"But we took you to Statley Homes" Dysfunctional families thread

[MummieHunnie]

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010

Please check later posts in this thread for links & quotes. The main thing is: "they did do it to you" - and you can recover.

Thanks snowy
you're right, she was playing games
I am cross with myself because the whole thing would be a non-issue if it was anyone other than my mother.
I'm not going to contact her until I'm back and she asks to come over again. Her visiting my dc is the only subject I ever contact her about - she gets no more than that from me.

Hope everything is ok with everyone else. Welcome to DWHIH

I don't know how to say this without coming across as being blunt! Honolulu, you were also playing games with your actions, as a way to be angry at yourself and as a way to give your mother power again < MH hides >

I have done the same sort of things myself and not realised what I was doing at the time, sometimes still play those games, I can see through others doing it now as a result!

Fair comment, MH.

You probably won't see this until you get back, Honolulu - weather permitting!

ALL of your anger is about her not being the mother you wish she were. You texted her because you hoped she'd respect your rules (what, suddenly?) then you felt angry that she didn't ask for you, even though you didn't want to speak to her. So, again, you're building up steam because she's not playing to your rules. And so on.

Sweetheart, this game-against-a-game can go on for a lifetime if you want an early heart attack. You're locked into a power struggle with your mum and it's pointless. The reason it's pointless is this: You want your mother to be the mother you should have had. And it can't happen.

She is the woman she's always been, faults & all, and she's the only mother you had. Now you can choose to have a relationship with the woman she is - who cares about you, in her own twisted way - or you can choose not to. What you cannot do is turn her into a different woman.

That looks obvious written down, but it's a complicated path for people like us. It's still the only one, though.

This must look harsh to you, and I'm sorry for that. I'm hoping you will read it after your hols, in a more relaxed frame of mind & with the detachment of distance.

Have a good time! x

I hope the snow clears up to enable you to go and enjoy your holiday and if it was me I would not text your Mum until you are back, washing done and you are settled back at home, focus on having a lovely time x

I guess I belong here. My Dad is in prison for things he did to me. My Mum and I also have no contact at the moment. She got a suspended sentence for her part in the events and I have asked her to leave me alone until at least January.

My story is in the toxic dad thread. A horrid sordid story of him caning and groping and her holding me in position.

I am so lucky that DH has a normal supportive family who have helped me a lot and my school (I am a teacher) have been wonderful.

I said the other day that I feel like an orphan which is not too good in your 20's.

Your story was horrific indeed, tt. Your courage and honesty sets a shining example. The emotional/psychological repercussions of all this must be very difficult - are you getting any professional support?
Welcome, btw :)

Welcome to the thread twoteachers and hello and hugs to those of you that need them.

I'm here for you all in spirit, if that helps x

Just need to offload some neurotic thoughts. I've been posting on Chrystanthemum's thread about her oh.
Now I wish I hadn't even attempted it.
I am so thick and stupid. I don't even really know what I'm talking about so should just shut up.

So sorry if it seems I only come on here to seek support,and don't offer enough.I do read everything,and identify and empathise with so much.Welcome to all new posters.

I really would appreciate some ideas about this....it's going to be long,sorry....

I have suddenly been hit by a big tidal wave of sadness - grief ,maybe?.It came over me when I was walking back from taking the dc up to the hill to sledge this afternoon,I had baby dd in the backpack and the dog was trotting about.The dc were all happy,the snow looked gorgeous.

I was counting my blessings,thinking how lovely everything can sometimes be and how much I have to be thankful for,how well I'm coping,how far we've come.All ready for a safe,snug christmas together,lots of good stuff...

I was suddenly was overwhelmed by floods of tears,I couldn't stop them coming out like ,well,like vomit.I was on my own in a beautiful wood near home,a place that makes me feel peaceful and happy.I had to stop walking and lean on a gate.

Then,the old,huge,deep,bottomless pit of sadness opened up .The one that I used to feel like I was falling into as a child,and so often as an adult,when I was living my old,chaotic,self -damaging life.

I haven't felt like this for AGES now. I can't remember when I last did.

