Teen daughter and male youth leader…

[FeatherGold]

My daughter (year 12, now 17) volunteers at a youth club for kids with SEN. She absolutely loves it but is also hoping to get a good reference for future uni applications etc. She’s been doing this for around 2 years.

One of the group leaders (let’s call him Dave) is around 45 and is well known as a charismatic but slightly ‘mad’ figure - in that the kids all seem to love him, but he doesn’t do anything by the book. He has no regard for admin or ‘procedures’, but he’s full of energy and ideas and gets the kids doing stuff they would never have thought possible. You get the picture.

I’m worried because he messages my daughter directly on her phone, and given his position as a youth leader and the age difference, it feels very inappropriate. He’ll ask her how her exams went - stuff like that - but most recently, suggested they meet for a drink to discuss an idea he has as a project for the kids.

I’m glad she’s telling me these things and she just laughs it off as ‘It’s just Dave, everyone knows he forgets the rules and just gets carried away with ideas’. She also has no intention of meeting him alone and gives him factual answers - nothing more.

How do I deal with this? He’s so careless in his actions that part of me thinks it is just a sort of disregard for conventional rules. I’d hate to cause a fuss around someone who is considered an inspirational figure at the club. But I’m also deeply uncomfortable about him messaging my daughter. It just feels wrong.

I should add that if I raised the issue or reported him, my daughter would be furious. She loves the club, is hopeful of getting a great reference, and she would see it as a huge betrayal of trust.

Tell your daughter to block him.

Maybe there's nothing in it, but something seems off here.
Is it just your DD he's asked out for a drink?
I find it hard to believe his only agenda for asking her out is to discuss a kids project. Surely that would be done via a staff meeting (assuming there are other staff/volunteers?).

I'm surprised he blatently disregards the rules. He would've been thoroughly vetted before being allowed to work with SEN kids, so why on earth would he be stupid enough to jeopordise his position?

Is he "unconventional" or predatory? Go with your gut.
Please discreetly seek further advice....

Your daughter, while still only 17, isn’t a young child anymore and she seems to know what ‘Dave’ is like, and how to handle him. I would keep lines of communication open with your daughter, share your concerns with her but also let her know it’s between you and her and trust she knows how to handle things but she can always come to you.

There’s a big difference between 11 and 17.

I'd be concerned that he could be breaking the rules with others - would talking to your DD about the possibilities there help her to decide to maybe have a word with the safeguarding lead herself? I agree that it would be difficult for you as you would break her trust, but I wonder if she would see that this is something she could follow through herself?

This reminds me of a teacher at my secondary school. Falling back on that ‘mad persona’ as a cover up. He may be innocent but it’s good to have the conversation with your daughter x

I really don't like these "oh your DD has got her head screwed on, she can deal with it/she's got the measure of him" replies.

Firstly that's a lot of responsibility to put on a young person, which is not fair, to confront or otherwise 'manage' Dave.

Secondly she is in a position of some authority in this organisation and therefore there is some onus on her to report this to the SG lead.

Doing nothing is not an option here. You KNOW this character has broken the ‘contact’ rules. So .. you either have a face-off with your 17yo concerning this - which could drive her towards him OR as you have met him, you confront him, privately and discretely, letting him know in no uncertain terms that you do NOT want him private messaging your DD let alone inviting her for drinkies, that you are aware such behaviour is in breach of the trust placed in him and that if there are ANY repeats you will escalate the matter. Be brave. And if this gets back to you by way of your DD, then you know the guy has been/is ‘at it’ .

I have a 16 year old DD who is utterly mortified at the thought of us getting in touch with school about anything, even things we deem fairly "important", so I totally understand why you feel you don't want to go behind your DD's back on this one.

I also have a 17 year old DD, and in your shoes I think I would have a proper talk with her about how serious this could be, and tell her that if she doesn't want you to get involved, she needs to let Dave know herself that him messaging her is inappropriate.

It could be as simple as her saying "Look Dave, my parents saw you've been messaging me and while I know you've got no ulterior motives, they weren't impressed and were asking about safeguarding policies, so probably best if you knock it on the head." That should appropriately put the shits up him and call the texting to an abrupt halt. Once your DD has left the group, you could mention it to someone higher up without pissing off your DD.

OP trust your gut.
He knows exactly what he is doing and it breaks the rules.
Your daughter is clued up, however those children with SEND may not be and are extremely vulnerable around this man.
Predators hide in plain sight, they groom adults and children, they make people question what they think.
Please, Please, Please report this man!

I am weirdly (for me) in 2 minds about this .

