DH said he wants to be a 30% Dad

[Japaneseflower]

Curious of people's opinions about this. I'm happily married for 5 years. We have a 2 year old and second due in a few weeks. Lately, parenting has felt all consuming and the 2 year old antics have definitely ticked in but overall I would say its not even too extreme. It's mostly throwing things and sometimes not listening. Anyway, I feel I am definitely the main caregiver which I don't mind and enjoy but it's been a tough few months being pregnant with a toddler. I spent half a day out yesterday so my husband stayed home with him and I find every time he looks after our son for a few hours, my husband is very overwhelmed, tired and exhausted. Then today he said he feels he wants to be 30% involved with childcare (I believe that's what he meant). Obviously I was not happy with this at all because I feel this is the reality of parenting and our free time does decrease. He admits that he selfishly yearns for more time to himself. I get him, I do but I also need support and truly believe both parents need to be fully in. What do people think?

Tell him you’ll match his 30%? What’s his thoughts about the other 40? Absolutely ridiculous thing for him to say!

I think you have to have a conversation with him. It’s not fair that you work two days, do the childcare the other days then at the weekend you’re still “on duty” while he has some time off - he is doing sport in the week so getting free time. Where is your downtime?

I understand it must be hard having two children, but it gets easier as they get older he just has to get on with it like a grown up!

Perhaps remind him that he’s lucky to have children not everybody can…

If you work 2 days and he works 5 plus evening sports then you are already doing 70%.

Sorry But your DH sounds like a complete moron. He just can't be arsed to parent. He's a parent so he doesn't do childcare btw , not sure why he calls it childcare (well...I do. He thinks it's 100% your job as a woman to do parenting, so in his mind he's doing childcare that isn't his job. Grim).

He's just not wanting to be a man who is facing up to his responsibilities as a father. The more you do the less he'll do as he wants to opt out of the stress of having kids. Don't let him do this to you.

Finally he's not the special little snowflake that finds parenting small kids hard. Is he under a strange impression that he is somehow special that way? Make sure he isn't under that impression else he'll turn you into a parenting doormat who has way too much stress on her shoulders and you'll get burnt out while he swans off to his 'sports activities'.

It's like the bloody 1950s!

FFS @Japaneseflower your DH is taking the piss and you are facilitating it.

Unless you are Mary Poppins or that early years childcare is your calling - what your DH needs to realise is that childcare is harder than the vast majority of paid work.

Because of your set up of you working PT, you will be doing more childcare, however, he should not just automatically get to swan off to do sports during the week and downtime at the weekend. You need rest as well. When I was on mat leave, my DH took over from me when he got in from work - this took priority over any of his hobbies.

When you have 2DC, it gets way harder. He can't just expect you to do everything he wants to do. You both need free time. This needs sorting out now

"Ok so you want to split up and just have them on a weekend?"

If it was a joke /lighthearted comment I'd let it go .
If he's serious then I'd be telling him he needs to decide if he's all in or not because you are not carrying him.
And actually if he struggles you know what they say - practice makes perfect!!

You need to have this conversation now, and not minimise your needs.

I spent years taking on the extra load, because my ex (you see where this is going) was struggling/was depressed/needed some time to himself etc. I nearly broke myself more than once trying to do it all while he had lie-ins, never did a school run, looked after himself and maybe made the kids a meal once a week.

All I'll say, is the kids didn't even notice he was gone for over a month, and didn't care at all that they didn't see him for another 8 months after that.

And yes, being a single mum is relentless, but there's a freedom in not having to include anyone else in your decisions, and there's significantly less washing and tidying up.

Frankly, I think you are cutting him way too much slack here. He needs a good boot up the arse! He's tired and overwhelmed by a few hours looking after his child? Pathetic 🙄 he already gets way more free time than you do and does a lot less childcare. You will soon have two children to care for and he will need to step up and do a lot more. We all crave more free time but the reality of having babies and very young children is that they need looking after all the time! Being a good parent means putting your own needs second a lot of the time.

Parenting is a 24/7 job. There are two parents and they evenly share childcare or they pay someone else to do it.

You currently work 7 days a week: 2 in a paid job and 5 in unpaid childcare (3 weekdays and most weekends). What daily hours do you work on childcare? I’m guessing 12 hour days? Unless you get any mornings/evenings off? You need a break. Your DH knows how tiring childcare is because he gets tired when he does it. You’re pregnant and need to rest.

If he wants to do 30% of the childcare, he needs to increase his childcare hours. 30% of childcare is just over two days a week. I suggest you share the childcare and paid work more fairly. Your DH drops paid work to 4 days a week, you increase your paid work to 4 days and you both equitably pay to increase paid childcare to 3 days. Then, on the days the kids are in childcare, you can take a day’s leave and have a day to yourself. You do one day each at weekends, either half days or full days.

If you don’t increase your days at work it’ll affect your income, career and pension. Being in most paid jobs is a lot less tiring and stressful than looking after kids at home.

What exactly does he 'love' about being a dad?

It doesn't sound like he enjoys actually being with his child.

You know what, I’m curious how you split the finances and housework. I’m pretty sure you’ll say housework falls to you and finances is 50:50 but I think this would be my angle.

’I was thinking about how we could make you being a 30% dad work, given clearly I can’t also be a 30% mum. To make it work you’re gonna have to step up and be a 100% housework guy and 100% finances guy. When should we start? We have two kids, and only one house and set of bills so i think you’re getting a great deal.’

Toughen up OP you're being far too generous - a pushover. You can't afford to facilitate an adult 'child' when you have two real children.

Mon-Fri 9-5 plus commute time you're both working, whether outside the home or at home. Evenings and weekends should be shared equally.

