I wouldnt have had another baby if I knew things would be like this

[FishHighJumping]

I’ve honestly had enough now. I’m not cut out for this, I’m just not.

I’ve got two boys, DS1 has just turned 4 and DS2 is 23 months. DS1 has suspected autism, not diagnosed yet because apparently everything takes about 400 years, but we’ve been told there are definitely developmental concerns. Getting dressed is a battle, leaving the house is a battle, coming back into the house is a battle, food is a battle, bedtime is a battle. There is no normal day here anymore.

He is aggressive aswell. He hits, kicks, throws things, screams, pulls hair, pushes. He regularly pulls his little brothers hair and shoves him over and then I’m the one having to get between them while DS2 is crying and DS1 is screaming because I’ve stopped him. I tell him leave him alone, I say it nicely, I say it not nicely, I move DS2, I move DS1, nothing makes any difference. DS2 has started copying him now aswell. He pushes things and shouts and has started doing this horrible little angry noise that DS1 does. I feel like I’m watching him turn into the same sort of child and I cannot cope with two of them doing it.

They share a room because we only have two bedrooms and bedtime is honestly a joke. DS1 won’t leave DS2 alone. He gets out of bed, goes over to him, pulls his hair or takes his blanket or whatever he can get hold of. Then DS2 starts crying, DS1 gets louder, I go in there, they both get more worked up and suddenly it’s half 10 and nobody is asleep. I dread bedtime. I actually start feeling sick when it gets to about 6 because I know what’s coming.

DS1 was at nursery but he wasn’t coping there at all. He was having problems with the other children and the staff were struggling with his behaviour. He was getting more and more upset and it just wasn’t working so he isn’t going anymore. He’s just here with me all day every day now. No break, no quiet, no chance to think. DP works full time and doesn’t really see what it’s like during the day. He comes home and DS is sometimes sitting eating or watching something and then apparently I’ve made it sound worse than it is. Yes because you’ve been here for twenty minutes and he’s currently eating a biscuit.

Today was awful from the minute we left the house. We went into town because I needed a few bits and thought it might be nice to get out for once. I took the double buggy, but DS1 refused to sit in it. Screaming, getting out, throwing himself backwards every time I tried to put him back in. In the end I let him walk because I couldn’t spend the whole afternoon wrestling a 4 year old into a buggy while DS2 sat there watching.

Then he ran off. He saw something and went and I was trying to get DS2 out of the way of people and by the time I looked up he was gone. I had to leave the bags and run after him. I was furious and terrified at the same time, which is a horrible combination because you’re trying to catch your child while also wanting to scream at them. I can’t take my own children into town for half an hour without it turning into an emergency. What am I supposed to do, stay in the house until they’re teenagers?

Then he wanted food from one of the shops and when I said no he started screaming again. Honestly the only time he seems properly happy is when he’s eating. He can be miserable and shouting for hours and then you give him something and suddenly he’s fine, sitting there like nothing happened while I’m shaking and trying not to cry. I know people will say sensory issues and regulation and all the rest of it, but I’m telling you what it is like to live with. We came home early and the whole afternoon was a complete waste of time.

I cried when we got home. DP asked what was wrong and I said I don’t want to do this anymore. I don’t want every day to be like this. I don’t want to spend my life dealing with screaming and hitting and trying to stop one child hurting the other. I don’t enjoy taking DS1 anywhere. I don’t enjoy playing with him. I don’t look forward to him waking up. I feel horrible writing that but it’s true. Sometimes I just want him to go away and leave me alone for five minutes, which obviously makes me feel like the worst person alive.

The thing I feel worst about is I wouldn’t have had another baby if I’d known DS1 was going to be like this. I love DS2, obviously I do, but I feel like I’ve brought him into a family where he can’t even have a normal childhood because everything revolves around DS1. He can’t play in his own room without DS1 going over and grabbing him. He can’t sit with a toy without it being taken. I feel like I’ve made a massive mistake having two children when I can barely manage one. I thought it would get easier as DS got older but it hasn’t. If anything it’s got worse and now there’s another child being dragged into it.

DP says I’m being horrible and DS can’t help it, which I KNOW. I’m not stupid. I know he isn’t waking up thinking how can I ruin mums day today but it feels like it and knowing why he does it doesn’t make it less exhausting when you’re the one dealing with it from 7am until bedtime. I’m the one who can’t go to the toilet without something happening. I’m the one who can’t get them both dressed without somebody screaming. I’m the one who has to watch DS2 every second because DS1 might suddenly pull him over. DP gets to go to work and have adults around him and eat his lunch without somebody throwing a cup.

