recently enlarged family unit, but zi doubt v much that the h here will be able to pull a couple of months off!

You still have the option of arranging to be out when they turn up though

Fairybubbles, I hope this gets sorted and you feel better. FWIW, I wouldn't be pleased to know GP had bought a car seat without asking DH or me if it was okay to take LO in the car...but thats me. It has been over 30 years since my mil has taken care of LOnes and seems to (at times) ignore the current guidelines because they dont suit her and that age old 'you turned out all right'. I will be a MIL some day and will be making sure I ask my DIL how she wants to do things so I can follow from her lead when caring for LO. Incidently I saw my own GP's once a month and had a great relationship with them, I considered that 'normal'.

Another thing-does your husband enjoy seeing his parents or does he do it because he feels he must?

I told my ILs that they were welcome to see me & the children in the week-every week & then they would have seen my husband for an hour or so when he came in from work.

But no, they wanted the whole day-so it was every third weekend.

That was as much as my husband wanted to see them/was prepared for them to cut into "our" time when they could have come every week on our terms but wouldn´t iyswim.

It is interesting how some people read the OP and think PFB and some people think terrible in-laws. I suppose it depend what your own ILs/parents are like as to how you read between the lines. For example, I read the buggy to park thing as the OP calmly saying to PIL - "please don't let DS out of the buggy as he will make a break for the road and he can be very quick and there are a lot of fast cars. It is very dangerous" and the PIL doing as they like leading to a very dangerous situation for the child which was completely avoidable. What if they decided the carseat buckle being done up was silly to? Back in their day it was fine to not wear a seatbelt, and children died - is that being PFB too?

For my own part, I completely get how essentially unimportant small issues where the IL's ignore your decisions lead to not being happy to leave your children with them unsupervised as they will not pay attention to the big issues. If you have not experienced this perhaps it is unimaginable that an adult would nod along as you tell them something important about your child then ignore it for their own convenience (make sure you don't leave DS alone in the bath was mine , luckily no harm done as I rushed up to find DS crawling around in the bath but could have been horrific had he been younger/fallen on his back/unlucky) but some people just understand that other people are right and they are wrong, or that parent's have the last word on their own young children, GC or not.

I'm so glad your DH is being supportive now, and you should be proud of yourself for standing up for you and your children!

"I think you need to try and get DH to realise that his family is now you and the DC's" tbh I see this statement often on mn and I think that it's totally out of order. Where on earth does it state that once you take a partner and have children other members of your family become surplus to requirements? you don't just chuck out the old family and gain a new one - you add to your existing family. And yes of course partners and dc should take priority but I think this belief that "you are his family now" is actually quite nasty. Remember we will probably all be ILs one day. imagine how you will feel if it is assumed you are no longer your dc's family once they take a partner? Be careful what you wish for and all that, because one day you might just be on the receiving end.

Op tbh I think there are two sides here. I wouldn't want my mil visiting for one whole day every week and I actually get on with my mil. Equally I think that any adult telling another to fuck off is beyond unreasonable. It doesn't matter what the other adult has done, people should be able to moderate the way they speak to other people by virtue of the fact they are adults.

I know what it can be like to have a parent undermine you, my mother does it all the time and I do see your frustration over that.

However, you do come across as very agressive, even in your attitude to anyone who has disagreed with you on this thread. I also don't think that someone buying a carseat is a big deal tbh. It's not her making decisions for you; it's her wanting your child to be safe while in her care, and that is surely all anyone wants. And sorry to be blunt, but you are not the only one capable of knowing what is good for your child, she has brought up children too, and presumably they're all still alive and don't have any major injuries as a result of her inadequate care.

I think sometimes as parents we can too easily get caught up in the mindset that we and only we know what is best for our children. But actually sometimes we need to take a step back and accept that our children are not our possessions and that there are other people in their lives who have their best interests at heart and who have a right to want a relationship with them.

Wannabe - you spend 50% of your family time with your inlaws - with your MiL doing whatever SHE wants to do with your children, ignoring everything you say do you?

I'm lucky with my MiL - I get on with her most of the time - but being constantly undermined in this way can be compltely demoralising.

Wannabe, I just checked this thread and seen you quoted my post and disagreed

The OP and her DH are the parents of these DC and ONLY their opinion is needed on how to raise the DCs

This should be united, if its not then the problems will escalate and the wider families opinions will be disregarded and a power struggle will happen

Whole villages raising a child can only happen with agreement

If there is no agreement, then its shit for the DCs

Been there, done that and got the T shirt

wannabe, it's not that you cut out your respective families, but you have to shift your priorities. Once you are one of a couple you do have to have solidarity with your partner. Unfortunately, that often seems to mean that there's a fight with your partner's family who, for whatever reason, sometimes assume that they will come first or that nothing will change. If your partner always capitulates to someone else and leaves you out in the cold, then they're not much of a partner, are they?

The object of attachment is separation. Parents should have that drummed into their skulls from the moment they give birth. You have to let your children go; you have to let them form their own attachments and make their own decisions. You have to let them grow up. You have to let them be parents in their turn.

Shame some people forget that. Shame some adults never get out of the clutches of parents who cannot allow them to grow up, but continue to infantilise them long past anything that is healthy.

Saying something like "you are his family now" is like a quick nudge rather than something literal. Some people need it put to them just like that though, harsh though it seems. Generally it will give rise to enough introspection to effect a more measured change.