You've given him the idea his work is harder, he's special and deserves more time, care and understanding than you. That's bollocks. Get over it. I do mean that - you need to tackle the deep-set sexism in your own head before you get anywhere with this.

Funny how childcare is so very hard and tiring for him but for you it doesn't count as real work at all, eh?

We are in this exact scenario!
It's working out great for us, because we went into this arrangement with open eyes.

Anyway, as you by and large enjoy childcare and he doesn't, there's no harm in reshuffling some tasks. So that you both do 50% of the total work, with different ratios of childcare.

If that's not what he meant, tough luck on him.

And if he kicks up a fuss, ask him how he’d handle the childcare if you suddenly died. I know it sounds shocking. But happened to three of my friends (strokes/brain tumour) and the fathers had to do it all then. What made it a little easier was they were already doing 50%, so the kids were used to being with them.

Might help him appreciate you and all that you do.

Get an aupair / home help to help with stuff - there is household things others can do for money and you can both enjoy parenting more

It’s sexist crap unless he never speaks to or spends time with the child for the rest of his life. But once they’re older and easier to be with, of course he will. So, he gets to have a second child while she does all the work!

This.

Yes, IF he is struggling with the hands on aspect of parenting his toddler but genuinely wants to be a good dad and partner, then rearranging the shared tasks (all of them, the endless laundry, every single meal, keeping track of what has been used up so you know what is needed and do the shopping in time so you don't run out etc etc) may work.

If all the household tasks, including the mental work, are done so you can provide the hands on parenting, fair enough (if you prefer parenting to housework).

I don't get the impression he is suggesting stepping up his involvement in the other routine and boring tasks though...

How does your second child feel about this? Are they old enough to consciously realise that their dad spends less time with them? Or does less for them? Or whatever "extra work from the second child" looks like? I can't imagine how this actually plays out, given that both children are human beings with a mum and a dad. Can you imagine looking back on your childhood and thinking "Yeah, my dad didn't bother with me that much compared to my older sibling, I guess because he never wanted me to be born, or maybe there's just something wrong with me that I couldn't win him round"?

Or are you saying something different - that he's just stepping back from the children in general, and spreading it evenly between them?

No me either, but even suggesting it will prove the point.
It’s clear this guy thinks childcare with one child is hard work. And probably doesn’t recognise everything else OP does. If he can tap out of childcare, OP can tap out of the other responsibilities.

Sounds like he does less than 30% now. Does he actual want it or was it like me with a toddler and home schooling durring lockdown wondering if my head if I wanted to divorce so I would get every other weekend off?

More than most men anyway isn’t it 🤣

My DH does 5% of "childcare" which is mostly bring one of them out for a fun activity that he would enjoy anyway. But I'm a sahm so signed up for this. If I worked we would be divorced because I know he wouldn't do more and I couldn't live with the unfairness of it.

The tone of your post suggests your relationship is generally okay. Starting from the assumption that he isn’t a terrible person (I know this is an unusual assumption on mumsnet), this could be the start of a really useful conversation. especially with another baby on the way, it’s good to talk about what you both need. As long as it is both of you, not just his needs.

You could usefully discuss why he finds time with your child hard. It sounds like his expectations are wrong for this age - he thinks he should be able to do his own thing and just keep an eye on the child, but toddlers need lots more interaction. He can’t just opt out of a childhood phase, he has to figure this out regardless of how much time he is the designated parent.

Personally, with a 2day vs 5 day working week I think 70:30 parenting split isn’t unreasonable - you’re probably already there tbh. In your shoes I’d agree with him that he needs time to rest at the weekend but push for chunks of a few hours that he is fully in charge of your child and fully engaged. No trying to get something else done, make that time really count. But it’s only eg a few hours each day at the weekend, an hour each week day, and he can plan for it. Basically, I wouldn’t argue the quantity so much as the quality.

As others have said, you should point out that you also need time off. You are doing the bulk of childcare during the week, you need some chance every day and a longer period at least once a week to do your own thing. Both of you need some protected down time.

It’s also maybe an opportunity to talk about buying in help, if you have the cash. Getting a babysitter and spending time together can also help a lot, or even if you can’t go out you can decide to have a date night at home after the kids are asleep. Again, push for quality more than quantity. A couple of hours a week without distractions spending time together and making a proper effort to connect.

parenting is hard and opting out is not the solution.

If, as OP has said, he works 5 days a week, plays sports a few times a week and she lets him 'chill' at the weekend, then he is already doing much less than 30% of childcare and now wants to do even less. He sounds as though he is resentful every time he is left alone with his own child.

This is a dreadfully selfish thing to say to your wife who is soon going to give birth to your second child. She will feel anxious about asking him for help and if I were her, I'd now be dreading the birth and worrying how I will cope.

Childcare is still work. If someone else does it for you, you have to pay them and give them 20 days a year paid leave. Including if they’re the other parent.

What do you get paid by him for doing his 50% of the childcare? Average childcare pay is about £20k a year, plus pension contributions etc. Do you get 20 days a year paid leave.

No, he doesn't spend less time with DC3 (or love her less!), but his amount of work has roughly stayed the same as when we had two kids, whereas mine has gone up.

We had two, I wanted another, he was clear he would be stretched too thin to give all the children attention ánd think of everything that needs to happen and generally manage it all.

So we agreed I would step it up to make sure everything gets done. With the first two kids, for example, we had 50/50 on the invisible tasks. He did all the medical appointments and corresponding admin, for example. Now I do more of the invisible tasks. Probably closer to an average mum now ;-) . And for example he has had breaks away since she was born to get more of a break.

It's not that he didn't want her, the child. He couldn't handle more work overall.

I am DELIGHTED I got to have a family of three kids and I am delighted I have a husband who contributes to the extent of his bandwidth and we don't both have the same amount of "me" time, but we both feel equally refreshed so that seems fair to us.