"But we took you to Stately Homes!" - Dysfunctional parents?

[ItsGraceAgain]

It's October 2010, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010

Please check later posts in this thread for links & quotes. The main thing is: "they did do it to you" - and you can recover.

Yes, lovely, thank you for putting it another way. It's an act of faith really. I remember Spiritmum wrote once that, when a caterpillar goes into chrysalis stage, it dissolves into gunk before forming itself into a beautiful butterfly! I was so struck by her analogy, I went and read up on it - she's absolutely right. The creature retains just one tiny core of cells, from which it builds a new creature that can fly :)

I take inspiration from that - the core, I reckon, is like the inner 'me' or the Little Professor and, gunk as I am (!), I'm learning to trust that the inner Grace does know how to grow stronger & more capable.

I have felt - for long periods - that I am NOTHING without the scaffolding of self-criticism that held the old me together. It's so ingrained, I criticise myself for critcising myself and so it goes on ... piling tension upon tension, multiplying negatives by negatives. It's such a strong habit. It's how I was trained.
And yet, you decide to say "Well, sorry, self, but I'm not that great. I'm all messed up. What's the point in arguing?" And you don't die. You feel weird, and it's none too pleasant, but hey. You've created a bit of space for some kindness to creep in.

I'm not a gardener, but I'm sure there must be plenty of wonderful analogies in gardening! You take stuff out, don't you, so as to allow new young plants to grow strong & beautiful?

Congratulations on your Facebook exploits, mh! What a long way you've come, now you can see the 'nasty' people are coming from the strange place inside their own heads, and that you don't have anything to do with that. Nice to be able to choose the better company, huh? :)

Sorry, I'm a bit rambly today too ...

An addition to the stately homes thread... I'd really appreciate your views on this:

I live near my parents and on Sunday, my brother cooks a nice family roast - one that I usually can't attend because I'm at church service (yes, I go, sue me!). Last Sunday, I popped by and they said that there was some left (there wasn't). So this Sunday I asked my brother to leave a plate out of for me if there was a bit left and he agreed.

So, I come into the house on Sunday and ask my mother if anything has been left. She ends up coming downstairs and points to a small bowl of scraps - one potato, a small piece of meat, a very very thin and unhappy looking carrot, that sort of thing. I was obviously visibly disappointed, which she took offence to, and started shouting about how ungrateful I was. I tried to nip the argument in the bud and sternly said that she was overreacting, which made the situation worse.

My father then came downstairs and started shouting even louder, and really got in my face. They haven't hit me in years but my father started slapping my hands as he told me how useless I was, how I was a "bad influence", how I dare I come home and demand to be fed like a child, that I treated the house like a hotel and then screamed that if I really wanted to help then I should tidy the kitchen (which was an utter state as my brother doesn't tidy up after himself). My mother was doing a good impression of "Leave 'er, she's not worf it!" but he was in full flow. I didn't shout or scream back, but calmly asked them to calm down, and that there had been a misunderstanding, and just repeated that over and over again until my Dad finally said "Stop being so fucking reasonable".

I left shortly after, haven't slept since Saturday night and am extremely on edge. Please tell me I wasn't being unreasonable for asking my brother to leave some of the food and (heaven forbid) leave it on a plate, not a bowl of scraps.

Cor blimey, Lessons. It sounds like a scene from a Dickens novel! Did you know they were going to be like this - is it the reason you don't normally pop in after church? Welcome, btw!

I'm so glad it worked out well for you quiddity.
I do feel constantly exhausted Grace, from the constant effort to keep coping. There seems to be a block stopping me from completely letting go. I sometimes think I need to be re-parented so I can start all over again. Although a part of me is convinced there is some neurological problem.

I had an appointment with a psychiatrist today. She was very supportive and prescribed Prozac.

MH I'm glad you're being successful in choosing healthier people to be friends with.

Lessons I don't think you were being unreasonable. It sounds like you handled the situation well in the face that aggression.

grace You wrote;

'I am NOTHING without the scaffolding of self-criticism that held the old me together. It's so ingrained, I criticise myself for critcising myself and so it goes on ... piling tension upon tension, multiplying negatives by negatives. It's such a strong habit. It's how I was trained.'

