Can school stop this?

[CherryCherri]

My son collects my daughter from school whilst I wait outside with my other child. My son is 12 and my daughter is 7. The school were fine with this as I was waiting just outside and they are aware of this, never been a problem for 2 years. However a new headteacher started last year and suddenly it’s now a problem. Now siblings have to be 16 to collect. I explained my situation and why my son is collecting and that I’m waiting right outside and at no point is he ever expected to bring her home alone, they were ok with this until recently and now it’s a problem again. I’ve repeated again I am just right outside, members of staff can see me and I can see my son the whole time he is in the playground but nope they have refused and said he isn’t allowed to collect her and bring her to me. Now I hear time and time again on here that schools can’t dictate this but can they? They refused to allow my daughter to go with my son the other day so seems the school do have the final say. I’m asking if I insist he collects her can they stop it and I’m guessing all they could do is refer to ss, how would ss view this situation?

I'm not really sure what the school could do if you simply refused to accompany your 12 year old. Presumably they would call Social Care who would then refuse to attend and take a child into public protection when their mother is sitting outside, in view of the child waiting for them to walk out?!!!

Bonkers

There is no law around who can collect children from school. Schools can however set their own policies. If the school policy says an adult must collect from the door, they are entitled to enforce that even if you dont like it. You can make a complaint under the schools complaint policy but it may not be upheld if they are acting in line with their policy.

If, for example, a parent is disabled, meaning they cant get to the classroom door, it may be a reasonable adjustment to allow an older sibling collect and bring to the car. This would depend in all the circumstances as to whether it is 'reasonable'.

I don't se how parents can 'override' the school, if the school literally refuses to release the child.

https://schoolleaders.thekeysupport.com/pupils-and-parents/safeguarding/child-protection/pupil-collection-arrangements/

I don't know the system OP but isn't this an example of safeguarding just gone silly? In my kids school (not in UK) we have to fill out a form as to whether they are a walker or not. At home time 'walkers' line up separately, those who are not walkers stay with the teacher on school grounds until someone comes in to collect them in person. A 'walker' can mean anything, walking a long way home alone or walking only as far as the gate where a parent is parked.

By age 7 there was only 1 child who was being collected. That kid had a father who would walk him and a brother who was 11, holding their hands very tightly. They were never allowed to stop and talk to anyone or have playdates, never went to parties or were seen playing outside. They moved schools since but that boy was the one I'd be worried about from a safeguarding perspective.

I hope you get it resolved OP after talking to the head.

In most schools, if a parent or nominated alternative is not there to collect, the child is taken to after school club and the parent is billed later.

Could you ask one of the other parents to pop your 7 year old to you on their way past? If you’ve given permission, the school couldn’t object to that.

I think ultimately the school can't with hold your child but they can make it very uncomfortable for your children so depends how far you are prepared to push it?

If you stay in the car and send your 12 year old out and just refuse to do anything else what can the school really do?
They can have a stand off with you until school closes and then they either have to release your child or call the police/social services.

If they call the police and say 'mum is sitting outside in the car, yes we can see her, yes the sibling is here to walk the child to the car' they will be told just to release the child and stop wasting everyone's time.

That sounds a good solution

The school have a duty of care so yes it is up to them who they hand that child over to. There are safeguarding issues and the school is responsible for the children in their care

And then after after school club they still have the same problem - do they release the child to mum sitting outside or call social services?

Maybe. But (depending on the reasons for all this) the mum could leave the 12 year old at home with the other child and go to the desk for after school pick up.

Utter madness, mine are older now (early 20s), but they definitely allowed this when they were at primary school.

Also, IME, signing out from after school club was stricter than from school (parents could give permission for years 5 and 6 to walk him from school but those years still needed to be signed out from ASC)

Mum has said that's not an option so the situation is as it is.

If the school calls social services (presumably the emergency desk as it's now 6pm) and says 'we have been with holding this 7 year old from her parent for 3 hours, we can see mum waiting outside, there's a 12 year old sibling ready to walk the child over' - what do you think they will say?

Yes, the school can decide it. No, you can't override their decision.

Each school can make their own "house rules".

Same with our nurseries. Last nursery allowed parents to go inside the play rooms and collect children from there. In this nursery parents have to wait at reception.

It's a very recent thing in England. Ks2 were allowed out the main door to their parents or to walk home ks1 by classroom doors with a teacher to check they were with an adult when my dc were at school.
.

Why don’t you want to go and pick your child up? I really don’t understand why if you can do it you wouldn’t. It’s such a privilege to pick your child up from school. So many people can’t pick up because of work. You’re lucky if you can!

I think this it. Challenge their madness and they'll soon have to stop acting so weird and power crazed.

Where does it say I don’t want to stop being ridiculous this is why I don’t want to post the reason, I have a good reason why I can’t go to her class but I do collect her I’m right outside! They aren’t coming home alone 😒

what mum said was not an option was the 12 year old waiting with the younger child at the gate while she collected DC7. That doesn’t necessarily rule out the 12 year old being at home with the younger child later in the evening when ASC finishes.

I think social services would support school in not handing over a seven year old to a twelve year old, TBH.

And OP has not clarified if she can be seen by the teacher at the gate.

Not possible.

I don’t think ss would support it at all given I’m right outside and they are not coming home alone and the staff can see me.

Thanks for clarifying.

If you think social services would support your position, you could try contacting them for advice.

@SheilaFentiman

No they wouldn't, social services, unlike schools are realistic and support parents sensible decisions. Also, the school would never make this call as it would be a giant waste of resources.

The Head is overstepping. Just wait him out OP

So, what are you expecting social services to do in 'support'? Come and get the child?

The obvious solution if the school don't want the 12yo to walk the 7yo over to the car is to get a member of staff to walk the child over.
That's much less stressful and time consuming for everyone than having a stand off, putting the child in after school care or calling the authorities.