Quite frankly, I think some ILs deserve that harshness. They should think more carefully about the long term effects of their own behaviour and take some responsibility for the consequences. Screaming fuck you down the phone at your DIL under any circumstances should not be allowed to pass unchallenged. The dh needs to be well and truly shaken up.

He can choose to take his responsibilities to his wife and children seriously, or he can let them all be bullied and treated like shit. In the circumstances, I think a rude shock of the type "we are your family now" is probably required.

there is something wrong however to keep expressing your opinion when you are not the childs parent, you are the grandparent

Sorry OP, that is grandparents the world over, I know it doesn't make it right, but it happens to all of us. Even my MIL, who is as non-interfering as they come has her opinions on child rearing. It's like it is part of their job!

It is up to you, as the parent of your child, to filter out what she says. So what if she thinks he eats too much cheese (better than fruit as a snack, as others have said, fruit is high in sugar) or brings him yoghurts (she probably likes them, so thinks he will too). One a week won't harm him. If she leaves others in the fridge, throw them without her knowing!

I really think the examples are her doing what she thinks is best & you finding fault every time.

OP, if you know they are coming on any set day, make yourself a pampering appt at the hairdresser/beauty place & tell them "baby was fed at x time, I'll be home at x for the next feed. Thanks for babysitting"

Or take your baby to a mother & baby screening at the local cinema while they spend time with ds1. Or take baby to friends house for a couple of hours etc.

And go out. If you don't like being with them, let them spend time with your child/ren & have some much needed time to yourself.

Fairybubbles, Hmm, your mil sounds like mine in that she is manipulative and controlling, however, unfortunately for her, my dh has not grown up to adhere to her wishes.
This resulted in a bad scenario a few weeks ago for us where my dh finally lost it with her, but, in retrospect, as bad as the situation was (he was in the wrong and, in this case, she was the innocent, but, in truth, it was the culmination of years of manipulation on her part. I see this now.) it was probably a good thing in the sense that it has taken her down a peg or two and she needed to come down a peg or two.
Every cloud has a silver lining!

Your dp's primary concern is with your family unit. I hope he can talk sense into them.
I am hopeful for you that he will because, at the end of the day, men are controlled by their genitals. Sorry to be crude, but it is true. If forced- and I mean forced, frankly, unless situation comes to a head they usually do whatever is easier-to pick between wife and mother, wife usually comes first because, well, the answer is obvious really, isn't it?
What kind of arsehole takes his mum's side every time over his wife's? The answer: one who no longer loves his wife and/or has no sex drive. Now be honest, if he no longer loves you and has no sex drive, what have you lost, anyway? Putting aside the sexual aspect, any split would probably mean less time with his dc's. If he loves them, he won't want this.

A lot of men are extreme mummy's boys, but they don't tend to form relationships so they are not relevant here.

If your dp does not side with you and sides with mummy, try to remember (hard though it may be) that you've lost a really stupid mummy's boy and mummies' boys are not worth losing. You won't think of this when you are hurting, but hold on to this thought later when you are healed.

oh gosh, you've been given a hard time on this thread fairy! I hope some of the opinions on here didn't make you lose confidence when you confronted DH.

The crux of the matter imo is "She then started shoutin down the phone saying how he is her grandson and she can do what she likes. " er, no she can't. You are his mother, she isn't. The power struggle is coming from her competing for a job that totally isn't hers. She has no right to take on a role that totally doesn't belong to her and never will. Tbh reading your thread I am reminded of that drama on tv, the house??, with francesca annis as the demon MIL.

I also think that if you have not had the misfortune to have a relation who is controlling and manipulative you will not understand the endless undermining, always done in a subtle way and sounds petty when you raise your concerns - that's how they do it, under the surface, like a snake. She revealed her hand when she said she can do what she likes - no. she. can't. She has to defer to you, the mother and the wife.

DH is a whole other problem and tbh I think this is where your real problems lie. If he had stood up to her/them then none of this would have gone so far. I agree with other posters who say that three people screaming at you to FUCK OFF is totally out of order, in any circumstance, ever (particularly as DH said it in front of your kids) - then demanded you apologise?? . When push came to shove he piled in with them and dealt out the exact-same abuse - you have a problem on your hands there fairy.

I would strongly recommend you get along to some counselling because imo this problem isn't going to go away. It has gone far too far down the road than it ever should if your DH had done his job properly and cleaved to his wife, cutting the apron strings to mother for good the day he walked down the aisle. I mean apron strings, don't mean cutting love, respect etc: the priority is now his wife, not his mother.

imo you have to be very tough fairy, rigid boundaries - though the title of your thread suggests you have already reached that point. It sounds like I watch telly all the time but if you didn't see it I recommend you watch the last episode of The Good Wife, in which she stands up to her MIL and is very tough - rightly so imo. It's a good coaching exercise in how it's done and should give you a model to counterract the posts on here that imo have simply not understood what you are facing.

He refused to back me up in the end and has left. He said he would not be telling them to apologise and that he expected me to apologise to them. I asked him about calling them to tell them we'd like to start seeing them fortnightly for a while - and guess what he has changed his mind because he doesn't want to upset his parents. I told him I would take the children out for 30 mins and if he hadn't changed his mind to pack and leave beforw we got back. He's been away sine yest and didn't even call to see how children were or anything :(