Zelensky - Trump meeting.…just horrible. BBC news live.

[JanieJS]

Scary stuff.

I don't know what to say.

Yes I agree it looked to me like a set up. It could be part of his negotiating tactic or trying to appear tough to the American public but it seemed nastier than that with their attempt to humiliate Zelensky - whatever you think of him, he's carrying the can for Ukraine and three years into a devastating war with a powerful aggressor and being hijacked with a slating match in a foreign language on ccamera. He knows he is in a tricky situation with that man and has to tread a fine line. Putin must be cockahoop - love to know what he has on Trump

So disturbing to see this. Putin must be so happy. Sickening.

If @NDHz is correct it would seem to be working.
(NDHz's post: "Surely this is scripted for Putin.
Make it look like it is soooo hard to get Zelensky to agree to a deal (so that Putin concedes more).
These things are worked out in detail behind closed doors, not in front of the press.")
Maybe it's irrational hope that makes me want this to be true.

It was not a set up. It’s my job to read body language, and Zelebshyy’s body language suggests he was under intense pressure and attack, His eyes were darting everywhere, he crossed his arms multiple times, the barely contained fury was genuine.

I do however believe Trump’s part in the fiasco was planned, this did not happen by accident. Whether they intended to go that far is questionable. Trump is trying to put some hard yards between himself and Ukraine in order to extract the US, the way he has achieved this by publicly humiliating another president, and then compounding the situation by throwing Zelenskyy out of the White House was astonishing.

It also provided very clear signalling to Iran, North Korea, Russia and China that you can not mess around with Trump - things have changed. The gloves are well and truly off.

Not a terrible strategy from a US point of view, if you consider the implications - nonetheless Ukraine have suffered a global humiliation to facilitate this messaging.

Zelenskyy was ill advised to campaign for Biden so publicly, and to not have understood the sea change in global politics.

I will be very interested to see what happens next..

I meant Zelensky was set up @Biscuitsnotcookies

@Biscuitsnotcookies "Zelenskyy was ill advised to campaign for Biden so publicly, and to not have understood the sea change in global politics."

Absolutely this ^

Zelensky brought this fiasco on himself.

And doesn't the guy own a suit? When you have a meeting with the leader of the Free World you don't turn up looking like your about to give your car an oil change.

He's either naive or stupid or both.

@Purplelodestone Are you for real? Trump didn't seem to mind when it was Elon Musk standing in the Oval Office in unsuitable clothing with his 4 year old child who was wiping bogies on the resolute desk!

The problem is that Trump looks at countries like North Korea, China and Russia and he admires their leaders and thinks that America should be governed in such a way.

The flavour of Trump 2.0 is one which seeks to entirely derail democracy in the US and to put an end to fairness or free speech. America is in for a tough time.

He always wears that kind of outfit. I think that's his "I'm in the middle of a war" outfit which aligns him to his fighters and I also think they were just nit-picking and looking for excuses to attack.

I'm also not sure he 'campaigned' for Biden - although that's what they are trying to accuse him of doing (again presumably part of the set up). He's walking a very tricky fine line (whatever the administration) as he needs them (and Europe).

Let’s not forget that when the war started, the Biden administration offered Zelenskyy safety and a way out of Ukraine so that he wouldn’t be assassinated. His response to that was thanks but no thanks.

I’ve now watched the whole meeting. I think many of you on this thread should too. Zelensky effed it up.

I'm surprised his dick is large enough to wobble a little let alone swing.

😂 You hope Starmer, the wet blanket, speaks up. He is a weak individual and does not have the attributes of a leader.

And your view on fighting with France against Nazi occupation?

Anyone else think there was a language barrier in what zelensky was trying to say and them just misinterpreting it I.e he said we were alone I.e. their soldiers fighting alone I took this to mean not- not supported. But trump jumped on this and twisted the sentence completely.
Or the lack of 'thank yous' referenced by Vance. He didn't given zelensky a chance to reply, but incredulous -what are they looking for? For him to drop to knees when he said he already thanked them and was trying to again before being cut off. Mind boggles.

How so?

Have you watched the full meeting?

America voted for Trump. Britain voted for Starmer. And look where we are now. What a fucking shitshow! These individuals do not have the qualities of good leadership. A true leader is someone like Zelenskyy. Someone like Churchill. Strong, calm, dignified men who hold their heads up high no matter what.

We used to StandWithUkraine and show our support. WTF is actually happening now?

Will there be any part of Trump that is concerned about the backlash that is building (the rest of the world siding with Z and calling out T and V for the bullies that they clearly are) and also that Trump presumably really wants that minerals deal and now it isn't signed?

I think it's language difficulties that have exacerbated this . Also differing perspectives. Trump wants to be the negotiator brokering a deal between Russia and Ukraine remaining friendly with both yet Zelenskyy wants America solely on his side.
The west has given billions in war effort yet are no further forward for their money and no nation has a bottomless pit . Trump being a business man wants a return on his money not to keep giving more .
Zelenskyy looks and speaks like a warlord which is a cultural shift , it didn't start well not putting a suit on , his advisors should have told him to make an effort because he isn't on the battlefield he's in possibly the highest office in the world , the Oval Office and for a world watching event he should have known looking scruffy isn't a sign of respecting that office .
I also think Trump is very much a businessman, no political diplomacy's, let's cut to the chase , this is a war , people are dying , what do we need to do to make it happen . The big thing with trump is he needs to be flattered and that didn't happen .

I've only just watched it, I think a set up for Trump to publicly paint Zelensky as THE obstacle to peace so he can justify USA pulling financial support. Zelensky looked surprised and furious.

Yes it is war. Not fucking Dragons Den!

If the UK thinks it’s getting anything out of the US, it’s got another think coming. Trump and Putin both congratulated the UK for leaving the EU. What I think they actually want to do is isolate us further from Europe, make us remove all controls over big tech and “free speech” on the internet, and effectively tell the UK it can either join the US and Russia as one of their corrupt vassal states, for use in money laundering and provision of golf clubs and as a playground for corrupt, wealthy Russians and Americans (as it has been for years already), or trail along with the EU, but not in the EU, with best chums Russia and the Trump-US crushing the life out of us.

I don’t think it was a language barrier problem. They had it in for Zelensky. They weren’t trying to understand him, in fact they were talking over the top of him.

The New York Times has said Zelensky has thanked the US 33 times already. A quick google proved to me he has thanked Ukraine’s allies. I googled half a dozen countries off the top of my head and he has said thanks to all of them. They include UK, France, Denmark, Japan, Romania, Australia, NZ. Allies all over the word.

Zelensky is a dick. For months, he saw Russian troops amass on his border and refused to engage in talks to prevent the war - instead thinking his (invisble) NATO mates would back him. Did he think Putin put those troops there as a training exercise?

He has spaffed countless lives and money and munitions on this war and now wants other troops to die for his country. No sane leader would put their troops on the line for a war that was avoidable.

Like him or not Trump was right to call Zelensky out on this - and for Zelensky to try and play this out in the media was a fucking stupid move.

The USA should fuck him off, especially after the colossal sums and weaponry provided - none of which will ever be paid back. If I was a US taxpayer, I would be pissed that my taxes are funding a bullshit war that the USA wants no part of.

Zelensky fucked right up and I am glad Trump/Vance called him out on it and booted his sorry ass out of the White House. Zelensky can go crying now to his EU mates to see whether they will pony up more money and lives for a war Zelensky chose to ignore and now cannot win.