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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

Told my 4 year old is behind at school

330 replies

dual90 · 12/10/2023 10:24

So yesterday we went to parents evening at my DD school. I kind of knew it wouldn’t be all that positive because a week before we had been invited into the school to view one of the classes. My DD was not her best that day, crying and clingy. I noticed she was being placed at the front of the class which I know isn’t a good sign! I come from an education background- so I’m well aware of certain words like ‘interventions’ etc.

My DD is one of the youngest in the class, so she’s on the bottom 5th age bracket as she is a summer baby. The teacher just seemed to focus on the negatives, but threw in she plays well and is happy! But then launched into she’s struggling with the learning and is not ‘retaining’ and information! I did challenge her on this as at home she makes all the sounds for phonics and recognition letters. She’s also been deemed as bright in nursery and counting to 20 since she was 2! She’s interested in numbers and counts a lot and she’s been doing this for a while. She then says she didn’t recognise numbers, again we challenged her on that too as she does recognise them at home. She seemed a little baffled and kept saying she was ‘behind her peers’.

For a start I thought most learning in reception was play based and we would t have this kind of pressure this early only 4 weeks into term and being told she is not matching up! I did say to the teacher that developmentally there is going to be huge differences in learning just by the sheer difference in age for some of the children, she firstly agreed with that then contradicted it by saying she has other kids the same age who are coping fine. But we still said she seems to be doing fine with these things when she’s at home. We also have no idea what it is she is supposed to be learning. She says she’s in a small ‘intervention’ group. I find this concerning that this is already happening and quite worried she will be pigeon holed straight away and this young age. She had never had a problem learning and nobody had flagged this before, in fact I’d say the opposite. Her speech is better than some children that are 2 years older than her. I had reservations about sending her this year anyway, I felt she may not be ready but she really wanted to go. I also am slightly dissolution ed with whole school system anyway, so for me it’s sadly confirmed many reservations I’ve had. I do not want her to be off as a 4 year old and she’s already had a very tough start in life.

The teacher says if she doesn’t catch up now the gap will get bigger, I found this a very negative thing to say. I know in other countries they don’t even start this stuff until 6 or 7? And they do just fine. But straight away the pressure is on. We will try and help her catch up, but just this morning after the teacher said she didn’t recognise numbers we nearly filmed her doing it as she recognised them all!! And she has done for a long time. I did point out to the teacher that she just doesn’t know the name of the game yet and that she needs to know these things, so it’s more immaturity than anything else.

any thoughts or advice

OP posts:
SecondUsername4me · 12/10/2023 10:28

Tbh I'd be asking the teacher "so what are you doing in class to get her caught up?"

At the end of the day, someone has to be the lowest attaining in a class and whilst jts not nice to think it's our dc, the fact it's Reception and she's still so young, and they've been there 6 weeks max, the teachers shouldn't be writing her off so soon already!

Are they a particularly academic focused school? Results driven?

Octavia64 · 12/10/2023 10:33

If your DD is not feeling happy and confident in school she may well not be showing the teacher what she is capable of.

4 year olds who are anxious about school generally don't perform at their best - it's actually quite common for children to know letters/numbers etc with their mum but get nervous when away from mum and don't show what they can do.

I'd focus on trying to get her settled into school emotionally if I was you.

dual90 · 12/10/2023 10:36

I suppose I do have to say after I challenged the teacher she was quick to say she certainly wasn’t writing her off or that they wouldn’t help her. It was more she will stay in the intervention group until she catches up.

I guess I just have to have faith in her and my DD. I know she is capable as she proved this at home.

the school is probably the most favoured in the area. So the reason we sent her was because she did get a place there despite just being out of catchment. So yes, I’d say very results driven and they don’t want her dragging it down!

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Brokendaughter · 12/10/2023 10:38

They are being ridiculous.
My summer born sons were both apparently 'immature' when they'd just turned 4 a few weeks before starting school (in comparison to the children nearly a year older than them in the same classes)

Both could read, count, do simple arithmetic etc.. but were too young to care about doing it in school, they just wanted to play with all the new kids because they were so little.

Summer born babies catch up over time, but the difference between a child who was just 3 a few months before & a child who is nearly 5 can be enormous.

The difference between a child who turned 14 a few months before & one who is nearly 15 is nowhere near so big.

