JAN 06 - so what's THAT you're eating mummy?

[loomer]

Here we go then... I've also updated my album of photos on the \link{http://health.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mumsnetpix/photos\Yahoo site}, it'd be great to see recent pics of all our angels on there!

WTWTA - I am almost of your enforced halt to bf. That happened to me with DD when I went back to work. As much as I love it DS is killing me atm so may have to go cold turkey & force him to accept formula if I can't get him to sleep better soon. (am such a zombie I opened a cupboard door into my own face earlier - the big lump on my cheekbone looks like I've been punched

On a positive note I've been sorting out my nappy mountian & have managed to get rid of some Tots Bots! I'm going to try to sell off a few fluffles too if anyone is interested. Am hoping to buy a few more Wambamboos with the proceeds.
Starting back at work next week as I couldn't keep putting off my clients forever & have been getting calls from prospectives too. Really looking forward to it - especially as DH is around to help with Dom.

NG - lol at your buggy fetish - everyone seems to be getting rid of Quinny Zaps on here atm (I was rather hankering for one to supplement my tank of a silver cross but they obviously aren't what they're cracked up to be)

oops - just noticed time - have appt for food retest with Dom. catch you all later

hi gals well I'm sitting with T on my knee, yes it's nearly 9 and shes nowhere near sleepy yet!

Iris - ouch at the cupboard door incident I think I am beyond sheer exhaustion now and am living in a kind of hypnosis zombie state most pf the time.

Georgie - I know what you mean having a knackered back, T is just so heavy as well.

Lisa - best of luck for this month, maybe you will be like me except have one in Jan and one in July 18 months apart (I have it the oppposie way) on the most part it'ws great fun but one seems an absolute breeze compared to two.

Rach - if you want to re-establish BF I think you could, just keep letting him suck and your body will remember what to do. Do you find he sleeps more now he's on formula? I think it makes no difference some are good sleepers some aren't.

Well poor wee T has had an awful day thanks to A, first she ran over her with her buggy, then I caught her hitting her twice, then she stamped on her head and finally threw a rattle at her, only the rattle got a cry. T did get her own back by yanking A's hair in Asda.

Off to watch this smacking programme now with my feet up.

Hello gals!

Hope you're all busy having lovely weekends. I've just put Scarlett down for her nap and am about to make an apple and blackcurrant scrumble to take over to my friends - visiting her and newborn (five days old), thought it would be rude to turn up without some comfort food in tow . Also found out yesterday that my bf is 12 weeks pregnant, I dunno, I think all this new baby activity might get me all broody again... and I'd decided I definitely didn't want to get up the duff again until next year. Like you Georgie, I want a little longer to enjoy my re-flattened tum and wearing some 'normal' clothes this winter!

Lisa, fingers crossed for you, I'm not surprised you're keen to start again when Lola is such a little angel.

Iris, hope your face is OK now, you must be so exhausted. I must admit that much as I really miss bf with Scarlett, I am a little bit relieved that I got my sleep back (eventually). It IS a hard decision to take, and is much easier if events conspire to take that decision out of your hands.

Re. bad backs, I've just booked an appointment with cranial osteopath as mine has been terrible for the past month. I've never had any back problems before (surprising given my height), and suddenly I've been waking up every morning with horrible back ache which eases slightly through the day, but seems to be here to stay. I've started also taking glucosamine sulphate to help with my painful knees. Honestly, this baby mullarkey seems to have wrecked my body in several ways.

Perhaps I don't want another one after all .

Iris - how are you getting on with the "no cry sleep solution" I may be asking if anyone wants to sell me theirs on MN soon.

It's getting so bad I lost the plot last night. Fed T at 8 as usual put her down to sleep, she got up about 15 minutes later bright as a button, she had a good crawl around the carpet etc then she had another BF then off to sleep again on the sofa (I know bad mummy) I carried her up to bed at 11pm and she woke up, she needed another BF to get off to sleep, I dozed off and about 20 minutes later she woke again, I tried dummy (no chance) tried rocking her, soothing her etc but the only thing that worked was boob, thing is it can't be hunger that's waking her, it's this reliance on the boob to get to sleep. DP has tried with EBM too and no joy.