This is exactly where I am at currently. It stumps me. On a positive note though recognising it is still a step in the correct direction. It is as though my eyes are opening for the first time and when I look(as I always have) enviously at more together looking women, instead of thinking 'they are better than me', 'I ask what seperates me from them?' The answer is self belief. I cant have self belief if I continue to tear away at myself.
Self criticism is just carrying on my parents work, it also leaves me exhausted and on edge too.
It is a bloody hard habit to break though isnt it.

I want to learn to be nice to me

lessons That was horrible to read actually. They sound so very aggressive and well nasty.
No I dont think you are being unreasonable. I find a good measure is to apply to your own children. So if it was your own dc would you think leaving out some dinner was unreasonable? Would you leave out scraps then shout in their face if they looked disappointed. Doubt it .

bookcase Glad the appointment went well. Have they offered any talking therapy alongside the medication?

I've been referred for emdr but there is quite a long waiting list. I'm actually feeling really terrified tonight. I just want this feeling to go away. I'm so scared of everything.
I love my DD so much but i think it's because love has never been a positive emotion for me that it leaves me feeling sad and scared.
Sorry to keep bursting in and taking over. Ignore me.

Aww Bookcase, as if we would ignore anyone on this thread! You silly bugger you.

I think that might be a reacton to getting the help you need bookcase. I felt a mess after my first appointment. Not as bad the second but still felt as though I was talking utter rubbish and that I'd be found out as a fraud. A fraudulent mentalist I am .
Emdr is supposed to be excellent. a poster on here had it and it worked very well. I think it works well in ptsd?

Hi nemo, good to see you around. I hope you're doing okay.
I've heard that about emdr too trs. I'm really hoping it will help with the dissociation.

I'm going to work on some Mindfulness to help connect and relieve the anxiety. Has anyone else tried Mindfulness?

Bookcase, you have a way of always saying what I am feeling--I have spent the last few weeks feeling even more terrified of everything than usual. So much so that I was even persuaded to try OEI, which is even odder than EMDR. I am due to go back to the therapist this week.
I think it helped but it might have been relief at having someone to talk to, or just hopefulness that it would work, or the reassurance from the therapist that I'm not a terrible mother, or a pathetic person because I can't cope.
Nemo, how are you? Are you feeling any better?
And welcome, Lessons. Your family's idea of a Sunday get-together is just horrendous. Is that normal for them?.

Think Im trying my own version of that at the moment bookcase. Trying really hard just to be in the moment with everything, especially the children.
I've heard 'budhism for mothers' (?) is supposed to be good.

Yes, me :)

Slow & tiny ... it's a Zen-like approach. I hope you find some good spaces, Bookcase, to help your nervous system take a little break. x

oops, I've still got my joke name on

Just googled oei quiddity. Looks very interesting. I'd be really interested to know if it does help.
That's exactly what it is trs. It's surprising how hard it is to be in the moment. It takes alot of thought.
Thanks God!
I'm going to get some sleep now. DD and I have had this horrible cold that's been going round and it has knocked us both for six.
Take care everyone xx

Hi again guys!

We've got the lurgy here too Bookcase - I've lost my voice to day so I've had to communicate in stage whispers and meaningful looks

I am not okay, the medication is dealing with my outrageous levels of anxiety really well, it's enabling me to get to all the messy emotional stuff without running away in terror. It makes me tired though, occasionally I have disturbed sleep (like tonight!) and I get headaches as a side effect.

I am finally facing up to not being okay, and what that means, and how much work there is ahead of me. I also realise that the 'I am not good enough, I am shite' feeling that has dogged me all my life is entirely a result of my upbringing and not down to genuine inadequecy on my part.

Swinging between being detached from -reality-- my own emotions or being full of anger / grief / sadness is confusing though. I need a happy medium - connected but not overwhelmed.

Sorry to hear about the voice loss Nemo! I hope you and Bookcase and anyone else feeling ill gets better soon x

So many of you are getting to such pivital places in your growth, it is so interesting to read where you are all at, and so many posts are helpfull, thank you x

At such a time I feel selfish almost posting this, I am in a catch 22 situation as I don't have anyone to bounce it off in rl, and in therapy there is other stuff going on, so I hope that you don't mind!

