Trump fans, what are your thoughts now please?

[lentilbake16]

Just wondering.

The "data " that musk was highlighting had people claiming social security type payments and were 300 yrs old etc.

It's just when the set the program up the data has a wrong date configuration in the program. So these people are working people paying taxes .

When you actually unpick most of the claims they aren't true.
He even said that when he joined Trump with the child in the oval office. .. he said not everything I say is true...

You could apply that thought process to any political view. I could equally ask whether the poster who is "thrilled" with Trump based solely on his views on gender and sex is bothered about women being denied their rights in countless other countries across the globe. Or whether they are only concerned with women's sports/healthcare/safety in this specific context. I don't think that the fact people are more closely involved in the politics of their own country or countries they share close ties with, means that they don't care about the same issues elsewhere, or that it's a sign those views are disingenuous. It's not some kind of "gotcha".

The claim has been debunked by many news outlets. For example:

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2023/12/14/no-proof-ukrainian-president-zelenskyy-bought-florida-mansion-for-20-million-fact-check/71918711007/

https://observers.france24.com/en/europe/20231218-no-volodymyr-zelensky-didn-t-buy-a-villa-in-florida

This is worth a read too:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c72ver6172do#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=17400441523026&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com

You are basically swallowing Russian propaganda whole.

Not sure any of those other countries are secular and the richest democracy in the world .

I have often posted about a range of inequalities on MN to tumbleweed to be honest.

Yes. It was, believe it or not, being discussed ahead of time.

There were calls for an election when it became due. Zelensky was also regularly asked for his position (ahead of time).
There was an opinion amongst some conservatives that Zelensky’s team initially wanted to hold elections (because his support was so high), but as ratings slipped they went cold on the idea.

Oh look, another right-wing talking point that even two minutes of research will show is a lie.

Reuters, the organisation that produces news, was NOT given money by the US government to "literally create 'large scale social deception'".

Thomson Reuters Special Services, a separate company that is part of the overall Reuters group but that is NOT involved in production of journalistic content, was given money to investigate the effects of large scale deception on social media platforms with the aim of developing better ways of countering such deception.

This is MAGA in a nutshell. Blatant tinfoil-hat level conspiracy theorist lies are thrown out at such an intense rate that the gullible and/or those who already half-believe them just accept them as true without investigation. It's a firehose of falsehoods. And, because it's ten times easier to repeat a lie than it is to explain exactly how that lie is a lie, those lies spread rapidly among those who are too lazy, scared and/or tinfoil-hatted to bother verifying what they're being told.

What's particularly instructive is to look at which organisations these lies and smears are aimed at. Legitimate journalism is repeatedly under attack by Trump and his allies. Efforts to identify and counter deception and radicalisation are under serious attack as are the institutional checks and balances that exist to mean the US president has limits to his power.

Could you detail that criminal spending please? Or link to an audited report that gives figures. Thanks.

Like how easy it is for all women and children to travel potentially hundreds of miles to receive abortions

Just a wee correction on that - thousands of miles, potentially. Pretty sure women in the UK are appalled that some women in NI have had to travel to the mainland to access terminations - it would seem this equivalence doesn't apply to the US and I am trying really hard to understand why.

But it would have been against their own constitution to do so, as I understand it.

'according to trump'. The man starts and ends ever day with a lie. You've got to be daft to quote him as an authority on anything

People do not change their views even when given facts, it’s a recognised phenomenon.

you’re seeing it more and more, and on this thread. People who have been lied to somehow feel that acknowledging that shows weakness or stupidity. In fact it’s the opposite and we should all be prepared to put our hands up when we get something wrong or are lied to.

there are a number of posters on this thread who have been lied to, believed it (perhaps because it suited their views) and no matter how many facts you show them, they will not change their view!

You could just concede the point that you repeated the lie without knowing what you were talking about without changing your position to he might be a dictator we’ll have to see.

😂

Perfect example. This poster believed a lie and even when it’s shown to be that, they can’t back down and they go with “well let’s just see”.

their position is formed by the lie and they won’t now say “ah yes, that was wrong”

Re: where the money has gone - Ukraine didn’t get it all in cash did they? so it’s not exactly missing.

The US gave Ukraine weapons that were near the end of their lives and they would have to recycle and replace anyway and then have quoted the cost of new weapons as part of the total funding. I’m guessing the EU, individual European countries and the U.K. may have done something similar.

God reading this is so depressing.
The reuters thing is obscenely stupid

The man and his team are blatant liars, proven to be liars and yet people still lap it up.

One thing is certain Biden/Harris “business as usual” approach to gov spending and efficiency was wasteful.

If new administration saves even 1% of spending it’s a win….

Makes me think of Labour scrounging for ££ from pensioners, private schools and farmers when they could cut their own waste and overseas “aid” for quicker financial gain that doesn’t negatively impact UK residents.

By the way, the Rachel Reeves expenses fraud at the bank revealed by BBC investigation … she is appalling.

I don't know that there was/is any documented reason. It would've been almost impossible I'd think to hold elections that were free/fair/inclusive. So yes, Trump is on very thin ice in his accusations about Zelensky and the lack of election. It suits Trump's objective though, which is to end the war. He's not seeking a 'fair' way to end it; there IS no fair way. Trump is doing the dirty job that we all suspected (yes, sadly, but necessary nonetheless) would be required.
It was never going to end in a pleasant hand shake. We can talk about the fairness of it all but ultimately after 3 years of stalemate and epic loss, none of us want to see more lives sacrificed.

@MercurialButton saying that saving money would be a "win" without considering the knock-on effects of those savings is incredibly short-sighted.

The US could save a huge amount of taxpayer money in the short term by stopping all funding for Medicare/Medicaid, public schools and maintenance of road infrastructure. But the long term effects would be crippling.

And yet Skippy's comment about Trump voters not thinking was't an absolutely huge generalisation?

Forgive me, but "pregnant men" and "lesbian with a penis" are entirely the creation of the left. These people do not get to lecture me on what is fiction or otherwise.

This. Anyone can save money but you don’t know it’s actually a saving until you see the impact. I could save myself loads by not paying the mortgage, but would you see that as a saving when the house gets repossessed?

It's not for you to determine who should and shouldn't be voting based on whether they treat the process with 'the seriousness it deserves'. Is there some sort of acceptable seriousness measure employed at the voting booth? I see these issues are very important to you, but they are not important to everyone, and nor do they need to be.....even world peace and human civilisation.

I see him sticking to what he promised in his election campaign and actually making Starmer and the rest of the European leaders sit up and do something regarding Ukraine. I don't see how people can knock him for sticking to his policies, it's because of those policies people voted him in. Regardless of your opinion on him surely you can't criticise someone for doing what they said they'd do.

Let's not forget this.

The orange one is clearly holding a grudge, unfortunately for the rest of the world he isn't clever enough to realise that he is threatening world peace.

Frighteningly, a Russian politician spouted something along the lines of the world only needing the US and Russia and that they could carve up Europe between them on TV earlier this week.

Presumably he will stop being a dictator when the war is over and move to his $35m home in Florida 🤣 and drive around in Mrs Z's Bugatti 😂