I am not a person who automatically thinks every rule is necessary and every breach needs to be reported . I’m also not a judgey, quick to see ‘inappropriate behaviour’ person especially in quirky people . Your daughter is a volunteer not a member and in less than a year she’ll be 18 , officially an adult and interfering then would be totally inappropriate, I think. I also see that your daughter isn’t entertaining him at all and that you’d be massively breaching her trust to act on her concerns and potentially damaging your relationship and your future ability to protect her plus possibly hindering the good work he’s doing . I don’t think going for a drink is actually that big a deal regardless of the age difference .

However , the quirky odd ball character , the good work for disadvantaged kids , the eccentricity and boundless enthusiasm is giving me Jimmy Saville vibes if I’m totally honest . I’m sure your daughter’s fine but I totally understand your point about other , more vulnerable young people .

Don’t say anything. It would be a deeply damaging thing to you and your daughter’s relationship if you did. She is growing up into a young woman and it will very soon be completely her choice who she wants to entertain - as a mentor, friend or sexual partner. Say something now and you risk not only being shut out of her feelings on this matter, but also any potential liaisons down the road. Keep the door, and your mind, open. Instil in her a sense of her own self worth and a belief in the validity of her ability to judge others and the impact they may have on her. You have been her protector, now you are her confidant. But only if you keep your own fears and judgements to yourself, and allow her the freedom to figure out what she wants to do.

Dave is going to find himself in a lot of trouble if he doesn’t follow the rules, well meaning or not. He is working with vulnerable people and this needs looking into.

As already mentioned, speak with your local LADO team. Even if he is harmless, he should be setting an example.

What's that saying "hiding in plain sight?" Easy to present as affable, slightly bonkers etc, iot deflect any suspicions....

I am DSL trained (Safeguarding) and apart from any concerns that you may have for your daughter, he is being downright irresponsible! As an adult in this type of setting, one should never put oneself in a position where an untrue allegation could be made by a child e.g. a well meaning lift home or any one to one interaction with a minor (it works both ways).

Personally I think there are times you have to step up as a mother whatever your children think.
I would have a one to one meeting with him to warn him off your daughter in no uncertain terms.
if he laughs it off, makes light of it or makes you feel uncomfortable etc then tell him you’re not happy with his response and that you are going to take it further.

@FeatherGold what organisation runs this youth club, is he also a volunteer or is he a qualified, paid worker?
I worked in youth work for 25 years. I would try to get copies of the messages, I'd be going over his head and reporting his behaviour. There will be a safeguarding team.

Your daughter is 17 years old, whilst she seems quite sensible, she is also an adolescent and therefore still vulnerable.

A good reference will not be worth much if his behaviour is unacceptable, either towards your daughter or the vulnerable young people in his care.

Woah…this is in breach of all Safeguarding regulations and this need reporting. No `Safeguarding Policy allows adults to put themselves in a one to one situation with a child such taking her out for a drink. He is in a position where he will know that he shouldn’t be making personal contact with your daughter, who at 17 is still considered a child. There is a power imbalance…she wants a good reference…so can’t offend him….huge red flags here. Presumably the group has a Safeguarding Officer so you can approach them in complete confidence with your concerns. You should do that as there may be a picture you don’t know about or it may be resolved. Remember to groom someone you need to have an attractive personality that everyone trusts. The situation worries me greatly.

My first reaction would be to have a ‘word’ with Dave! Actually it’d be my second reaction too! Dave’s well out of line. Nip this in the bud shortly and sharply.

He is the volunteer organiser - paid.

As a man, do not trust this person. He is trying to get an angle and he should know better.

This. Two words: Jimmy Saville. Anybody who has done any safeguarding training will know this man could be getting up to all sorts with these vulnerable children and hiding in plain sight. Regardless of your daughter's need for a reference, those children - and your child - need protection and you should report anonymously your concerns to social services.

having read all your posts @FeatherGoldI think maybe you need to have a chat with your daughter and suggest that she reduces contact with him outside of the group setting, only respond to him in the group chat, not privately, and if he asks her to meet him again she needs to tell him it’s inappropriate and if the other group leaders knew he was doing this he could lose his job. If he’s not the only one who would be giving her a reference for her CV/UCAS then she doesn’t need to worry about upsetting him. If she doesn’t feel she can say this to him, suggest you will speak to him on her behalf. He may not be a creep, he may just be a quirky bloke who forgets boundaries, and needs a reminder. But, he may also be a creep. So either way he needs someone to make him stop.

Makes it even worse,

He needs reporting.

Often, as parents, we have to do things that our dc don't want us to. This is one of those times.

How can he be being paid as a volunteer co-ordinator, when he is either ignorant of, or blatantly ignoring all safeguarding ?

My arse has he forgotten the rules.

We’ve all met guys like Dave.

He has not forgotten boundaries. He’s not quirky he’s just inappropriate.