dh and his best friends girlfriend - what shall I do?

[SJ32]

Hi, I think this is going to be a long one but I would really appreciate some advice, if anyone makes it that far!

dh and I have been together for 11 years, married for 6. We have 2 dcs, one pre-school and one school age. He has a best friend who he went to school with who we often hang out with, along with other mutual friends. This guy is also a v close friend of mine.

He got this new girlfriend a couple of years ago. She is a nice girl I think but kind of closed off and hard to get to know. She also acted in a weird, controlling and borderline abusive way to her partner, so for a long time my dh hated her, no-one else was massively keen either but we all tried to make an effort. ((For easiness' sake I'm gonna call dh's best friend C and his gf R)

Anyway, fast forward a bit and dh and her started to become friendlier. So friendly in fact that it seems people have begun to talk. The first I knew of it all was when dh told me (after I overheard a conversation between him and his best friend)that another friend, V had seen them kissing at a party in October, I must add that I was also at this party and saw nothing untoward. It turns out that it wasn't kissing, just possibly inappropriately intimate body-language.

So C has started to get the hump at the way dh and R have been behaving. They do stand and drink together and often will go on somewhere else alone after others have gone home. I'm not usually there as am looking after the dcs at home, dh goes out most friday nights til about 2-3am, nearly always with her. I know C feels uncomfortable and excluded but he hasn't talked to me about it.

dh says that C is being paranoid and unreasonable, and that there is nothing going on but that he likes R as a friend does not want to stop hanging out with her. I know they email eachother regularly while they're at work, and he texted her at like, 7.30 on Christmas morning, while the kids were in our room opening their presents (nice ). I actually read the message later that day and it was all rather innocuous but still, 7.30 on Christmas morning!?!

Last week dh told me he was meeting R for a drink after work to talk about the situation with C. I wasn't keen tbh but he was obviously going to go anyway. He was gone about 3 hours, I don't know if C knows they met up.

Anyway, I have been feeling uneasy about this for a while and we have had a few arguments about it. One one occasion I asked how he would feel if I was out drinking all the time with another bloke and he said 'I'd ask myself why you wanted to spend so much time with someone else rather than with me' like implying it was my fault for being a crappy wife or something.

I asked him if he fancied her and he said no but he understands her and likes her a lot. Last night though I am sorry to say I looked at his phone while he was asleep. (I know, I know ). I found an email conversation between them from yesterday where he says 'R - you're in my head a bit, I'm sorry it's not your fault. I know I'm being a twat. Maybe it's best if I stop coming out. If you don't know what I'm talking about then that's for the best'

She then replies something about them meeting up to 'talk' and they vaguely arrange to meet up this weekend. He also says something like 'I care about you and want to keep talking to you and listening to you' whatever that means.

So, it would appear that C was right, their friendship is crossing a line. What do i do about it though, I know it was wrong to look at his phone and he'll probably be really angry. I guess this is why you shouldn't look, even if you find something you can't legitimately say anything!

Also, I can't help feeling slightly responsible as over the last year dh told me a couple of times he wasn't happy with the way our relationship had become kind of functional, with no passion or excitement. He says I don't consider him, and it's true that I probably don't prioritise our relationship like I should, the dcs have always come first I guess.

I know this whole thing sounds really teenage but I promise it's genuine, and I am actually quite a mature 32 year old! dh and i are the first of our peer group to get married and have dcs, everyone else still goes out getting pissed and carrying on like we all did 10 years ago.

I think I'll wait and see what happens this weekend, I don't feel comfortable with them meeting up to discuss how she's 'in his head a bit'. Tbh that sounds like playing with fire! If he does meet her he might lie about it anyway and say he's meeting someone else. Or should I confess to looking and ask him about it? I mean, he hasn't actually done anything with her yet, is it acceptable to have crushes and feelings as long as you don't act on them?

Some perspective would be really helpful, right now I am so confused and I just feel sick and shaky. Thank you for reading.

Stop being a mug. Tell him he either stops all contact with her (in person, email, phone and text) or you'll throw him out. If he agrees to that, then sit down with him and talk about what is wrong with your relationship and what you are going to do about it.

