Fab & Glam 11 - A New Chapter

[Tanee58]

I figure that the reason I haven't been able to post all day, is because we've run out of thread - again!! Hope you all find this, my fellow Teabags. Are contenders for the longest-running MN thread?

Anyhoo, TFM, I have a tent, and an inflatable mattress. And I quite fancy a trip oop north!

Well I don't know about you, TFM, but if it was me I would be annoyed by the sheer childishness of blanking an adult, coupled with the injustice of him behaving as if you'd done something wrong, when everybody in the world in space, including a court of law, knows otherwise. The thing is, as you know, his thought processes are not normal and he just doesn't see things the way a reasonable adult would. You can't expect any better from him. He's not too mad to behave better if he wanted to, but he's too mad to want to, if that makes sense.

Annie you have written exactly how I do feel. I hate that he has the nerve to ignore me, as though he is the victim and it is me who is the villain. The only 'crime' I committed was to leave a highly abusive relationship. I know I'm not dealing with a 'normal' man but because I am 'normal' it's really hard to get my head around. This man is even stranger, even more odd than the man I was living with.

He sent me an email a few weeks again in which he accused me of doing everything within my power to stop him from seeing DD. He had open access until he took me to court to get a contact order so I don't understand that one. He also accused me of 'preventing him from seeing DD on fathers day' and says he will never forget that. Although it was my weekend and against my solicitors advice I sent him a text offering him time with DD. He replied "won't bother with Sunday but thanks for the offer". So he refused contact!! But the email is written with such venom that he obviously believes his own lies, his own version of events. It's so frustrating! I know this is projection but it's hard work trying to make sense of it all. Although I suppose I shouldn't even be trying any more.

Council man is coming out soon to have a look at my alarm. It's gone a bit bonkers since the rewire so he has volunteered to fix it to save me having to wait for the alarm engineer. I've got mixed feelings on this one because the alarm engineer is gorgeous!!

Annie, another thing I find really odd is that when he and DD were away on holiday last week he was sending text messages from his phone but as if they were from her iyswim. They were really nice texts, full of what she was doing with 'missing you' and 'love you lot's added to them. He has been so hostile and had even put in his email that he hoped that I missed DD and realised what it is like not to have her around so I didn't expect him to allow me any contact at all so the texts came as a pleasant surprise. I even sent a thank you text to him telling him and he replied with "you're welcome" so I thought perhaps he had seen how unreasonable he was being and was going to be less hostile when he came back. The day he dropped DD back home he had a face like thunder, it's as though he hates me, as though I disgust him. He left her suitcase on the path and literally threw the rest of her things into the house, he said goodbye to DD and left without a further word. See, it's all so confusing!

See, if he was only slightly batty you could send him a copy of his own email as a gentle reminder. But as it is, he'd either say you'd faked the email or claim you had set too many conditions that made it not worthwhile to see DD that day. In other words, anyone's fault but his. But it still makes you thrash your brain to see whether you have been in any way unreasonable, because he might have a point... He doesn't!

Wait for the alarm guy. Got to keep your options open! Plus if the wrong "expert" starts fiddling with your alarm you might be liable if he makes it worse.

Oh TFM. My exP (sounds wierd calling him that now) is showing similar behaviour traits lately. Its as though he is 2 people, I know the drink is mostly to blame but its no less confusing. He has made me doubt my own mind recently, and its only because my best friend was on the receiving end of his abuse that I now know that this is not me and it is completely his doing. Funny how they drag you into their madness and it takes an outsider to point out that no, this is not normal reasonable behaviour.
Still he is lying through his teeth and having a go at me whenever he gets the chance.
The boys are away for a week now and I'm just waiting for the charm to start coming as it usually does when he sees I am on my own and a bit vulnerable. I must stay strong this time though.

I'm sorry you are going through this too Ginny, it really does have you questioning your own mind doesn't it? And that's why it's nice to get validation from people such as Annie that it's not me! I don't talk to anyone in RL about it because I don't think anyone would understand, it sounds crazy even to me so I'm damned sure it would sound crazy to an outsider. The thing is the madness of it sort of keeps us hanging in there, determined to prove that we are not the people they are making us out to be so in a way, they are achieving their aim which is to keep us involved. It's manipulation once again! I have decided that no reaction is the best reaction from now on. I'm keeping a low profile and in an effort to take away his power I am staying out of his sight so that he can't ignore me. I am betting he won't be happy with this though and it won't be long before he is making an excuse to contact me.