My oldest academically outperformed & out earns every child he was in school with.
My youngest is still a teen & on track to do very well too.

All your child needs is time.

dual90 · 12/10/2023 10:38

But this is what I’m baffled by, the teacher said she seems happy, and we e had the odd day of tears and her not wanting to go, but not much. I did also say that perhaps it’s the environment that’s not helping, and honestly I agree, I thought this first term would be more about finding her feet and getting used to routine…

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dual90 · 12/10/2023 10:41

Thank you

I did point this out, that I think it’s more she doesn’t understand she needs to know it at school and just wants to play.

But then she said that there are other children the same age doing just fine like the summer baby thing is no excuse!

I agree the difference is huge!

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healthadvice123 · 12/10/2023 10:46

My ds now 20 was august born baby and very shy also , the first. 2 years we were told he was behind his peers ( no shit he was almost a year younger ) by year 2 he caught up , by year 3 towards the top. Same with second DS who was end may baby, both seemed to just catch up in yr 2 and then exceed. They did have some small interventions and ds2 was on senco register for a year but then moved off. I remember being a bit upset with ds1 but then I thought well he is happy he has friends etc all of which I can’t influence and if he is still struggling in years to come we can get a tutor etc but we can’t make friends for him

Octavia64 · 12/10/2023 10:47

dual90 · 12/10/2023 10:38

But this is what I’m baffled by, the teacher said she seems happy, and we e had the odd day of tears and her not wanting to go, but not much. I did also say that perhaps it’s the environment that’s not helping, and honestly I agree, I thought this first term would be more about finding her feet and getting used to routine…

They generally get started with phonics and maths pretty quickly in reception.

To an extent the first term is about finding their feet - for example it will usually be a whole term before they get to the hall for PE because it takes that long to teach them how to get changed into PE kit and walk quietly down the hall.

Again, reception often don't go into assembly until term 2 or 3 because it takes that long to get them sitting quietly as a class for an extended period of time.

But pretty much all schools get going on phonics and maths straight away. If she is at an in-demand school it may be that the intake are generally high achieving and most can already blend some sounds etc. many nurseries/pre-schools teach pre-phonics and phonics these days.

Shinyandnew1 · 12/10/2023 10:51

They will have done the baseline assessments which I’m presuming she scored low on and have put in place interventions where appropriate and have informed you of them-sounds like they are on the ball to be honest. Did you ask if there was anything you could do to support at home?

fearfuloffluff · 12/10/2023 10:52

In two minds about this really. DS is in reception, May baby, mainly wants to play and doesn't listen particularly well. The teacher said he was fine and it would all settle down, nothing to worry about at this point.

On the other hand, if your DD is finding it tough she could disengage with learning, so directing a bit of resource her way in the form of this 'intervention' could be helpful. A bit of extra support rather than 'we've pigeonholed her forever.'

Beamur · 12/10/2023 10:54

I wouldn't worry about it.
It's early days and she's very little.
Don't stress too much about doing catch up at home, I'd just let her be. Reading with her is probably the best and most fun educational thing you can do.
My DD left primary school with good SATS but pretty hopeless at Maths. She just sat her GCSE'S and got a grade 9 in maths and 7 in further maths..
The teacher has to tell you how she's doing based on a very small window of time. You'll probably get a different report next year.

dual90 · 12/10/2023 10:54

Yes we did, but to be fair I just feel like to too soon for all of that. She does all the sounds at home fine and numbers, I think it’s more she has no interest or doesn’t understand she needs to do it there. It’s more about the environment perhaps. I know they are doing their job, but maybe it’s the whole system and the comparison already that I’m concerned about.

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WandaWonder · 12/10/2023 10:56

I have to confess my first thought was how do the 4 years old sit still long enough and control their giggles enough when someone says 'wee' or something for the teachers to tell

SawX · 12/10/2023 10:56

I do not want her to be off as a 4 year old and she’s already had a very tough start in life.

What does this mean?

Graciebobcat · 12/10/2023 10:58

It sounds like the teacher doesn't know her very well- it has barely been a month.

