Is it normal for 'challenging' children to receive rewards when they are just doing what is normal and expected behaviour of the rest of the class?

[SafeAsHouses]

Hope my question doesnt offend anyone....but it just seems to be happening alot recently in my sons class, and its tricky trying to explain to him why the kids that are disruptive and muck around in class (as per my DS, I know not everything kids say is strictly true!), seem to run out of school each week with stickers / rewards / child of the day etc, because they managed to do something that is expected of the rest of the class 100% of the time.

Surely there is a better, more fairer way to reward?

My DD gets rewards for sitting and even taking her own socks off.

Im sure it would be much more rewarding not to have autism and sensory issues though.

as an adult i understand why sickers are used in this way

however when my dd was 6 she found it grossly unfair and would rather see him muchking about than recieving stickers for doing what everyone else was doing anyway

My son is in Year 1 and seems to understand pretty well that certain children find some things harder than him, and they get extra rewards sometimes because it helps them learn better. He gets rewarded sometimes too, but has also become 'intrinsically' motivated to some degree in that he does things 'right' because he wants to and knows that they are 'right', not because he gets a sticker. It actually isn't that hard for even quite young children to grasp. I have taught EYFS/KS1 for 12 years and the majority of the children I have taught have grasped the idea too. I personally have never really used a reward system in my classes, and have never really used it at home either, because I haven't really felt the need to. I've always felt that sticker giving is rather counter-productive actually .

Well, I'll leave this thread now as I've found my answer... I asked a simple question and the majority of original posters agreed with me.

Then, others have come along and flamed me and, essentially said I should be happy with my lot and I'm not allowed to feel upset for my son because he is a normal / neurotypical kid. But its ok for parents with kids with disabilities to want more / better / best for their kids.

I don't quite understand why this is so hard for parents to explain to their children.

I tell my children:

"Fair doesn't mean 'the same'. It means 'the right thing, for the right person, at the right time.'"

When my children come home and talk about 'X, who is the naughty boy' I say "I really like X. He's a hard worker." They then say "But he's really naughty!" and I say "Well X finds it harder to follow the school rules, so if he's being good, he's working much harder than anyone else."

My DD1 'gets' that different children have different needs - she has SN and goes to special school - if she can understand that, I'm sure most NT children can understand it, even if it doesn't feel very fair to them.

DD3 had a bad spell of behaviour. I went over the top with the disapproval, then her teacher went over the top with praise when she behaved better (A small certificate each day that she'd behaved, with a house point awarded if she got 5 in a row) and I went over the top in responding to the certificates. That nipped the behaviour in the bud and now the reward has faded out and she's back to that behaviour being expected, not rewarded, as it should be.

There's a world difference between feeling a little sad about your son's disappointment and helping him to come to terms with it in a contructive manner and your method of grumbling that "minorities" get all the stickers perks in life. If this is the way you operate and your level of maturity, then lack of stickers is possibly the least of his problems.

Exactly.

Complain your son doesn't get a sticker.

Dont object to kids with disabilities getting them. FgS.

Would you like a sticker OP? If you manage not to throw your toys out of the pram that is.

Speak to the teacher if it's bugging you.

damn the 'able' kids, its all about the kids with disabilities. I have 3 children, 1 with disabilities, 2 without - why on earth would I want to 'damn the able kids' - what I want to do is teach my dcs that all people matter, whatever their background or abilities.

Its not ok for me to feel upset about that, but it IS ok for somebody who has a child with sensory issues to not give a damn about my child? the certificates and rewards aren't about us the parents though, are they? I don't feel upset that dd1 doesn't get many house points for things, because she is doing ok, she is happy, she works hard, she cares about her friends.

'Good'children, often from loving and under-control homes have intrinsic motivation and rewards. They feel good because they've achieved, they feel good because they know they can please you. Some kids still need those extrinsic rewards that you might have used when your children were toddlers, because they need something more tangible. These strategies are important for them, however unfair it seems. Children who are well-behaved are, essentially, their own reward - they're set for a less troublesome future. This all sounds a bit virtue is it's own reward - but here, it's pretty much true.

If you want to reward your child for excellent work, then do, but try not to reinforce the idea that others being rewarded for simple things isn't fair. It's just some children really do need some extra help to realise appropriate behaviour.

What lougle said re fairness. I suspect I'll have a lot of that to face when DS (newly diagnosed with ASD) goes to school.

OP, I can see where you're coming from, really I can. But please try to walk a mile in someone else's shoes on this.

It depends on the child. If the sticker thing works with this child then it's a good idea.

Eventually the aim is for him to be able to sit nicely without stickers but you have to start somewhere. Sometimes teachers also do it as it is a way for them to talk about it at home, so Mum will say 'what did you get the sticker for?' etc and that reinforces the good behaviour.

If your child feels left out it might be a good idea to explain to him that for the disabled child everything is 10 times harder. Imagine walking up a hill with a massive backpack on your back while everyone's just skipping up in their trainers - that's the equivalent. Use an analogy that works for him.

There is no compensation for disability, whether it's benefits or stickers. Acceptance is what's required.

oik kids and chavs....I really hope that is not how we refer to children of parents who may not have the same amazing parents that all the well behaved children do

and the words used were sodding disruptive..not children with disabilities...

Op - you are sounding incredibly whiny.