She has completely changed as she was really good and would go off to sleep by herself and if she woke dummy would do the job. I think as she has got older she just wants boob and me. I don't know how we have arrived at this situation but it's driving me mad. Only time she will sleep without boob is in the car or pram.

There's even part of me thinking would a bottle of formula make any difference I'm getting to the stage where I will try anything.

Sorry having a bit of a moan may ask this is the sleep section.

Hi Sweetkitty - it's pants isn't it It sounds like Talia & Dom have been jinxed by the same gremlin
You must be so shattered lovely - I really feel for you !!!
Dom was totally overtired tonight so I bf & put him down at 6.30. He woke at 7.30 and it's taken me until now to get him back to sleep in his cot rather than lying on a bed attached to me. I'm going to start putting him in his cot for daytime naps (currently pram in the morning) to see if that helps.
Off to have a relaxing soak & try to catch some shut eye before the next round (DH is able to collect DD from work tonight so I don't have to lie there worrying until gone 11 over whether she's been abducted on her way home )

Sorry no time to catch up with everyone else but hope you & LOs all ok

Sk - sorry - just realised I didn't answer your question I think it's working but it's no quick fix (ask me again in a week or so!) I'm writing everything down so I can see the improvements over time(3 steps forward 2 steps back it seems) I suppose he got like this gradually so I'm going to have to get him out of it gradually too (or leave him to scream... and can he scream !! {shudder}

thanks Iris I always thought I would do a gentle version of CC once I finished BFing at a year but I can't go on like this for another 4 months.

Right now T is in her baby walker, running between DP and I in the lounge, eating a rusk and giggling, I know very bad mummy but I don't care tonight.

Hi all ? right, catch up time

Lisa ? hope lola enjoys the modelling. Archie hasn?t had his ?shoot? yet, and im pretty sure he's not going to perform for them ? depends on his mood on the day I guess, but I think he's a bit shy really. Better spend the tokens quick eh?

Wildthing ? Archie had the dodgy ear thing too ? just ear infections one after the other, and his would burst his eardrums before clearing up, then it would come back again a few eeks later. It eventually cleared up so im sure finn?s will too. And about the bf ? have had the same feeling, that theres nowt much there for him. I find tho, that if im off somewhere in a quiet, pref dark, room, he does settle and feed. I don?t feel full or even feel let-down but he still seems to get some. In the day tho, or when theres ANY distractions, he gets really frustrated with the lack of um, flow.

Georgie ? u are not boring. Jeez, if WE cant be interested in the minutae of family life, who will??

Oh Iris ? yes, you do need some sleep soon. I know JUST how you feel and theres really nothing to say except great big eHUGS to you from someone who gets it.

And I feel v about the pram thing. Pathetic really. Good point about the zapp, tho? have had a bit of a hankering for one myself?

Loomer and? hiya!

SK ? sympathy for boob/sleep situation.
What you need is to do is:
1- stop feeling guilty at being a ?bad mummy? ,- youre a bloody good mummy and you know it. Relax about her ?routine? till you?ve done the next step:
2- 2 - your research (no cry sleep solution and Sleep Book for Tired Parents are good resources) then sit down with dp and work out your ?plan of action?
3- then you just have to grit your teeth and be consistent. It will all happen SO much quicker than you dreamed possible and if you have both thought it through and support each other 100% then you?ll have the strength to get through it. Then in 2 months time, you?ll have forgotten all about it! Marvellous.

OK, lecture over!

i actually came on to ask you lot something. but i cant remember it now. doh.