I wonder if I can post a bit more here about what is going on in my life regarding relationships, as I have posted in the past, just over a year ago I cut contact with most of the people in my life after realising that not just exh was emotionally abusive! I kept the one friend who lived far away and is a very busy person and a few aquantances, so this has been a massive learning curve for me as I have always been a very sociable person!

I messaged the one friend, who I have not seen for a year and a half, we have had phone calls and emails etc during that time, not a great deal. I was always the instigator in that relationship of when we would meet up, that was always the way it was! I finally plucked up the courage to instigate meeting up in January, she said she would like to, has not committed to it. What was interesting from her message, now I am a bit better with this sort of stuff due to TA, was that there is something stopping her, I need to find out a way to work out if that is avoidance due to other reasons or it if is related to me (feeling insecure still)!

Some of you may recall that I said I got back in touch with former best friend who let me down previously. I messaged her also the other day, to ask if she would like to meet for a coffee/tea, she agreed, and seems excited about it. I have kept a great deal back myself. This former best friend let me down when my marriage was going through hell, and she had a breakdown when we were not in touch from what I can make out, she was in touch with that one who sent me the nasty message on fb, and from what I can gather had a lesbian affair and some three in a bed sessions with her when I was not in touch with her, which was very out of character, and all of this is making me nervous, she has now joined a church I saw from facebook which I checked out before getting in touch so sounds like she has settled down awain... not sure really until I meet her! So I am nervous about meeting her and it will not be until I meet her again with my new wiser eyes that I will know if I want to persue a friendship with her, or if nothing or leave her as an aquantance right now!

Also regarding Mother, have not heard anything from her since she phoned to tell me about bro and family coming to the UK. I went shopping near her for something yesterday and drove past her house, she has a skip and it looks like goodness knows what is going on there! She is a bit of a hoarder, not too bad, not one for buying loads, more finds it hard to let go of things and gets stepdad to help her get rid of some of the junk from time to time which is not just physical she almost needs it to motivate her, for example, she wanted my old dishwasher when I had an extra one when I moved and she never used it as it would have cost her too much to get it plumbed in???

So Mother has not been in touch since, which is kind of alarming me, as normally she has some sort of plan, I think she may be getting smarter and going about this in a different way to have her control, maybe ignoring the whole thing until bro comes over and hope for the best?

I messaged bro's fiance over fb, gave her my home number, asked her to give me 48 hours notice and would like the cousins to meet! I have got gifts for dn and the one's that are now probably useless as did not get address to send new baby gifts when dn was born!

Also The exh has gone all quiet, which is nice it is making me have bad dreams, he gave the case to his solicitor and stopped self representing, I did not respond to acknowledge the solicitor letter as I would have in the past to say I acknowledged it so he may think I did not get it! I am scared if he does or does not send dc any gifts/cards and what they will be like, although I told him that the one with dd in a bin was abusive so he hopefully won't send one like that again!

I suppose there is a bit of unknown about distant family and it is at the back of my mind.

Wow, mh, you are doing well :)
I like what you said about your new, wiser eyes!

I've just found a two-week-old email from an old friend who's been very kind to me in the past (I was staying with her when my breakdown started). I've been thinking of phoning her for ages, but still haven't. My phone phobia is driving me absolutely nuts and I know it's a shame-based thing. Am doing some exercises from The Compassionate Mind to try and help myself with it.

It's so wearing, having to think & feel so much about things that should used to come naturally! By way of self-motivation, I'd like to remind myself - now, here - it's because I've learned that the mechanisms I used to get things done were faulty; unhelpful. I'm learning new ways and new things always seem difficult at first, if they're worth learning.

Is there a reason you have to phone rather than email the friend back Grac?

Grace not Grac, better than God as up thread lol x

Well, she's more of a talker than a writer - and I really want to gentle myself through this! Think I'll email her back with the truth, though ... I told 2 people at the weekend I'm recovering from a breakdown; all part of losing the "shame". I guess anybody who can't handle me being vulnerable is the wrong person for me right now. I'm so used to others seeing 'weakness' as an invitation to take the piss, I forget that everything's different now.

Sorry to hear you're poorly too nemo. It sounds like you've made a positive leap in your self-esteem by putting the blame where it belongs.
I can relate to your feeling of swinging from detachment to being overwhelmed. I haven't learned how to stop that yet but hopefully the emdr will help. I'm glad the meds are relieving your anxiety.