I have a child with disabilities and two children with none. Of course ideally any system should suit all. Fortunately my eldest son is able to head off to uni and enjoy his life with friends and a girlfriend, a career on the horizon.

Ds2 is still at home with his stickers .

Try and look at the big picture eh?

Fair doesn't mean 'the same'. It means 'the right thing, for the right person, at the right time.'"

This is one of the best things I have read on MN in a long time.

Can't read all of the thread, but yes it is normal to reward children when they do something THEY find difficult. And guess what, they're all different!

Some kids might already be reading, may be great and maths or good at gymnastics - but your kid might just find something hard- you'd want them to be rewarded right?

And your child is in this class, they are sailing in that ship together.

When my children were in key stage 1 the school had a very good system. They got the usual class certificate which in fairness everyone got in turn. However every term the school gave out special certificates for two/three children per class, who followed all the schools golden rules for that term. The parents got a letter home and the children got a certificate at a special assembly. It was a really good way of acknowledging children who were never disruptive.

The school had a whole week every year when the children focussed on inclusion and the children and parents experienced activities where the looked at disability including hidden disabilities. People with disabilities came to the school to do workshops and talk to the children.

I have a child with ASD and another child who was a typical well behaved child who could have been easily overlooked and not really benefited from just a sticker system. Stickers stamps were still given out like most schools and was probably flawed to favour certain children.

My daughter now in secondary has been praised by her teachers for been kind, considerate and for being a deep thinker. She told me recently that she thought all schools were the same as her primary as she realises that not all of her fellow pupils have the same insight as her.

My eldest is now in year 6.

Right from reception there was a child in the class who caused trouble/sought attention/messed about. If dd1 got her name on the board it was pretty much always at the same time as this child and we had a tearful journey home whilst she sobbed "mummy X was throwing toys into the water tub and I asked X to stop because I was getting wet but Mrs S told us both off and put both our names on the board....."

Repeat ad infinitum over various incidents. Child x never has any diagnosis with any SEN and is on reward scheme after reward scheme, trips up to the front of assembly to be time after time for acknowledgement of achievement in "not doing this any more or having stopped doing that for a whole week/month/term". Some classmates moan about it periodically, some parents moan about it periodically too. Some are just grateful not to be Child X's parent.

Fast forward to year 6. None of this has produced any overall change in the child's underlying behaviour traits. Child's mother pins blame on any other child but her own and no longer speaks to all but a few of the parents in the year group.

All the extra reward schemes have done is managed the child's transition through the school giving the staff a slightly easier time. Sharper, savvy children have learned that you may as well have a bit of fun from time to time especially in a week when Child X has been better than usual and will be being rewarded instead if them that week.

Perhaps child X's parents don't acknowledge their child's lack of ability to sit still and concentrate as after 7 years of school there's no support of any sort in school to help manage/work towards changing child X's behaviour, just sodding reward schemes for not being naughty. They certainly don't acknowledge the child's propensity to tell barefaced lies and blame any other classmate in the vicinity which is what child has gradually started doing over the years.

I have a child with disabilities and two children with none. Of course ideally any system should suit all. Fortunately my eldest son is able to head off to uni and enjoy his life with friends and a girlfriend, a career on the horizon.

Ds2 is still at home with his stickers

This ^

My DS has ASD. He got lots of stickers and reward charts in primary school. DD is NT - she gets hardly any.

DD though will find it so much easier to have a career, find a partner and have a life once she grows up. DS will struggle with everything, right from basic conversations. And he only has HFA - he has it easy compared to some.

I know that the stickers are important to little ones. I get that. But you're the adult, you should get this stuff. Explain it to him that the things he finds easy, others find hard. Ask him how he would make a pot of home made soup, or cook a roast dinner, or some other example of a thing that you can do easily and when he says he can't explain that it's the same for these children. Your son might find this stuff easy, but the other child/ren haven't got those skills yet, but they're learning them.

The rewarding of stickers will be written into the children's behaviour plan anyway, if they need one. That's the point of one. To identify what works and what doesn't. What triggers behaviours, what doesn't.

Children can also usually come to understand that it's good for the whole class if all children are encouraged and supported to 'do the right thing'.

Yy to emotional intelligence and Lougle's point re fairness.

I remember when my ds1 was in Reception he found it hard to understand why he didn't get as many rewards as others and said 'I don't know how to be any better'. But it is perfectly possible to explain.

And as has been said above, the children who find it easy to behave and learn, will be rewarded in so many ways in life. That's why I don't like the idea of parents paying children for good GCSEs/A levels, or secondary schools giving prizes only to high achievers - surely they need to understand that if they do as well as they can that is its own reward.

Fanjo - I have NEVER, ANYWHERE on this thread said that I disagree with kids with disabilities getting stickers. If you can point out where i've said this?

I started the thread asking whether there was any fairer rewards system operating in schools whereby the entire class is recognised for their own individual achievements, not just the disruptive ones.

It was certainly NOT a thread saying "I think a child with ASD or CP or DS should not get stickers" - jeez, i'd have to be a complete cow to really think that.

Do you know, I find threads like this completely distressing. The 'naughty' boy at one of my son's school was showing some really disturbing behaviour and its was chattered about by some of the mother's in the playground and yet the behaviours he was displaying were red flags of a child being sexually abused. But that hadn't appeared to have registered with them at all.

I just can't imagine a life where you are so closed off with limited life experience, but it obviously happens.

And yes, the boy was removed from his family