SK, at the risk of being thought of as uncaring, draconian, unsympathetic etc etc, I think you need to knock this sleep thing on the head sooner rather than later. I have nothing but praise for you BF this long, but little T has obviously associated sleep and boob and now can't get herself back to sleep without it. It's a case of re-training her. Also, you NEED sleep too. No-one can exist on broken sleep. If I were you (and here's where the 'un-caring' this might crop up), I would re-establish sleep pattern pronto. Bath, milk, bed. No messing about. Show her who's boss! I guess you've still got a great milk supply and she's eating well so she can't be hungry. If she wakes I would do the watered down formula trick if you can't stand going cold turkey. You might go thru hell for 3 or 4 nights, but it'll be worth it. Aim of the game is to get her to settle herself. Sorry for teaching you to suck eggs. Babes can be crafty little devils when they want to be and have a way of wrapping us round their fingers. Bit of tough love never hurt.Have you got Tanya Byron's parenting book? If not, would gladly send you my copy. I really hope this hasn't come across as being pompous. It's not meant to be. Sometimes one gets so wrapped up in issues you can't see wood for trees. You're fab mum. Don't ever doubt it. You're entitled to sleep and down time as well. Whatever you do, just remember we're here for you with hugs, advice and support.

SK hope you had a better night last night. T sounds like she has got a bit muddled on that bedtime routine. Can dp try settling her once you have put her down for the night, so the boob is just not an option? I know it's hard, but give it a couple of nights, and she won't remember what she used to look for when she woke up.

Hello to everyone else - no time for a proper catch up as I have to get to the post office - they keep refusing my passport renewal forms, the photos 'aren't good enough', so third time lucky today! Means i have to get the sweet old postmistress/librarian to countersign them âgain

We were hoping to drive down to Italy this week, with the kids, but that's on hold now

Was someone asking about recipes for babes ages ago? Here's some that Libs scoffs down.

Pea, sweet onion and small pasta shapes.
Spag bol
Chicken, tom and potatos
Broc, carrots, sweetcorn and cheese sauce
Cauliflower cheese with small pasta shapes
Fish pie with potato
Apple crumble (stewed apples with creme fresh and porridge oats)
Potato, sweet potato and carrot with rice
Leek and potato soup
Melon and yog/petite filous

Ummm, will this do?

Anyone got any ideas for breakfast? Seem to be going round in circles with cereal, toast, yog, fruit.....

Iris - How's the cheek hon? Bet you've been swallowing arnica like its going out of fashion. How's Dom doing?

Bugger, gotta go.

Laters

G xx

Wow Tickle, you are so adventurous - driving down to Italy. I would love to do something like this with DH and Scarlett, but I am too intimidated cos I've never travelled with babe, let alone such a long car journey. Can you give me some idea of how you do it? Do you have a camper van or use a big tent for overnights? Or do you travel in more style than that? Obviously it must be ten times more complicated with all 4 kids in tow, so I am doubly impressed!

loomer - while the babies are small travelling is a piece of cake, you just have to do a bit more preperation than you would if it was just you and dh.
Tickle 4 would be a handful though for sure.
SK - hugs for your sleeplessness, ds doesn't sleep much during the day as he has klingon tendencies at the mo and just won't be put down in the cot. He luckily seems to be fine at night. We have been tough meanies though quite a bit.

Oh Chuffed, you are the Queen of travel in my eyes - still can't believe how much you managed whilst pregnant. I bow down before you !