I know exactly what you mean when you say it's like dealing with two different men. I lived with a Jekyll and Hyde for years! Don't rise to it Ginny. Don't give him the satisfaction.

Annie, in the email he said that the court order means that DD will now lose out on contact with both himself and her grandparents. His email was in response to mine offering him an overnight contact when DD returns from her holiday with his equally batty mother. He refused the offer of an extra night stating that he is determined to stick to the court order! I'm baffled as to how he can say all he says about DD losing out, due to a court order he instigated, but yet turn down any extra contact I offer him. I can't help but think that he wants to stick to the court order, that he doesn't want extra contact but he wants to bleat about it as though he is being deprived. Idiot! There really is no hope for him.

Well yeah... that's just totally the opposite of how things really are. It's a script in a play. You've walked off the stage, but he's still saying the lines as if you were there, following you into the wings still reciting, expecting you to come back with the next line. When, instead, you say something different, he still answers the script, not what you really said. No wonder it sounds a bit peculiar. Like the Two Ronnies Mastermind where the guy answers the question before last - all out of sync. Except that in the sketch nobody got hurt and it was funny.

Ginnny, I don't think anyone could have been more patient than you have been with XP's (self-inflicted) problems, but you suspected for a while that things weren't right. You said a while ago you felt ungrateful that now he was being nice you weren't sure you wanted him back. It was probably your instincts warning you not to get complacent because it wasn't going to last. There were probably a few hints that you picked up on subconsciously, or semi-consciously. You can't be doing with this lying and blaming shit; it's not a relationship with that going on, and it's far more likely he will get gradually worse rather than better. If you were his nursemaid you'd at least get paid and have days off.

And Dior... about two years ago, I think, I said to you that your marriage was like a bath you'd been in too long, a little too cold to be comfortable, but the air outside is colder so you couldn't bring yourself to go looking for the towel. After all this time it's still the same, though now H is trying to pour some more hot water in to make it a bit more comfortable so you'll stay. End result is though, years from now you'll end up shrivelled and wrinkled and still a little too cold to be comfortable. Make that trip to the airing cupboard, woman! Bathtime is over! Get out and get dry! Don't let that... that vampire keep sucking the life and warmth out of you. This may not mean leaving him (though frankly I think it should). But it does mean stop letting him have control of the taps. (I think I've run this metaphor about as far as it will possibly go.)

Annie - surely you could get a few more bath analogies in? Good job h's name isn't Luke (as in 'luke warm') . You made me laugh, so thanks for that!

I am going to see how I feel after the week away next week. At the moment, I don't want him to touch me, but that might change. I need to give it some time.

And, TFM - you go girl! Two men on the go! Get them both in to do all your little 'jobs' that need fixing...

Spot on Annie. The drink problem was a smokescreen got a whole load of other problems and I ignored it for so long because I felt like I should be grateful he wasn't constantly pissed any more. But it got to the point where it was affecting ds1 and finally I saw sense.
Pmsl at the bathtime analogy - that is very clever!
TFM I am doing the ignoring thing too and trying not to let him bait me and it is quite amusing to see his frustration when he fires insults at me which used to reduce me to tears and now I just shrug them off. slowly but surely he is losing his power over me which is good but it worries me what he will come up with next

Ginny This website is really good, it's very encouraging re no contact and it's amazing how everything the woman says applies to my situation! gettingpastyourpast.wordpress.com/ The book is excellent too.
I think you should be aware that he may try another tac tick when he realises that his abuse isn't getting to you. Be prepared! I think my ex has exhausted all of his methods of intimidation and manipulation now and I am so proud of myself for not caving in and giving him the response he was after. I've shown him how strong I am and I don't think he likes it!

Annie, that post was really funny, you are showing us your hidden talents!

Dior! I am rather enjoying all this attention. I can highly recommend it for the week after the next week when you decide to ditch your H and experience a taste of the single life and what it's like to meet men that are actually 'normal'. I didn't think they existed but they do!! Having said that that is probably because die to all the work I have done on myself I am now in a healthy place and attracting healthy men. As the website I've linked to often says, water reaches it's own level. Oops! back to the bath analogy again!