I tried to look into it with curiosity -to observe it without engaging - mindfully.But I couldn't.It floored me. I walked home quickly,in case someone came along,and when I got in,I howled into a cushion until I was exhausted.Then I tried to work out where it came from.

I think it is this :- the trigger was the snow.Last year,in the snow, N XP was still around.I was pg and "believed" his stuff about living happily ever after.Despite the evidence that I see - from here,clearly - that all was not good,at all.In fact,he was being uncaring,verbally abusive and controlling.

I remembered us both taking the dc sledging,and how we looked like a perfect happy couple with their dc and a baby on the way.I love the image.I believed in it,then.

I know it was a lie.I don't miss him,we are happier now than we were then.

But somehow,his controlling, stifling,full-on attention must have filled that hole.

I know he behaved towards me exactly like my parents did when I was a child.And I know that is why he was so successful and how I found it so "comforting" - I really did.

That is what has shaken me today.It's going back to what was being discussed a few pages upthread.Some of you have said you don't miss what you haven't had.

I DO MISS IT !!! I'm terrified I will never fill the hole.I think the grief,the unfillable sadness is about never being loved and held.Never feeling safe.

XP made me feel safe.But he was an abuser - like my parents were and still are.Now,generally,I am pretty sorted and self aware.I know I will not fall for an abuser again.I know I need to self comfort and value and nurture my inner child.

I'm not too bad at doing that ,on the whole.Really.

I am just soooo sad that I don't have a loving partner to be with me - a partner who loves me and my dc and who shares the - frankly enormous - workload,and also the joy and fun of sledging,christmas,teatime,whatever...

I thought I had this.It was a lie.I am missing my own fantasy - aren't I? What he read in me,as my desire,and fed back to me.That's right ,isn't it ,Grace?

But the reason I am posting here - not NPD- is because I am guessing that this longing is for parental love.Or at least it's the absence of that love in my life ,that has led to this feeling.

It can't be replaced by a partner.At least,I am unlikely now,with 5 dc,to be able to establish a relationship in which many of my needs for love could realistically be met.And I am envious of those of you who have dh/dp's.Sorry,sorry sorry..I know that is not nice of me.

I am so lonely for a partner today.It doesn't seem much to ask.I know it's not resolvable and it doesn't consume my every waking moment.I'm not looking for a man.

But I think that is the tidal wave.

Sorry for going on so much.Thanks for the space x

Don't be daft, Bookcase, your contributions were really helpful. I read right through the sites you linked to - thank you.

I'm much older than you and have lived with abuse nearly all that time. So I allow myself to be quick to judge, when I believe I'm looking at abuse. Your replies were far nicer & willing to see both sides of the story - and you weren't alone.

Threads on here aren't tests. They're part of life so there can never be a fully 'right' or 'wrong' answer. I'm sure everyone gains by reading different points of view.

Could that entire long post of mine be summarised as " I feel sorry for myself and wish life had worked out differently.My parents abused me,I was consequently vulnerable to choosing abusive partners.I am now healthier and lucky in many ways,but can't get over myself"
????

I am getting some - more - therapy in the New Year.

Maybe I just need to snap out of it.Sorry.I know I am lucky,really.It's a hard slog for lots of us.

Thank you Grace. I get very scared of putting forward my opinion in case someone rejects me for it. I'm always desperate for validation and for people to like me.

Hi pm. I read your posts and am sending you lots of hugs. I also grieve for the family I never had and I don't think you're awful for being envious.

bless you xxx

I was sure I remembered you posting about that trip up the snowy hill with XP, pm. I seem to recall that you were aware of yourself treasuring your happy-family fanstasy, kids on sledges etc, while he was in fact being a grumpy twat? I can't find it on search, though, so perhaps I telepathically imagined it! Heh.

I miss "it" too. It is the safe, unquestioning, feeling of loving care that you can trust - unconditional love - knowing that people love you enough to make sacrifices for your happiness & well-being. Gah, I'm making myself cry now :(

I do believe it's possible to create this feeling within ourselves, despite its lacking in our childhoods. I'm a lot "better" than I was in this respect. I've still got a bloody long way to go, but am encouraged by the facts of my changes.