Good morning ladies,

I could start by saying how I haven't been to MN in ages but I seem to always say that so I'll leave it for now. I see the last bit on here is about travel. Tickle, are you mad? Driving to Italy with 4 kids? We drive to Holland every so often with 2 kids and that is difficult enough! Last time we drove at night so the boys would sleep through it but of course they didn't.They slept for some of it but not anywhere near their normal times. Speaking of travel, I am taking both boys to NL early October to see my parents. I'll be dropped off at and collected from the airport so that should not be a problem at all. The flight itself is only 50 mins. And then... well after my Holland trip is when we take our mental well-being in our own hands and fly to New Zealand! DH is a Kiwi so it will be great to be there and spend time with family, introduce Alex to great-grandma and to meet our new nephew, my boys' cousin (9months). But the trip itself... I just can't begin to describe the thoughts racing through my mind when I think of things to prepare for the trip. We've done it before, when Thomas was 8 months and that was absolutely fine. I would dare say it was better than with no baby at all, just because you are kept busy and have some entertainment. But now that we have 2 boys I think the experience might be completely different. I'm not too worried about Alex but Thomas might be more difficult to entertain. Anyone got any ideas?

I hope all of you with nighttime problems have had an okay night. It is just awful when you hear that first little whimper and you know that within 2 seconds it will escalate to howling. We have been having a few problems here too. Alex is Mr Sensitive (like his dad) so any little thing will wake him up. He often wakes when the neighbours go to bed or when we go to the loo. He had a cold two weeks ago so got used to waking up with the snuffles and it just seems to take ages for him to get used to sleeping properly again. Our solution is to move him into his travel cot in the bathroom so he can have a good cry without waking Thomas. The funny thing is that he often sleeps fine once he is in the bathroom (after a little cuddle). I felt bad about it at first but not now, the boy simply has 2 rooms to choose from.

Do all babies seem to be going through an extra cut ephase at the moment? I notice so many people smiling at Alex and commenting on what a cute baby he is. He's always been my gorgeous boy but it just seems that maybe he is going through an extrovert phase and flirts with everyone in sight. At the same time, he can have extra grumpy moods and scream over nothing. Not sure if this is because he is a bit tired or just because he is frustrated at not being able to get up and walk or crawl yet. It certainly can't be his teeth since he now has 8 in place. Surely the next lot will wait a while?

Ha ha ha, ijust had to come back and write another quick note for SK. I am in the middle of vacuuming and thought, let's put Alex in the babywalker and see what he does. And he is chasing after it too, just like Talia! Great idea!

Bum - just lost a huge message typing too fast hit the wrong key - will be back later grrrrr

at the bowing down.

Eshay will be able to tell you all about my trip to UK in 2wks with 2kids dd just 2.5 and ds obviously same age. We are hoping dd will enjoy Singapore's inflight entertainment and dh is trying to get a couple of extra memory cards for his PSP at the moment so we can download the dvd's onto it that we know she loves and can watch over and over. We will be buying a few new books and toys for our trip that she hasn't seen or read before. I'm sure it'll be fine.

We are going through a cutey phase too, in fact the flirty grumpy boy sounds very familiar.

Well off to the beach now, 15mins walk. Chat soon.

hi all thanks for all the messages of support, I suppose I'm just having a hard time and it's all got on top of me right now T's not sleeping is just one of many troubles. Well last night we did the same sleep routine as normal (have now decided she is not coming back downstairs after 8pm) so she went to sleep at 7.30pm, then was up at 8, 9.30, 12, 2, 4, 6 and finally at 8 luckily it's 5 mins of boob and she's asleep again, oh and she had one afternoon nap of 30 mins all day yesterday too. I know I have to go cold turkey soon and I'm dreading it, I'm a pure wimp it's so easier to pull up your top and settle her, she gets so wound up in a right state too. Last time I went out poor DP just could not settle her at all, 2 hours she cried for until she passed out. Refused all EBM too (she used to take it fine). The plan is in 4 weeks we move her into her own room and take it in turns to sleep on the floor and settle her, kind of like a pick up put down method a la baby whisperer, that way at least one of us gets a decent nights sleep. Anyway enough whinging from me.