Hi MH and Grace. I find relationships so very difficult because of insecurity. I've avoided telling my new circle of friends about my background for fear of pushing them away. But you are right Grace when you mention people not being right for you. I
miss being able to make a crisis call and have someone there to support me. They weren't friends, they were fellow therapy clients/patients, but I at least felt there was someone I could talk to and get a hug from. Not sure where I'm going with this thought but there it is.

Hugs to you all xx

Right back atcha, Bookcase :) :) I know what you mean (I think) about your group members. I really miss the openness & honesty from group - without you people here, I'd be floundering even more! However sympathetic someone is in everyday life, that kind of honesty would either be asking too much or asking for trouble.

I joined AA with my fellow patients, hoping it would lead to ongoing support of a similar nature, but it didn't. I've asked whether there are any Mind groups available here: the outreach person is coming to see me just before Christmas (weather permitting!). I've decided I'll also volunteer to help with computer skills and stuff. Then, if the group thing doesn't work out, I'll still have a 'community' of people who know what it's like to be OK on the outside and messy in the middle

Have just turned my heating up to irresponsibly expensive levels, and am going to settle back & watch crap TV for the rest of the night. Hope everyone else is feeling warm & comfy.

I hope your TV night is going well Grace! I have just turned over to the family on channel 4, not sure if this series was on previously!

I was looking back over the email sent to the former best friend, and I am wondering how I am going to bring up her bad behaviour from the past, I have never tackled anything like this before, my communication skills previously were to not speak about it at all, now that I have changed, I know I need to speak about this with her, and not brush it under the carpet!

She ended our friendship suddenly, she messaged me on facebook and myspace, she seemed to have some resentment regarding her old boss who was in a committee with me, she told me that her boss was on the same committee as me, and I told her about a short discussion I had with the boss, and this seems to have grated on her, that conversation was prior to the exh leaving, all strange! She also accused me of (I must look up on myspace to remind myself) being something that the exh did, after I told her he had accused me of being like that when she ended our friendship.

I was clueless why the friendship ended!

This all needs to be dealt with!

She approached me about a year after the friendship ended, so about 2 years ago, I was still seeing a (compared to the others in the group) benign mutual friend of the two of us she introduced me to, and she turned up (which I suspect the mutual friend organised) I told her the mutual friend if old bf did not leave me alone I would call the police. I can't remember the full in's and out's of everything that had happened, I remember that the old bf encouraged me to get with her old boyfriend she used to date when I was first dating eh, and he was divorced to someone else by this stage. I thought afterwards that she had encouraged me to date him privately not infront of others, she then guessed he had a problem and I confirmed it and she told him that I had told her, and he wanted nothing to do with me (we had quite a few dates and were speaking a lot on the phone and texts etc)... as I say this was a long time ago and I can't remember all that went on as I was in a mess at the time as this was when exh was abusing me at the worst and it was the time I was suicidal nearly as csu told me exh was abusing me (telling me he wanted to kill me and destroy me and take the kids off me on xmas day etc) I called the police as he kept phoning me abusing me and my mother telling us we were scumb etc, he was off his head according to the policeman... it was scary and I was not well as it was without his stuff....and to find out at that time from csu that exh had been ea the whole marriage, and dd had told me about ow and exh began rejecting the children, it really was the worst time of my life three years ago last Christmas!

It was a very hard time for me and I need to really see her to clarify who she is really, to help me understand who I was a bit better, as I am confused if she was the person I fear she was, also she was asking me some questions about my marriage before exh left and I have always wondered since if she knew something, I don't exactly why I want to see her, I feel that seeing her will probably help me in the recovery somehow, not sure how exactly though!

Exactly Grace. It's painful at times to be faced with honesty but I much prefer to know where I am with people.

We're planning to get our chimneys swept soon, so we can light the fires. I love snuggling under a blanket though.

MH. I guess by revisiting people from the past, you will get a sense of how far you have come. Ive spoken to old 'friends' before to try to establish the friendship on a new footing. I think that if she has moved on to the same extent as you, she will deal with a frank discussion in a mature way. Not sure if I've made any sense there but good luck with it.

Bookcase, yes you do make sense, she had some counselling before that time and during that time, not sure if since...

Your open fires sound lovely x