Thats a very interesting link TFM. I like it.
I am so aware of what he is capable of, in fact we have had the horrible "if you do xxx I will do yyy" argument and I think we both came to the conclusion that we could both do each other a lot of damage. I could destroy his company (all phone lines in my name and I have all his records on my pc) and as you know he knows stuff about me that could hurt my family. BUT after the last time we actually agreed that we wouldn't do this to each other any more.

Last time we spoke he was being very amicable and understanding, he wants to see the boys, but agrees it has to be on my terms, I will still do his admin work and we will look out for each other and stay friends.
I can take the abuse, that's all hot air, its the niceness I struggle with!!

I know what you mean about struggling with the niceness. Even though the ex is being hostile towards me and I really don't like it, I wouldn't like him being nice either. I would be waiting for the next back mood to descend and for the nastiness to rear it's ugly head. At least this way it's clear cut and I know where I stand. Also, if he was being nice I would find it difficult to move on with my life because he wouldn't like it. It's all or nothing with him.

I hope you do manage to keep things amicable Ginny but prepare yourself for no contact being the best way to go. Make sure that staying friends, his interaction with the boys and you doing his books ect aren't just another way of him keeping you in his life. The niceness could be yet another form of manipulation. Stay aware and don't be fooled by him. Also Ginny, make sure that you are being honest with yourself about why you are still happy to have his phone lines in your name, help him with his business and have all that stuff on your PC. be sure in your own mind that you too aren't using it as a reason to have him in your life

If you sign up to that website you will get regular postings to your email address and they have an an uncanny knack of arriving just when you need them.

at Luke! From now on, as far as I'm concerned, that is his name.

Morning ladies, Annie, LOVE your bath analogy! Dior, get into a nice warm fluffy towel pronto!

TFM & Ginnny, oh, the mind games. Reminds me of the loon ex I've told TFM about, the one who stalked me and showered me and both our families with loony, scary letters and kept turning up at my usual haunts (pre-mobile phones so at least he couldn't text me). Again, he was working to a script and got loonier and loonier when I didn't respond. They NEED a response, and they will twist whatever you say. I stopped responding, stopped wanting his liking or approval (realised I wouldn't get it anyway) and that drove him CRAZY (even crazier than he was before) - and eventually, he stopped trying to contact me or get a response - though it took a solicitor's letter to stop the stalking.

Well, DD did really well - two As in Art & Photography (which they said couldn't be done as the subjects are so intensive that, if taken together, she could only expect to get Ds,) and C in English. We are so happy. My mother's comment was 'if you'd studied a bit harder, you could have got an A in English, like your mother' - which upset DD and I was quite cross about - but that's asian parents for you - always wanting us to do well in academic subjects, and discounting the practical arts as being somehow less worthy. Just hope her father doesn't react in the same way - even though he's english through and through, didn't go to uni and worked most of his life in the theatre, he still has a similar mentality and was really upset when she dropped maths, even though she hated it & was really struggling. I've always tried NOT to put pressure on her and I'm sure it's paid off.

So now, we have Luke and Twatman! (DD & her friends - and me, when with them - refer to my problem as Mark).

I've signed up to do a workshop on setting bounderies, along with four of my Alanon group. We stood in the rain in the carpark for an hour last night, gossiping, and I think it'll be a riot if we go to this together as we laugh about our respective problems so much - so different, and yet, so alike.

Tanee Well done to DD! Please tell her congratulations and well done from me. And tell your mother that I say that after everything DD has gone through this year, as a result of your (D)P, she has done amazingly well!

And a big well done to you too!! I wish there was such a course local to me, I would find that of great interest. You are doing so well Tanee, keep up the good work! xxx

Careful what you say - my son is a Luke and he will definitely NOT be a Twatman
Tannee - well done to your dd. Two A's and a C is fantastic - I hope she is celebrating hard!!!
TFM - I think we will separate the phone lines and he will have to find someone else to do his books in time, but the company feels a bit like my baby too, we started it from scratch together so I'm not ready to hand it all over yet! However, I would be happy to hand him over to whoever wanted him
Much as I would love to completely detach and never set eyes on him again, we live in the same street, know the same people and with the best will in the world it is impossible to avoid each other. One thing I am 100% sure of is that I am not going back there, I feel so much more 'together' since the split and I know I am a much better Mum when I am on my own.
We'll see how it goes eh?