Just seen your last message SJ.

I don't want to deflect attention away from your DH. He's the one you have a relationship with, and he's the one who owes you respect and love. But she sounds like a manipulative cow, please don't get fooled. You really are being way too nice here.

She doesn't give a shit about you, your relationship or your feelings, otherwise she wouldn't be hanging around your DH causing gossip. She also has a partner, so if she has issues, she needs to rely on him and talk to him - or maybe she could even find herself some other friends and not upset a marriage.

And also, everything that WWIFN says.

excellent posts
whenwillifeelnormal and QS

I agree with IvyKaty - move right into the space in your husbands head - leave no room for her.

However tempting it might be, please don't leave it and hope it will just go away. And please act before he meets up with R.

He has already discussed the situation with R so it opens the space for you to talk about it again. You could propose some actions to counteract the 'rumours': 1) you and dh could get a baby sitter a be seen out together 2) on evenings when you are unable to go out, you could invite R&C round to your house 3) you could suggest that if there's any discussion to be had about the 'rumours' then it should be all 4 of you having the discussions 4) that for a little while (say 3 months) your dh and R should not be out on their own together in case other people see it as being secretive.

By taking this approach you would not be confronting him directly (thereby giving him another 'excuse' to distance himself from you) rather you would be suggesting things that form a joint solution. If he does meet with R this weekend, then the things that you have said to him will be in his head and it may make him concerned enough to back off from the current track.

Tell him that she should come round to talk to him and that you are going out for the evening on Friday instead. Buy some wine if that's what they usually drink.

Then, feign illness and don't go out, just go to bed upstairs but wander down for a glass of water occasionally.

Make sure your living room looks like the living room of a family with toys around etc.

Perhaps this may drum into the both of them what exists here (a marriage and children). When they are out in a bar it is easier to cut off and pretend they are both single.

I know it's a little devious (but you could go out properly and leave DH and the gf to babysit).

Oh FGS, why on earth would anyone pussyfoot around with this? There's no need to be devious or oblique. If you sleepwalk through this any longer OP and tolerate this friendship for even another day, they will start a physical affair, which will be their fault.

You've got to give yourself permission to state your boundaries, but do so overtly and with clear explanations of the consequences if this friendship continues in any form.

Putting a stop to this is also only the start of the process anyway. You're going to have do a lot of work as a couple working out how the hell he felt entitled to be so blatantly disrespectful to you and his own best mate. That entitlement comes from somewhere, I assure you.

WhenwillIfeelnormal, I'm so, so glad to see you on here. You talk so much sense about these situations, and this seems to be 'classic' stuff. (Sorry, OP, if this sounds insensitive.)

There are stages leading up to various kinds of affair, and he's already in the throes of them. ie, distancing himself, knowing inside that things between you aren't right, the mirroring with the OW, etc.

What Whenwill said. It's OK to state your boundaries here. No contact between them. He needs to grow up and get his priorities straight. She is a symptom, not a goal. (I'd try and put it a bit more tactfully than this, though.)

If I were you, I'd a. stay outwardly calm if poss b. talk to him and say it's obvious things in the relationship aren't quite right for either of you, you'd like to talk to him about it and c. you know some boundaries are being crossed between him and x - it's the kind of thing that happens when you've distanced yourself from your primary relationship. You would like things to be better between you, no matter what happens in the future.

That way, you're stating your boundaries, you're being adult and you're showing what you're willing to do. Crying/sobbing/browbeating does very, very little to improve these situations, even if that's how you feel inside. That's what MN and r/l good friends are for.

Good luck, and keep posting on here if it helps you.

Also, forgot to say, if the mention of 'him and her' is the cursory point rather than the focus of what you say, it puts things between the two of them into perspective. This whole situation is about the relationship between you and DP, not necessarily what he's doing with this other person.

vykaty44 I just can't be there when they're all together all the time. It sounds horrible but I am basically stuck here indoors fretting about it, it sucks!

you are there physically as much as possible but then when you are not actually present your presents is still there.
If you want to keep him- I don't knwo do you?

then go all out for tease new clothes new hair new perfume the works manicure etc and soem very good underwear. Thsi is the visual side.

