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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

AF, Dittany, Grace et al Itsnotjustaslap DV Update

245 replies

itsnotjustaslap · 04/02/2011 13:07

Hi

Just thought would update; thought about things and realised that I was coping fine with my son without my husband and not falling apart. He did not contribute anything much to my happiness or to the house or childcare (or at least far less than he thought he did) and that I felt far calmer and happier without him.

He did not really regret the violence or acknowlege that he was controlling or that ranting in front of our son for hours was harming him.

Soo...I contacted Social Services to report my concerns for my son's emotional well being as he wakes in the night for hours and cries (but he has slept through since my husband left) and to report the DV. They stated that they did have real concerns for my son's welfare and wanted to speak with both me and my husband. They also advised me to go to the police which I did.

I wanted the DV to be just put on file however the police stated that he would be arrested and charged regardless of whether I made a statement or not. It was really hard but I made the statement anyway and he was arrested and charged.

Obviously things are very difficult now with him and his family. He is trying everything to win me back, as he does not want to lose everything but has also said that if we get back together I must fully apologise to his family for getting the police involved in a private matter and getting him a criminal record (they can fuck right off!).

I am sooo much happier without him. The police protection unit have told me that if I go back to him he will seriously harm me so that makes my decision easier.

He does not yet know that my decision is made and it will be really difficult when he does know as he will become very angry and possibly violent and I do have concerns about contact with our son. But I'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

OP posts:
boxingHelena · 01/03/2011 10:51

some 'r' missing ... !

SpringchickenGoldBrass · 01/03/2011 11:27

Never mind what's wrong with this fucked up walking disaster of a man. He can look after himself. Please prioritie YOU and YOUR CHILD. You need a court order keeping this man out of the house in place as soon as possible. NO socialising with him.
Even if you think you are safe seeing him in a public place (this is only true up to a point, if he were to snap suddenly, or pretend to, he could do you or DS serious physical harm in seconds), giving him the idea that you are prepared to spend any time with him encourages him to think that it won't be long before he's back in control of you, back getting his home comforts, back in a situation where he can hurt, control and rape you.
And then, love, you may well lose your child. Because SS are not going to leave him in a home with a massively dangerous abusive man.

squeakytoy · 01/03/2011 11:41

I have only just read this thread. You seemed so strong at the beginning and I was full of admiration for how you have dealt with this, but now I get to the last page, and you are letting this violent abuser back in for "roast dinner".. no no no no no!!!

He hasnt changed, he wont change, all this nicey nicey is part of the manipulation to get you back where he wants you, and believe me, he will be even worse if you let him back, because he will punish you for the last month. Please trust me on that. You will end up losing your son, and your sanity.

Please do not have this man back in your life at all. Arrange visits for your son via a third party. Do not have any contact with him. At all.

QuintessentialShadows · 01/03/2011 11:49

Are you nuts?

boxingHelena · 01/03/2011 12:06

QS be harsh on OP.. as if she needs it

mummytime · 01/03/2011 12:11

Have you thought the night terrors might be because your son is seeing his father again?

Please do not let him back in your life. Get rid of him, and keep him away. Listen to everyone concerned for you.

Mouseface · 01/03/2011 12:14

Itsnot

I have followed this from the start and read all of the brilliant advice given by Peter, Grace, dittany etc....

The reason they have posted what they have, about you not listening, is because you seem to be softening towards him.

Read your posts again. Just yours.

You start off so very strong and determined to get this man out of YOUR life for good, away from YOUR home and YOUR son.

Have you got Occupation and Molestation Orders in place?

'(He's) not a monster'

No, not in the Fairytale sense of the word. He is however, a controlling, spiteful and dangerous man, who knows exactly how to push your buttons, to make you feel like perhaps, just maybe, he's not all that bad.

The more times he appears calm and meassured with you, the more you will let your guard down.

Chances are, you won't even realise that you are until it is far too late.

He is clever, calculated and is willing and able to manipulate any given situation to HIS advantage.

STOP him coming to your home.

STOP the friendly chats.

STOP letting him inside your head.

You are thinking about him being 'normal'

He can never be normal. A normal person would not behave as he has.

Get angry again, remember what he has done and what he is capable of.

READ YOUR POSTS AGAIN.

QuintessentialShadows · 01/03/2011 12:25

BH, sorry, I should have specified. It was a friendly, caring and well meaning "Are you nuts?" with raised eyebrows. As opposed to a harsh one.

I do realize you are trying to do your best by your child, but in this case, the best really is to cut this man out of your life. There is nothing good coming out of this. He will disappoint you. Sorry.

Jux · 01/03/2011 13:43

Just read this thread.

I have nothing to add, just agree with what everyone else is saying.

You know this man is dangerous. You came home and found him having a leisurely bath and it took 3/4 hr to get him out.

No matter what he is doing/saying he is still the same. One day you will come home and find him in the bath and when you tell him to go he will hurt you. He will not go, and he will hurt you.

Your boundaries are still too close to you. You need to make them stronger and wider.

He cannot come into your house again. He should not be anywhere near you, your house, your car.