Thank you from us both ! Wish you could come with us. It's free & we get lunch as well, as well as info on other self-help groups. Strangely, the lovely lady in AlAnon who's organising us to go, says there are lots of support groups for the families of addicts/narcissists/generally difficult people (sorry, that should be, 'people with difficulties' , in Hertfordshire. Much more than she's found in London, so she heads out that way all the time to attend different meetings. Now, what is it about living in Herts that drives people to drink and drugs?

Ah Ginnny, there are Lukes and SuperLukes. Yours is a SuperLuke . Apologies also, to anyone who's got a lovely man in their life called Mark. Not sure why DD and her friends christened my DP 'Mark' - think it was because one of her friends couldn't remember his name - but it stuck!

Yes, DD is celebrating. Went to a gig last night, is going to Amsterdam on Sunday and will have a fantastic time there. Some of her friends overdid it last night though, one of them got abandoned in the local shopping area and couldn't remember why. Too drunk, thinks she upset her friends (she tends to get argumentative when drunk) and then had to walk home alone. Not good. I suggested to L that it was a good lesson in how NOT to drink, and also that if anything like that happened to her friends, and she knew about it, to let me know and I'd go ferry them home. Scary to think of a young girl drunk and alone in the middle of the night, even in this relatively safe area of London.

Ginnny, see what you mean about not being able to detach when your lives are so entwined. Guess being polite friends is the best you can aim for.

Right, off to the shops now to get DDs euros and a bag to carry them in.

Many congratulations to DD, Tanee. Impressive results.

Of course they're "proper" subjects. To me, it would be Art and Photography that would be the academic subjects, ie the ones where I'd actually have to learn something. English is just the language I already speak, and reading books which I already like doing, so what's hard about it?

My friends call XH Ron, after Foul Ole Ron in the Discworld books.

Well done mini-Tanee! Tell her she is fab, from all of us.

Very quick one from me...
Tanee - well done to your dd Fantastic results - a C is still a perfectly good A Level grade (says she who got a C in English and went on to do an English degree).
Annie - rofl at your bath analogy. So true

Tanee - massive congratulations to dd, they're fantastic results. You must be so proud

Ginny it must be so hard with your lives so entwined. I think for your own sanity, over time, the less contact you can have with him the better. I'm finding that the more I see H, the harder it is. More time for him to manipulate and mess up my head again (still wearing his wedding ring and still saying how much he loves and misses 'all of you') when he doesn't come to see the children for a couple of days. The more distance the better. IMHO!

TFM I hope you're ok. I know it's so hard for you to deal with the way he is, but you (probably more than anyone I know!) are so aware of what he's doing and the way his personality disorder (or whatever it is) affects the way he behaves. You know why he's doing it, and what all of these changes of character are trying to achieve, but that doesn't make it any easier to live through The good thing is, like you say, you've managed to stay strong and not rise to it! That's takes amazing strength so keep it up

I'm struggling myself at the moment. In so many ways I really almost feel like I hate H and what he has put me through. I am still so angry at him and can't believe what he has become. At the same time, adjusting to the reality of never being with him again is really starting to hit me. After all this time I feel daft saying that! But I'm feeling so alone, worn out and a little bit lost! Hopefully just a phase I need to work through. Him still being so 'unsure' doesn't help matters I'm sure I'll get there once the divorce all goes through and work calms down so I can start getting some proper sleep again

Baffy everything you are feeling is perfectly normal and all a part of the process. I have been through every single emotion going, including love! And that man treated me terribly. I think when you feel nothing for him, not even hatred, that's when you have truly moved on. As they say, love and hate are very close! Plus, to hate is still a feeling that you have towards him so obviously he still deeply entwined in your thoughts and emotions. But it will pass, you will work through it and you will come out of the other end smiling Get ye out on some dates woman!! Create a diversion and enjoy the company of men who have respect for you!

Thank you for your lovely words to me. It is difficult but I am managing to keep up my resolve and not react to it. I am determined not to give him what he wants. Sad man!