DD1 was very strong academically but the reception teacher didn't say so, wasn't picked up until later in school though I knew she was extremely bright. They mainly focus on their getting the basics.

dual90 · 12/10/2023 11:00

I’m not against the intervention- but I do struggle with this so early and as people have mentioned there is just a huge difference in learning ability and age. I’m partly thinking she is just slightly immature and doesn’t ‘get’ it in terms of sitting and learning yet.

I just think it seems like a big pressure quite soon, even though I think she’s completely capable.

OP posts:
picturethispatsy · 12/10/2023 11:00

Welcome to the madness of the UK education system where children are a statistic on a graph from age 4.

YANBU

dual90 · 12/10/2023 11:01

Written off! Sorry! Missed a word out.

She has had a tough start in life!

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CattingAbout · 12/10/2023 11:02

I'm not sure parents evening 6 weeks into reception is that helpful tbh.

OP, a lot can happen in reception and its such early days (I think my DS was bottom of the class for pretty much all of Reception). When the environment becomes more familiar she may well engage more with learning.

It does sound like your DD perhaps isn't demonstrating her knowledge/ability very well at the key moments, and the teacher can only go by what they observe. It is on the school to help her do this though, not you.

Ask for a meeting with the teacher just before Christmas and see how things are going then.

dual90 · 12/10/2023 11:02

We did! I’m in two minds yes it’s good they are doing something, but how it sits with me in general this early concerns me. I supposed I’m confused, but as I’ve mentioned, she seems to cope fine when we do these things at home.

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Redburnett · 12/10/2023 11:09

How experienced is the Reception teacher? It is well known than chronological age plays a big part in attainment even right up to GCSE.
In my DS's case (July birthday, could not even write his 3 letter name when he started Reception) few teachers recognised his ability until many years later when they actually saw his outstanding GCSE results. As a former teacher myself it remains a mystery to me how so few teachers recognised it.
Returning to your DC it is absurd to expect one of the youngest children to 'catch up' so quickly. It sounds as though you are confident in your own judgement of your DC's ability so just continue to support your DC and encourage her, and obviously do not do anything to undermine her confidence in her own ability. Perhaps ask for another meeting with teacher and/or HT later in the term when DC will be more settled into school routines.

DawsonWins · 12/10/2023 11:11

It’s interesting because dc2 was behind (and he really was - by about a full year) when he started Y1.
His teacher was at pain at reassuring me there was nothing to worry about because someone children just develop at a different rate and there was no reason he wouldn’t catch up.
Being French, I simply didn’t expect my dcs to automatically be ready to learn to read etc… until he was 6yo (that’s why primary starts then in France….) which the teacher found a relief.

Dc was in an intervention group too. I asked his teacher what could do. Agreed on some ‘extra work’ (a whole 5~10 mins a day. No more). I let her know when I could see some specific struggles. She always checked, got back to me and put some specific work in for dc2 during his ‘intervention time’.

Which is why it struck me that the teacher was surprised at some if your comments re counting and sounds at home… it made me wonder if she knows the children in the class that well. It’s early in the year to starts with!

Otherwise, I’d ask her what she is planning to do and what she’d like you to do to support your dc’s learning.
And I’d carry on doing what you do at home - some teachers are simply not that good. Quick to put some children into boxes (esp if more introvert). And missing important clues.

RafaistheKingofClay · 12/10/2023 11:12

dual90 · 12/10/2023 11:00

I’m not against the intervention- but I do struggle with this so early and as people have mentioned there is just a huge difference in learning ability and age. I’m partly thinking she is just slightly immature and doesn’t ‘get’ it in terms of sitting and learning yet.

I just think it seems like a big pressure quite soon, even though I think she’s completely capable.

Earlier intervention is better than late intervention so it’s good the school is on the ball with that. But it doesn’t sound like that’s the issue. More like she may not need the intervention.

Perhaps you need another meeting with the teacher where she has more time. Videoing her showing the skills at home is a good idea. Sometimes some children don’t show what that can do in school. What you need to try and work out is why.

SarahLKelp · 12/10/2023 11:13

@dual90 I hope you don't find this invasive but can I ask if your daughter is white British or not? I ask because I've had similar situations in schools where I have seen teachers be more strict and unkind with children who are not from a white British family.

DawsonWins · 12/10/2023 11:14

Tbh after a few weeks in reception, that parent evening should get all about how she settled.
Not that ‘she us behind and won’t be able to catch up’.