Please op, I am staggered by the strength you ahve shown so far - we all are - and I can see how hard it is; you need to keep him right out.

He can see your son at a centre so no one you know gets involved, you don't get involved and you can keep yourself safe. Youa re never going to have a normal relationship with this man because he is incapable of having a normal relationship but mainly because he is dangerous to you.

Keep safe.

ScarlettWalking · 01/03/2011 14:59

No no no.

Please be aware your sons night terrors are related to you letting this person back in your life. The same person ss told in no uncertain terms he was abusing his son. You have had advice from all services and people on here telling you specifically what not to do when freeing yourself and your son from an abusive relationship as well as this voice in your head you are completely ignoring.

What kind of mixed MSGs is your son getting with all this happy family shit with a man who traumatised him.
I don't even think he should have be getting access with him until he has finished his " course".

How frustrating. You are like a totally different woman to your op. Your son may pay the price for your contact with this man you are reconciling with.

dittany · 01/03/2011 15:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

mathanxiety · 01/03/2011 15:37

The bath incident was him marking his territory.

The previous episode in the house (dinner, taking the DS for a walk, ranting) was a calculated overstepping of the boundaries you have tried to set.

You absolutely should have called the police when you found him in the bath. Sorry to admonish you like that but you must not say you will call the police and then NOT call them.

And there should be no more happy family charades, no more roast dinners. You are playing with fire here and you must stop.

Please get a non mol order asap. I agree with PA here -- he is stepping up the pressure and will commit something more serious soon. The raising of the ante here is very obvious. The steps he is taking are very clear. Put chains and bolts on your door, get that order, and keep your phone charged at all times.

He is a psycho and you cannot cure him of that. YOU ARE NOT THAT SPECIAL TO HIM. Please ditch the notion that what you gave him throughout your relationship (love, your virginity, the DS) will ever be worth anything to him, will ever make any impression on him, will ever evoke any response besides contempt from him. Sorry to be blunt, but to reiterate -- you can't cure him of his problems. Everything you have invested in this relationship has been in vain. Do not throw any more of your self respect away.

PeterAndreForPM · 01/03/2011 17:34

Social Services said if OP were to allow this man back into her life, they will have no choice but to start proceedings to remove the child

OP, you told us this. It cannot be stated any more plainly than that.

You have to stop this, right now. If you are frightened of him, call the police and have him removed. Ask a burly neighbour to come round and tell him to leave. Tell everyone what he is doing

Your son's night behaviours will improve when this man is not terrorising his mother in front of him

Please, get help to keep him away, before it is too late.

ScarlettWalking · 01/03/2011 17:50

What is so strange about this thread is how different she sounds in recent posts to her op. Like a different woman.

Don't waste all that resolve and energy searching the Internet for explanations for his abusive behaviour. Get back to who you were at the start of this, focus on protecting your son and his wellbeing.

PeterAndreForPM · 01/03/2011 17:53

OP, please come back and tell us what you are thinking x

PeterAndreForPM · 01/03/2011 17:53

Scarlett, I thought that too Confused

JaxTellersOldLady · 01/03/2011 19:25

I have just read all of the pages of this thread. At the beginning you were strong, resilient and slowly but surely you have been ground down again by sleepless nights, your husbands bizarre behaviour since splitting.

Please listen to all of the good advice you have been given and stop googling psychopaths! That will not help YOU and your family. Get strong again, get practical help from family and friends.

No idea what your history is re DV but I dont need to know that, what I have read in this thread alone is enough to make me very apprehensive in what you have been doing recently and all this 'playing happy families' cannot continue.

No idea where you are OP, but willing to help out any way I can.

Mouseface · 01/03/2011 19:36

Scarlett - that's why I told her to read her posts again.

This is NOT good. Sad

ScarlettWalking · 01/03/2011 20:05
Sad
porpoisefull · 01/03/2011 20:25

I've only just read this thread, but felt I had to post. He said during your relationship he found you unattractive but has now said that he finds you so sexy he cannot control himself. I'm sorry, but I couldn't put any other interpretation on that other than an unambiguous threat of rape.

As others have said, don't let him in your house again and don't expect any support or help from him. The only way he should be seeing your son is in a supervised contact centre. If that's not possible then he will have to go without contact. He has shown that he cannot be trusted. And get a non-molestation order.

Be strong - I hope you can get help from family and friends.

squeakytoy · 01/03/2011 20:29

I wouldnt necessarily say rape, but he is certainly doing it to flatter and worm his way back in, and seems to be doing a damn good job of it :(

You cant have a happy life while this man is still in it. At the moment he is just working on you to get you back on his side, feeling pity for him, forgiving him, thinking he has changed... he hasnt, it is all one big ploy to regain control.

itsnotjustaslap · 01/03/2011 22:38

Whoa so many replies. Thank you for everyone who has posted; I really feel your concern.

I didn't have a chance to check on this thread until this evening; but I spoke to many agencies today regarding my options as I have been just simmering with so many unanswered questions about his behaviour; and especially about the Sunday incident when I suddenly realised it was happening again and my boundaries had been just pushed over.

I didn't even see it coming; I thought I was in control of the situation; and that he understood very clearly what they were.