I’ve been looking into autism assessments and support but everything takes forever. You get told to wait, then wait for another appointment, then somebody says they’ll call you and they don’t. People say ask for help but what help exactly? We don’t have family who can just come and take them for the day. I can’t afford private anything. DP says I need to be more patient but I genuinely don’t know where I’m supposed to find more patience from. I’ve used it all. It’s gone.

I feel like a terrible mother saying this but I am done. Today has tipped me over the edge and I don’t want to wake up tomorrow and do the exact same thing again. I feel like I’ve lost myself completely. I’m just the person who stops people hitting each other and cleans up food and says no all day. I don’t even recognise myself anymore. I want one day where nobody is screaming, nobody is pulling anyone’s hair and I can actually enjoy being a mum instead of just surviving it. Is that really too much to ask?

I hope you’re ok, this sounds overwhelming and I hope you’ve got someone you can vent to in person.

If, as you think, your eldest has ASD, I’d go very routine based. II’d start with a fixed wake up time and 5 min bursts of predictable things. Wee, ,breakfasts, dress, teeth, no tv or tablets. Radio on in the background. Build more time into the routine so you don’t get stressed about being late.

It will be very hard at first to change things up, but the predictability will help everyone. It will be hard and boring at first and it won’t fix or change everything but it will give you a pattern to observe/reflect on. It can be hard to see flashpoints and triggers when you are struggling. When you have a fixed
routine you can spot bumps in the road ahead and work around them.

Do the same with your after school routine, having tea, bath and bedtime. With a child with ASD, routine can be very helpful as it removes some of the stress of ‘what’s going on/what going to happen next?’ Personally, I cannot stress enough that tablets or online time aren’t helpful….there might be short term relief but long term it’s not helpful.

Speak to school and ask your health visitor to come. Visit your GP and tell them about the impact on your mental health. There is help available (where I live anyway NW). You might have to ask more than once. Be insistent. Ask for a meeting with the SEND at school by email or by letter. Explain what you experience at home as they might not see it in school. And follow it up, 6 weeks later.

And you need to take some time for yourself, it’s bloody draining. You have to at least some space in the week where you can just shut off, be yourself and not be responsible for everything.

Some similarities in my own experiences here, especially husband working long hours and with a long commute.

Get him to take a few days off. Flip roles- you stay in an air bnb or friends house or premier inn, come back at the time he does, and then leave again in the morning. Do it for 3 days at least to give a realistic picture of whast you're facing and to give yourself recovery time.

Find a good GP who is on side and will chase support or referrals for you.

Depending on the exact age of your oldest, look into a nursery attached to a state primary school for start asap or get him on the waiting list for when he's old enough- my child went through every nursery with a vacancy in our small town but the primary nursery school had more experience and made it not only work but made it a success.

Buy food in- ready made quality meals to make youfeel like you're eating well but cutting the time. Send washing out. Order everything else online. I stilll can't go in a supermarket with my child and it's years on. I can just about manage click and collect from the car park.

Find playgroups rather than sensory overwhelming soft play. Local and safe places to go. I went to a church run playgroup, they had volunteers to hold the baby/occupy the older one once they realised I had no chance to get a break or a coffee.

Ultimately, you will need to look at the job situaiton. It wont work if your husband leaves so early and gets back so late that he can't do any drop offs or pick ups at school or even before or after school clubs. That leaves accepting very limited working hours for you once the children start school, or he changes job or you all move house. Things will get easier in time as kids get older, but a long commute is unlikely to get shorter unless he's on public transport and buying a car could cut travel time significantly.

Please contact Home Start. Hopefully they operate in your area.
https://www.home-start.org.uk/
i used to do some volunteering with them and I’m sure they could set you up with a volunteer for a couple of hours a week. It’s not much but something must be better than nothing when you’re desperate?

You are not a terrible mother for thinking that, you are exhausted and trying to hold two small children together with no break in sight. That town trip sounds terrifying, especially when one runs off while the other is still in the buggy. I have been there in a smaller way with our three-year-old, and the bit that helped us most was making the day much smaller and much more predictable.

For outings, we stopped trying to do a list of bits and started doing one thing only, with a snack ready and a clear plan for leaving before it all falls apart. At home, the countdowns help: two more minutes, then shoes, then car, said the same way every time. It does not stop every meltdown, but it has cut down the shock of a sudden change.

One practical thing that helped with the special needs side was keeping a short daily note, just a few lines about sleep, what set things off, and what helped. When we later had to explain things to professionals, having real examples in our own words was much easier than trying to remember a bad week months later.