So, yes, it's reasonable to feel that much grief; to mourn for what was stolen from your childhood, and for the unrealistic longing for someone to provide it in adulthood. It is very sad.

Was there anybody who loved you unconditionally, pm? I had my Gran - she had no influence over my life, but loved me come what may. I'm very grateful for that. I also think about friends' parents, who treated me as well as children should be treated, and some teachers who tried to teach me emotional common sense. I find it very helpful to revisit these people in my mind, when I'm hurting.

Hi all xx

Sorry for not being around much since my mini-meltdown...Christmas stuff and DC referring keep invading my MNing time, but do lurk/read and wish strength to all those struggling.

piranhamorgana

I think Grace is wise when she refers to using people who did/do love her to patch over the gap of those who have let us down.

I don't miss the parental love, I still have my DH around...but there has been at least one friendship that broke my heart, when I realised how toxic and abusive it was.

I know all the realities of how abusive the friendship was, but also really, really miss the good times.

I would give anything to have those good times back some days.

The only way I cope is to allow myself the luxury of grieving...yes, I wallow a bit and wait for it to pass...so far it has always passed eventually. xx

Hi all, still here.
Our flight was rescheduled until an estimated time of early tomorrow, although I'm not that hopeful it will happen. Could be our whole 3.5 week holiday ends up cancelled. I can't even bear the thought of that. We've kind of planned this trip for 10 years.

ANYWAY, I have seen what you wrote Grace. You do have a point. I just don't know how to change. Speaking frankly, don't you think what you said applies to most if not all of us who still have some parental contact? A lot of posts on here are about how our parents annoy us in the present, and it is easy to think 'why do you put up with it? Why do you play into it?', but of course is much more difficult in practice. It is blimmin' impossible to have a 'normal' relationship with someone so difficult as most of our parents are.

I don't wish to offend anyone, but IMO the people who have full control and peace of mind are those who are NC. I thought I was in control and OK with only seeing my mother once every 4-6weeks, but I find even that painful. I just can't relate to her the way I would anyone else.

So I can't help but thinking that as a general rule, going NC is the only way. I certainly don't feel angry about my father in the same way since I made the decision to avoid him completely. And I really wish in some ways I hadn't kept some contact with my mother, but if I cut it now it effects my kids. I will have to find a way to deal with her normally and without anger, but the older my children get, the more angry I get with her because I have a reference point in front of me as to how I mother, and how my friends mother, as opposed to how she did.

piranha I could have written almost all of your second post, so I know exactly how you feel and wish I could give you a hug. I don't know how to make the feeling go away completely either, although I do have confidence these days that I am a loveable and valuable person, and I am fortunate that I have people in my life who agree.

welcome to twoteachers.

Snowy just seen your post.

Again, I have the exact same thing with a friend. My best friend and I fell out a few years ago and I mourn her every day. I don't mourn my parents - I mourn who they should have been, not who they are. But I mourn who my friend is. The good times outweighed the bad. She doesn't want to speak to me and I really wish I could go back in time and change things, even though I can see that it was a toxic friendship.

Um,I have thought about that for ages.I can't think of anyone,ever.

I used to be an "attention seeker" - my parents always used that as a negative label about me (among many worse) - still do.Of course ,I was desperate for attention - I didn't get any of the appropriate sort.

I had a boyfriend at age 15.I felt I loved him very deeply,I thought he loved me.We spent all our free time together,it was very sweet and innocent and ended when he left school at 16 to be a brickie.His horizons expanded.I was absolutely devastated.

After that ,I was grateful for any male attention.I couldn't get enough physical contact. I got into all sorts of awful situations.

I am dating a decent chap at the moment.We don't see each other often - I have hardly any time,he lives an hour away.It is very very early and no where near anything serious.I am cautious and defended.There are no red flags.

But I have to hold on very,very tight to my HUGE feeling of wanting to be held forever.

I would never,could never let it show.It would terrify anyone.

Oops,took ages to write!
I meant that as a reply to Grace's question about who gave me unconditional love as a child.

Thanks everyone.