When all this first happened I thought there might be hope; that he would be capable of changing his behaviour. There were good times, some very good times in our relationship - which made me stay otherwise I would have left; but even before the escalating violence and aggression I was maybe unconciously questioning why staying in a relationship that I wasn't getting anything out of. Certainly not normal things like love and affection.

But this was like a frog in water effect; there were (early) warning signs which I can see now; I only realised the enormity of the situation when it was too late.

Since Sunday I've felt really pressured. He hasn't changed; still can't see that he did anything wrong. In his head he is doing everything possible to make our relationship work, except actually listen to the ground rules I've requested him to keep - and trust me they were only really basic rules. He should have been able to manage this.

On top of this there is the different persona he shows to others. I spoke to a friend who knows the situation; and when I told her about the Sunday incident and how I felt it was a watermark she told me that I was overthinking it; that a lot of what he does he doesn't mean, that it comes out wrong. Yes he is blindly insensitive; very tactless and yes he often doesn't do what anyone asks; but this is part of his relentless optimism and his personality - and I knew this when I married him.

I don't feel this. Anyone who doesn't understand boundaries is potentially dangerous because this isn't how society works.

So today I spoke to an Independent Domestic Violence Advocate again and explained the recent situation. It was a long conversation; there are a variety of options to go down. I will see her tomorrow as she has some paperwork for civil injunctions and a residency order. There is no harm in at least completing the paperwork so it is ready to go. I can't imagine actually going to court yet, but maybe small steps.

The other thing I did was to speak to Womens Aid again. They were very concerned. I said that I thought from a very unqualified amateur view that he may have some psychopathic tendencies to which she said to my suprise that she took seriously and she and her colleague had already discussed aspects of his personality that they found potentially dangerous.

I also spoke to my GP today who was really lovely. Because of my concerns about our son, and her concern for me; she will speak to my HV and my son's social worker tomorrow. She asked me what I actually wanted. It's difficult because of certain things like the house / mortgage etc I can only think short term.

I would like Social Services to case conference. There are issues like my mental health which could be a cause for concern if I do not have any support when things go wrong. And I do not want to ask my husband to be a crutch at all. I also want Social Services to be aware that I had to again remove my son from a harmful situation because of my husband. That the ground rules we had supposedly agreed like intelligent adults were not standing and so puts my son at risk.

I will also call Social Services again tomorrow and speak to the case worker; because it can't go on like this.

I will also speak to the police domestic violence protection unit again tomorrow as I think what he did on Sunday would be classified as harassment which they could possibly take action against as I believe it has to be more than one incident of harassment (he was verbally warned before).

I don't know if I want the action to be taken right now and the same goes for the civil orders. I do have grave concerns that this behaviour from my husband is when he is on his best behaviour and therefore thinks we can reconcile.

If I do take action and reveal all my cards; I am concerned as to how he will act. In all honesty I think he will do something illegal if I make it clear that I walk away with my son. It may not be 'serious' ie I may not be physically harmed at all; but he is the type of person to just hammer at my door at 3am and breach the peace.

I know the police will help if he does something that is illegal; but at the same time I do not want to be in the position of waiting for it to happen. And I don't want to be in the position of it happening to me at all and everything that it entails.

Long term I will have to look at the civil procedures. Short term a multiagency case conference I feel is the only option and its one that I would welcome because I need to demonstrate that my son is safe from harm in this; and I need to formalise some childcare contact with my husband; and emergency help from my family when I need it; rather than my husband doing me a 'favour' by taking care of our son occasionally.

Fortunately my husband has completely stoppped the sexualised behaviour. I suppose he actually has respected some boundaries when I said that I felt it was inappropriate and creeped me out.

Sorry, v long...

OP posts:
SpringchickenGoldBrass · 01/03/2011 22:59

OK I can see that an urgent priority is for you to have some sources of help and support with childcare. Unfortunately, if your family are unhelpful (or unable to help because they live too far away or have problems of their own WRT health, dependents or whatever) then some sort of care plan needs to be put in place.
BECAUSE YOU CANNOT USE YOUR XH FOR HELP. It's MUCH too dangerous to have this man in your house or near you.

JaxTellersOldLady · 01/03/2011 23:03

I think the most important thing you can do to protect yourself is to stop giving perceived (to your husband at least) mixed signals. It seems your husband cannot see past his 'wants' - stop the family days, the roast dinners, the sleeping on the sofa and all the other cosy things that are happening.

This is what your husband is banking on - you getting worn down, thinking he is the only one for you and he has hope all the time you let him do the 'family' things.

Try to get a support network in RL organised so that you have some time to yourself, make sure as much as you can that you are safe and please dont allow this man into your home again.

There are contact centres out there that he can use.

PeterAndreForPM · 01/03/2011 23:03

Thank goodness you came back

You have been busy while we have all been shitting ourselves here Smile

Yes, get all the paperwork sorted and ready to go. I would actually advise that you proceed immediately but I see you are too fightened of his reaction to do that right now. I think that is a mistake, but you know your situation best and you are informing as many people as you can, which is good.

Now, the socialising, the family dinners, the normalising

Please tell us it stops now.

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