Please do not carry the guilt alone. Ask for a break in a concrete way, even a set hour at the weekend when your partner takes both boys, so you can leave the house without a list of jobs. My husband and I found that naming a specific hour worked better than just asking for help in general. You need rest to keep going, and that is not selfish. Sending strength, you are doing a hard job in very hard circumstances.

This. It's very important you get a break and your DP does half the childcare when he's at home.

I would also see if there are any council run nurseries near you. In my experience they are much better equipped to deal with children with SEN. They could also help expedite support for your child. Although I will warn you, v there isn't much!

You're in the trenches OP. This is a hard age regardless of SEN. You sound burnt out and need some proper headspace so you can connect with your child.

Can you reach out to your health visitor, explain how you're not coping and ask for help and resources. I would also seek out local autism support groups. My local one has loads of stuff going on and your child does not need a diagnosis for you to attend.

One thing I worked out is that even though reluctant to go, once there my child is happier in nature than in town. Is there anywhere safe you can go where your DC can run around outside in green spaces?

Such a tough and overwhelming situation is not tenable (for your mental and emotional health) for very much longer.

Currently, your husband is undermining you by diminishing and dismissing your experiences and doing what sounds like next to nothing to support you and his DCS. Your DH has a long commute and works full-time; but this does not absolve him from his share of family responsibilities. It does appear that you've accepted this status quo of DH being to tired to engage with the DCS challenges. A change of attitude on your part is required to enable progress - it's a partnership. DH must be an equal partner in taking responsibility for finding solutions and in actual hands on parenting. Only by experiencing your daily nightmare on his own for several consecutive days will he fully appreciate what you are telling him. As a first, immediate step, ask your husband to take three days leave / holiday / whatever and leave him to it while you take a break away from the home.

Your DS1 might be reacting to the perceived intrusion of DS2 into his familial space; also to the lack of involvement of his father. His father's attention might help him to feel special and important. If nothing else, his father engaging with DS1 in a room away from DS2 should reduce sibling conflict and allow DS2 your undivided attention for a while. DC1 might enjoy some physical pursuits with his father outside of the house for half an hour such as cycling / football/ boxing. Active, positive and regular physical engagement with his father could work to calm him and prepare him for bedtime.

Weekends, dad can take over the parenting and you do chores impossible to do during the week. DH must be given the opportunity to understand fully and regularly what you are experiencing and how his children are behaving. And you can then take time for yourself away from home to meet a friend/s and perhaps adopt a meditative practice, walking or intense exercise or pottery, reading in the library or nothing at all - whatever suits you.

Ultimately, you may need to consider lifestyle changes such as moving closer to your husband's work, both of you working part-time, hiring home help for housework and childcare (funds permitting).

In the meantime, you deal with DC2's bedtime ritual while your husband engages with DC1; then your husband can take over DC1's bedtime - read to him, play with him, bathe him, put him to bed. As pp have suggested, split the DCS up at bedtime to stop the fighting.

Start to make life easier for yourself. Food delivered, simple meals. Read up on strategies to implement at home such as very tight routines. Pay if possible to have a professional come to your home and observe, record and advise.

As far as getting professional help long-term, take on board the many suggestions offered by mumsnetters which are applicable to your situation. To do this, you will need time to phone, talk to and visit people and places. Your husband may need to take a week's leave so that together you can explore options. As pp have noted, you need to be in the system as a family in order to begin to access help. Your eldest needs to be at nursery several days per week, away from the dynamic at home where he spends his days tormenting his brother and you. Even a few hours daily break from DC1 will make a big difference to your and DC2's quality of life.

There are professionals out there ready to help you and your family; do not lose hope. Wishing you all the very best OP in this very challenging situation.

contact Your local Parent Carers organisation for children with SEND - it should be on your council website. Your child does not need to have an official diagnosis and you need support for yourself.

look at the Council website for The Local Offer as there will be groups and activities for children with SEND.

if he is not in a early years setting, you can refer to the Local Portage service up until he turns 5.

if he was in a nursery setting and they were struggling to meet his needs - they could have referred for an EHC needs assessments to get an EHC Plan for extra support. It would be worth looking at another setting more suited to children with SEND and referring for the EHC Plan. He may need this if he is due to start school.

is there any wider extended family that could take DS1 for a few hours per week?

will your DS2 be starting a early years setting soon when he get the early years funding? How is it when caring for just one child?

You need a break. DS1 may be picking up on your stress.

Kids of 4 and 2 are a nightmare to look after, even without disabilities. They do squabble. You have to put so much energy into playing with them, having fun yet being firm. It’s probably at its worst right now. It should get better as they both get older.