Cast some mystic over yourself and flirt with him, hes your dh so your allowed to flirt with him.

But all in a good way and lead him right back to where you want him.

talk and keep talking but make sure you also give her the fu*king cold ice shoulder when your out - if she takes you to one side all you say and no more than this

i don't like the way you are around men - end off

make sure you have a couple of nights out and leave him home - ok

oh and don't forget to let him know the freindship is off with her and he needs to buck his ideas up and work with you but don't be afraid to go and get what you want

Why on earth would the OP want to reward this bloke for screwing her over and leaving her stuck at home while he socialises with another woman? And what's the point of getting angry with this OW and not her H?

I have to agree, this man has been taking the piss for a long time by the sounds of it - leaving you at home watching the kids while he's out till all hours with another woman?? He needs a big shock, and you have no reason to feel bad for looking at his phone, he's been asking for that for a long time.

Hi I don't know if you've read any of my thread "cold feet about wedding". There are some similarities - at least in terms of being on the precipice of an affair - although I'm sorry to say I am in your dh's shoes.

Obviously I'm not in a position to give advice here due to my own awful behaviour but I just wanted to say two things from my perspective:

1. Your husband's behaviour is wrong. He is culpable. You are blameless - bollocks to questioning your wifely virtues and feeling bad about checking his phone. You have done NOTHING wrong and I include checking his phone. You had more than enough reason to feel suspicious. If he tries to put anything back on you he is a total fuckhead. And I'm sorry but bollocks to "privacy" in a marriage.

1. Just from my perspective - the fact that he has held back from a physical affair could be a sign of how much he loves you and cherishes what the two of you have together - that he wants to protect that even though he's being tempted to stray. Doesn't mean he hasn't behaved appallingly and messed up big time - please don't think I'm excusing him. But he loves you I think.

I'm sorry this has happened to you. I think if he's got anything about him he will stop all contact with the OW when you talk about it, whatever comes next in terms of you as a couple.

Totally agree with WWIFN - he's being taking the utter piss out of you, the last thing he needs is to be rewarded for his behavour. How humiliating to try and compete for your own husband's attention.
Please confront him and tell him what he stands to lose.

"He says I don't consider him, and it's true that I probably don't prioritise our relationship like I should, the dcs have always come first I guess."

Read that back, OP and ask yourself whether your dh considers you. Do you see any evidence of him prioritising your relationship?

How nice of your dh to merrily make arrangements to meet up this weekend, with no thought for your potential plans. The more you let this man get away with, the more he will happily push the boundaries of your relationship.

Your husband has been going out until 2am or 3am with another woman.

What do you think they have been doing all this time?

They have been getting closer. They have been laughing, flirting and having fun.

They have been bitching and moaning about the mundane and everyday problems with their respective partners. They have been sympathising and BONDING with each other over this.

Because you haven't said anything you cannot be accused of being paranoid but her partner has. This is a typical response to someone messing around or very close to messing around.

You husband is now at the stage where he wants to shag her (if he already hasn't). He is asking her in those texts. He is setting you up so now your relationship has been poor for a long time.

Obviously this is going to be nothing to do with him fucking off out and abandoning you and your children it is going to be all your fault.........

You need to pull him up on this now BEFORE this weekend. You clearly list the steps and points that have happened and make it clear to him that you are not fucking stupid and you know exactly what is he doing.

Do not take any shit from him about being paranoid or guilt for checking his phone and if you need to get angry very angry.

He then has the choice of meeting her and taking this further this weekend or reinvesting himself back into his family life.

At this moment is is emotionally invested in her not you and your children. He may well go to her.

I want to type wake up and smell the coffee but I think you may have just done so!

If he is going to persist with plans to meet her, make sure it's a daytime meeting when you're busy and he has to have the DCs with him.

That'd make them both think..