Hon, sorry to hear your flights cancelled, I hope you manage to go soon x I can sympathise, I was stuck abroad for a week during the ash cloud earlier this year, it is the not knowing and your life being on hold that is hard, I tried to think of it as an additional adventure and extra holiday and kept telling the children how exciting this was etc... I am trying really hard to think if life gives you lemons make lemonade. I am very bored as we are snowed in, it is far too dangerous to go out in the car and I have mobility issues so walking is not something I want to risk... I keep trying to tink of things to do that are positive, I have just found out how to make an igloo so am going to try one with the kids tomorrow, making lemonade... can you think of a slant to keep things positive until you get to go on holiday, you will get to go at some point x Who are you travelling with?

As for the games, I read a great book about it and it helped me to stop playing so many games and to look at my behaviour, I am not arrogant enough to think I no longer play games, I do think I am less gamey now a days than I used to be and can see through them a lot better!

NC or NC is only something you can make a decision on. When I could not trust myself nc was a great idea, as it was as much about me as those I was in contact with. I am only in contact with my Mother and that is limited, we were little almost nc for almost a year! She rang me this morning, supposidly to ask how we were if we were snowed in, she is on a side road with a bus route so her road will have been cleared, we are not, also our drive is on a steep hill, it is dangerous to leave here, not helped by some neighbours having gone out and not risked going back up their drives and parking so if I do manage to risk backing out and slide/skid as I did last week, I will crash into their parked cars!!!! Mother then told me she had flu and went to put the phone down, didn't manage it and gave loads of coughts and weezing... I snet an email to say I am sorry she has flu! I don't want to talk to her right now.

In your therapy, pm, you will receive guidnce in filling up that hole inside you, from your own resources. Am very impressed to hear you're dating!

Gutted to hear about your flights, Honolulu. I hope you are at least warm & comfy enough.

I have a completely new relationship with my mother. She knows how I feel about her betrayals of me, her child, and the absurd & damaging lessons she taught be about life and myself. I have seen her hatred, recently, with adult and 'therapised' eyes. She is an old woman; my friendship is important to her; I relate easily enough to her superficial self. This is all that's required.

Giving up on my wish for her to be "a mother" was painful but I got it over with fairly quickly. I had excellent support from this forum, a therapist and one real-life friend. After that, setting boundaries has been a bit of a slog but she gets the message eventually and respects my right to my own mind & opinions. She enjoys my company; I don't mind hers (in small doses!)

My mother is weird and self-centred. Some other parents - thisis and pm's for example - are so forcefully malicious, it would be insane to expose oneself and one's family to them. With mine, it was a matter of readjusting my perceptions and feelings about her, then establishing a workable relationship. It's important to her and I would be guilty of elder abuse if I cut all contact - I don't say that lightly, I sought advice.

I've never implied NC is 'wrong' for any Stately Homer. The single task we ALL have in common, though, is accepting that what's done is done - no second childhoods, sadly - and we cannot change our parents.

Wrote more than I meant to, sorry. I hope you're on your way to Paris very soon - good luck!

Grace, please can you expand on elder abuse and how it relates to you and your mother?

Mummie Your post is a massive help to me, thank you, and I rather like being called 'Hon'

I'd really like the name of that book that book helped you re game playing, as I think I could do with it!!

We were supposed to have a short stop-off in one country before going on to another country further afield. I'm being vague as to not be identified. If our plane doesn't leave tomorrow, we are very unlikely to make our connecting flight onwards.

Like you, I've tried to make it into a big adventure. DH and I were like :"Guess what? We get to wake up at 4am and drive in the freezing dark-- to the airport!! What fun!"

I like what you said about NC. You are totally right that it would be as much about me and I how respond as about the other person, more so probably in my case.

It's the same as any other abuse, with consideration towards the extra needs & vulnerabilities of the elderly.

Age UK

Direct Gov

elderabuse.org.uk

The people I spoke to were all very good about saying it's my call in the end, etc. The fact is she would be horrendously distressed if I cut contact. Despite my insights into just why and how she'd be distressed, her pain would be real. I must stress - for me - I can get along easily enough with her self-fantasy and she will listen when I state a boundary. I can do this without causing pain to an old lady, so I do it. I'm not prescribing for anyone else!

Haven't read your last yet, mh, need to take a screen break.