But all carers need respite. Can your DP take some leave from work to look after the kids for a couple of days? Could you take the kids and go to stay with your family? To make bedtimes easier, can DS1 sleep in your room for now? Or be put to bed in your room, then carried into his own bed once they’re both asleep? Mine needed sitting with until they were asleep at that age, to keep them calm.

Longer term, you need to rebalance your family so you coparent. Can you both work part time and share childcare? Can your DH get a different job with WFH/less commute? Can you move nearer his job or to family? If a move is needed, it’s best to do now before the kids get settled in school.

How much physical activity is he getting? It sounds as though your house is very small-do you have a garden where he can let off steam?
I sldo think he needs nursery. A school one perhaps so thst he is in the system snd his needs ate not hidden away.

Can you afford a part time nanny? Someone with ASD experience who can give you a break from DS1 and give you and DS2 some time together so you can have quality time. Even if it’s someone just a few hours a week it’s something to look forward to.

Sadly I think your DH’s attitude is part of the problem. He should be supporting you as a team, not telling you off for being horrible for saying you can’t cope any more. It’s very normal to feel isolated and overwhelmed in your situation.

@FishHighJumping Big hugs. Its really tough - I have 2 children with ASD and ADHD too, though the rivalry didn't start until they were 11/12yo. Its still there and they're 24/25 now! 🙄

You dont need to wait for an assessment to get help. Even if he isnt autistic, the National Autusic Society offer lots of help.

I'd also try to reduce the amount of 'input' he receives - would wearing something over his ears reduce noise or could a white noise machine or rainwater noises in the background help? I know baroque music can also help too.

I'd also keep DS2 nearer to me so DS1 can't access him to hurt him constantly.

Ref going out, I'd use a single buggy and an arm lead. I used am arm lead with my DS. I told him he could control me using it - he never tried but it allowed me to put it on him and keep him safe.

It sounds like you have zero support from your husband
Is there a reason why you live so far away from his work and is there a possibility to move closer?
He really does need to support you and give you relief

Im sorry you are going through this. please reach out for help as you can,

I had two kids 14 months apart and I talked to everyone about my need for help when my husband was at work -so much even my neighbours surprised and volunteered. I am so glad I told. My doctor also arranged for some childminding.

I had a popup playpen they loved to be in one at a time. While help was still being sorted I also read about central parenting, a grandparenting strategy for exhausted grandparents to move less, and set up for that myself.as I was just so tired. In my 60s I still tend have each room set up with the things we might need- just more focused on retirement aged comforts..

As ASD can sometimes run in families some other people around you may have mild versions without realising, so please be gentle with yourselves. I am so glad we reached out for help long before we knew what was happening. (ASD, one also ADHD)

Agree with the other PP that ND is genetic. As a couple you will likely look back at yourselves , your parents, your siblings , even grandparents with a different mindset.

Part of that will be giving yourself and your partner grace. It’s not a get out of jail free card for bad behaviour but I now realise that I probably get much more easily overwhelmed than the average mum, my DH is more rigid in his ways than the average dad etc. I find the paperwork of SEN parenting (and there is a fuck ton of extra paperwork) really challenging etc etc

Hello. A few things to consider - your partner does need to step up more. Tired or not at the weekend you need a respite. All of this is coming from a parent who is running on empty.

I have two boys, the elder is sad and similar age gaps. My elder child had huge language delay that results in difficult behaviour. Now at 8 he is hugely immature and silly but happy. But I remember those pre school days well. He was hit me, couldn’t communicate what was wrong etc.

it did get better, it is much better now and I did see my younger child copy behaviour but again the younger child isn’t ASD so can be taught not to.

as he is 4 - school is coming up. Don’t be shy to start talking to the school you would like him in now to understand there Sen provision.

even without assessment look for local groups for SEN children. Meet other parents going through this too. Make life a lot less lonely and then you have friends who get it too.

Your husband's reaction was to call you horrible ?!

I really feel for you. Could your child move back into your room? Maybe at least bedtime would better?

I’m in a similar position. I have a four year old and a two year old and they both have autism, the older one is aggressive and elopes. We tried him in a nursery and like you had to remove him as the staff couldn’t cope. We then tried a school nursery and that has been a game changer. The staff there are much better equipped to deal with his behaviour. There are fewer children and a calmer atmosphere and that’s what’s key.

There are free online workshops via councils for parent carers on topics like emotional regulation, how to cope as a parent, masking etc which you might find useful?