I don't think I've been so shocked on this board for a long time

What an utter, utter bastard. Do you still love this guy op? Because he is one selfish, useless traitor.

He can't even be loyal to his oldest friend, never mind his wife. As for his attitude? I'll be friends with R if I like and fuck everyone!!

Did he actually tell you pre babies that he still expected to go out drinking till three even when they were born? I somehow doubt it. He is moving the goal posts to suit himself, abandoning his family to please himself. And what's so attractive about standing around in clubs 'till three when the woman you love is at home? Alone, caring for little children.

I personally would tell him to fuck right off, but if you think it's worth saving, you must, must firm up and tell him this stops now. I would also talk to the best frined C for his feelings on this.

She sounds like a manipulative cow, a wolf in sheeps clothing.

I am so angry for you. Stop being so bloody nice and reasonable, that's when bastards take the absolute piss out of you.

Sorry for the language

IMO he has been taking the piss for a long time. Even if he wasn't having an EA with this woman (which he is, if that's all it is), going out every Friday till 3am, leaving you at home like bloody Cinders is not on. Fair enough everybody is entitled to a night out now and then but a full on bender every weekend without you? He sounds like he's trying to live like a single man but with you there looking after him!

Don't feel like this is your fault in any way, because it isn't. You've got young children to look after FFS; lots of couples let things slip a bit on the 'coupledom' front in those circumstances, but it's no excuse to start looking elsewhere.

The whole thing sounds pretty suspect from the onset - she was closed off with you but v happy to get to know your DH and have nights out with him, so I can't imagine that she didn't know what she was doing all along. Arranging little meet ups (either of them doing so, I mean) is just not on when one party is married, and even worse, to a 'friend'.

Don't take any more of this from him, please. You deserve so much more respect than he's been showing you. So you've not been 'prioritising' the relationship? Lets see how much the OW would be prioritising him ten years down the road with two kids to look after.

I would tell him no cosy meet ups at the weekend because, what's to discuss with her? Does he want to lose his home and family? If not he has to drop her now.

Am so sorry for you, I really am.

And BTW tell him to fucking grow up!

Are you still having sex with your H?

You can legitimately say something about this. Your H's friendship with R is now infecting your marriage.

He's spending waaaay too much time with her, nobody spends that much time with someone they're not involved with.

And he texted her at 7.30am on Christmas Day?! That alone would be enough to indicate to me inappropriate feelings, if not an actual affair.

He is upsetting you yet appears not to care enough to addres that. He is also risking his friendship with supposedly his best mate.

Surely you've had enough of fretting and wondering about your H and R?

I'd look again at the kissing at the party issue. Someone saw them kissing? I'd say it's pretty hard to think you've seen two people kissing when you haven't. Sorry to be flip, but either their faces were stuck together or they weren't. I think a lot of stuff is being covered up here. Don't expect that you've been getting straight honest answers from your H. Eg you asked him if he fancied R. He's not going to say 'yes' is he?

for you but please take the advice offered on here and be assertive. Even if things haven't come to a head yet (between the 4 of you) they soon will. Make your position clear now.

PS Of course your DCs come first. Don't berate yourself for having sound family-orientated priorities

Pre dh I lived with a bloke for 5 years who had a "friendship" like this with my married work colleague. Went went out regular with this colleague and her dh. My bf and her were always all over each other, hanging on to each word the other one said. If at discos when they slow dance at the end came on, they would dance with each other! They always denied anything was going on.

Anyway to cut to the chase the bf and I split up. I was devastated at the time and the work colleague said she would remain friendly with both of us, but started seeing my ex and being more friendly with him than me.

We all moved on and I met dh and moved away.

I have just recently found out from another source that they did infact sleep together albeit just shortly after we split.

I am so sorry you are going through this, it is such an awful feeling especially as you are the one made to feel in the wrong.

Sadly, there are stories on this board about unfaithful partners taking their kids along for the ride, so a daytime meeting with DCs would offer no security at all.

He shouldn't be meeting her or speaking to her at all. That's the minimum standard. If he does, after the OP says her piece, he is making a choice.