Eshay - good to see you good luck with going back to NL and NZ too wow you are brave, I feel brave driving for an hour with both of them. Vacuuming time is hysterical in our house, theres me with my big Dyson, Abbie with her little one (she HAS to have one) and vacuum the same piece of carpet as me and Talia chasing us in the baby walker and me tripping over everything. T still only has 2 teeth but the top two are sitting right under the gums just waiting. She can only crawl backwards right now, hasn't found first gear yet but with shuffling, rolling and crawling backwards she can get all over the floor, much to Abbie's disgust as her toys are usually in the firing line (just wait until T is walking!)

hi to Tickle and Loomer too - all this travelling with children you lot are so adventurous.

georgie - I know it can't go on the no sleeping, I'm with you on that. Your apple crumble sounds nice will steal that one, in fact we have a similar menu in this house, for each meal T has a range of finger foods (she's even managing peas and sweetcorn now) whilst I sort myself/get Abbie sorted then she has a few spoonfuls of her own meal, our favs are:
cheese sauce with pasta shapes or cheese sauce with veg
cheesy mash with carrot
spag bol
lentil and sweet potato (absolute fav)
veg casserole thing
tomato rice with mozzarella
leek and potatoes in a thick soup thing with greek yogurt
cottage pie
then the usual yoghurt Rachels Organic or Yeo Valley organic

finger foods: toast, pancakes, eggy bread, cheese on toast, cucumber, tomato, peas, sweetcorn, carrot , broccoli, raisins, apple, peach etc, little bits of chicken. Wow thats quite a list I'm still she eats so much more than Abbie ever did, I love cooking for a baby that actually eats it

Abbie's sleeping and Talia's eating = ideal child nah they are both great

Anyway off for an early night (no not for that before you ask I know what you lot are like, speaking of which my periods still haven't came back, bought some erm condoms hadn't a clue what to buy so ended up with mega thich extra extra safe poor DP he says it's like an inner tube).

Chuffed, if you're flying Singapore Airines, does that mean you stop off in Singapore? I have read a few posts by other MN'ers that Singapore Airport is so wonderful - there's a swimming pool you can use if you have a few hours to wait between flights. I've been to that airport once and thought it was nice but didn't know about the swimming option. Great to tire out the kids for the next leg of the journey.

SweetKitty, you may want to try some sleep training during the day too. Am I right in thinking Talia doesn't nap much? There are several baby experts who agree that naps are important for a good night and I agree as well. Alex has almost 3 hours a day and on the days that he doesn't he usually wakes up more at night or earlier in the morning. Nap training might be easier than night training too as you don't have to worry about Abbie being woken up.

Eshay - if we are in the house during the day I have the same routine for daytime naps every day, BF at 11am and put down for a nap, same at 2pm, sometimes she sleeps sometimes she lies there and plays.

Last night wasn't too bad down at 7.30pm, up at 12 and 3am for feeds and that was her until 6.45 this morning. Then we went to a friends today she had a feed at 11.15am went to sleep and I out her in my friends babies' cot and she slept for 2 hours (I will go around there every day now!)

sk ROFL at inner tube!!! I have a feeling those super industrial strength ones are aimed at a different market
Hate hate hate condoms, but we are using them too... DH's street cred on this island must have gone up, as I bought some at the pharmacy that are 'just a little bit bigger'. Oo-er.

, as I want to have at least one normal period before getting a coil fitted (had a mirena between ds1 and dd2, and it suited me fine).

Travelling won't be quite so adventurous for us as hoped, as my passport still hasn't come back, so we have opted for a long weekend at a Centre Parcs type place here in Denmark. So the food won't be quite as good as Italy but the journey should be easy! And the two older children are naturally over the moon Off tomorrow, back Monday.

I'm actually really excited - we haven't had a proper holiday for years

Good luck Tickle.

Eshay we are in Singapore airport for less than 3hrs. We didn't want to stay for long as there are renovations being done at the hotel at the airport so noise, questioning what might be open etc we thought we'd just go right through. Same on way back. We have enough time really to get to gate and run around and play a bit with dd at 2.5yrs.
Had a great afternoon at the beach yesterday ds loved it too but got home to huge influx of ants so now have to get that all sorted before we go away.