It really is hard and stressful isn’t it? On top of dealing with the day to day we also have to worry about what the future looks like. Try your best to stay as calm as you can when dealing with him. I’m not perfect believe me but when I am able to stay calm it helps hugely. Does he have speech delay? That can often lead to aggression as they have all these big feelings but no way of communicating them to you.

Finding a suitable nursery will be the best bet for you all. It will give him the stimulation he needs and give you a bit of a break. You need that break. Having a bit of time without that stress will give you more patience to deal with the behaviour later in the day. Very best of luck, it’s really hard.

Please don’t feel sorry for his commute! When I worked it was my favourite oart
pf the day. Just me and the radio.

Haven't read all the replies but it sounds really hard.
I would move DS2 into your room for now so they go to sleep better. I would put DS1 in his room with a safety gate on and do the gradual withdraw method if he is struggling to go to sleep.
if you need to go shopping for do something he doesn't want to do and he's motivated by food I'd take along healthy snacks so he's distracted.
At 4 I would look at different nurseries if he couldn't cope at the other one. Does your 2 year old qualify for 15 free hours?

That sounds very difficult I am so sorry. You need a break, can your DH take the kids on his next holiday from work rather than you ?..anyone would struggle with this!....my best ideas to help ( hopefully they are helpful)

1. Ds1 I know he struggles at nursery but could you put him in school nursery for some mornings or afternoons only. He will be starting school soon and at least that's a smoother transition and gives you the time you need..
2. Ds2 does he not qualify for free nursery hours privately? If so put him infor the full free hours or more if you can afford it.
3. Loop headphones, I bought these as I found having a loud child really difficult to deal with..these help to soften the sound but you can still hear everything..
4. Push more on to your DH!!! He must must see this for himself. Weekends, evenings, holidays from work. Stand your ground. Things are not working for you as it stands, so what have you got to lose ????
5. Try and take other things off your plate, cook easy meals, bare minimum.l cleaning to keep the house running..
6. Also stop tying to push for more..going out to the shops with both kids..I know that's a normal thing to be able to do but for you with them 2 it's too much right now. Unless your have other adult support.or just 1 child with you.
7. Do you think ds 1s issues are all autism related or do you think it's behavioural also?
8. Pursue pursue pursue the diagnosis.

I'm sorry, but what stood out most is that DS1 is abusing DS2 and you're enabling it. DS1 needs to move into your bedroom to protect DS2. That situation cannot continue for 1 more second.

Then you need support.

Can you throw money at it? An extra specialist pair of hands to support you to learn how best to manage DS1 and to babysit both boys, together and separately to give you a break.

PPs suggestion was good as well about preschool for DS1. You are right in your OP, if you can't take both boys out safely, for now, you can't take both boys out together. Order online shopping. Build up little trips with clear expectations and boundaries. Take DS1 alone and find out what works to manage his behaviours.

I think you are stuck in trying to do "normal", whatever that is, with children who need a different approach and that is making life even harder.

Routine is your best friend OP. Like others have suggested - bring the youngest in with you at night. If they both get more sleep a lot of the poor behaviours will stop. You’ve also got to keep things regimented. Every day maybe start with TV, that goes off at a set time then you go to the park etc. It needs to be the same. It will be awful for the first few weeks - but would be anyway. There’s no quick fix and no specialist support that will sort out what’s happening in the home. The advice will be to keep things regimented and predictable. You also need to tire them both out as much as possible. Try if you can to accept some shouting, bad episodes. It’s not your fault and if you keep things calm and predictable you are doing all you can - and things will improve. Good luck OP.

Really feel for you. I hope writing this all down and getting it out was cathartic for you. You are not a bad person or a bad parent for feeling dread about your days or thoughts you wish you werent having about your own child. I have felt like this when it all felt too much, and its got much better. I would definitely consider speaking to your GP. You need some time to miss your children, take a walk for an hour or two at the weekends if you can and leave your partner with the kids, perhaps- start small/ gentle. You are already a great mum for having the courage to admit how you're feeling, that is a huge strength, and I promise you these thoughts are not as unusual as you think. Be very bloody kind to yourself.

Look into resources for PDA. It sometimes needs a different style of parenting to that suggested for "typical" autism.

I really sympathise as I've been there. DD has PDA autism and she was at her absolute worst at 4-5 years old and was horrible to her sibling. I think this is a very common age for it. I would go to bed every night worrying about her future. Sometimes I would read things that said it gets better around age 7-8 which gave me some hope, and I have found that to be the case for us too. The violence is almost non existent now which I honestly wouldn't have believed a few years ago. The daily battles have become easier too, with a low demand parenting approach.