Quotes from Narcissistic Mothers (& support for their victims) Thread 3

[01Name]

Following on from this thread: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4610023-to-ask-for-your-quotes-from-narcissistic-mothers?page=39&reply=120137262, started by @itsgoodtobehome as a tongue-in-cheek repository for anecdotes of appalling remarks/deeds from parents/siblings with rampant NPD. It morphed into a place where those of us suffering the effects of such behaviour could share experiences, solidarity, advice and support. It continued to a second thread here: Quotes from Narcissistic Mothers (& support for their victims) Thread 2 | Mumsnet I hope this thread can continue the good work of its predecessors. Your voice will be heard; your opinion and thoughts matter. You are welcome and valued here. The world is a better place with you in it, despite what you might have been conditioned to believe by those who brought you into it. x

@stayflufft I agree. When you have a child you start to realise the extent of the horror that was visited upon you. I kept all my DC away from my family, which was made easier by the fact I had moved to completely different part of the UK. I vowed I'd never end up with someone whose parents lived locally but then met my H whose mother turned out to be a lesser narc ( emotionally abusive but not physical)and so I still had that to contend with her madness and my H's FOG. She caused a lot of trouble in our relationship and heartbreak. My Dh and myself are both "scapegoat" children.

Omg this thread.

Your voice will be heard; your opinion and thoughts matter. You are welcome and valued here. The world is a better place with you in it, despite what you might have been conditioned to believe by those who brought you into it. x

Didn't realise how much I needed these words

I'm 36. My mum still says 'we did very well on our GCSE/A Level didn't we' because she helped me study.

If I look good she says it's because I take after her. She's given me a few items of clothes which I do actually like, but whenever I wear them it's all about her good taste.

If someone compliments me or my children she'll say thank you, they take after me.

I was told I shouldn't ever wear my hair up as I'm not pretty enough, also do not have the complexion to wear purple. Not sure if that's narcissism or just being plain mean, but it look therapy last year for me to be brave enough to leave the house without my hair being down.

Just little examples, but it's taken being married to my husband and knowing his family to realise this behaviour isn't normal, healthy or acceptable.

We lost my brother last year. In the aftermath, with the help of my step dad and therapy I called mum out on her behaviour. Idk if it's the jolt of losing a child, being called out or both but things have been so much better recently. She's been complimentary and kind, saying she's proud of me and sharing memories in a way which actually feels nurturing and genuine. It's nice, but I'm still wary.

That last bit resonates so much! My mother knows exactly how to play my sister and I off against eachother and to say the things which will hurt us both the most. She creates and embellishes conflict. The sad thing is my sister (13 years older than me) still hasn't worked out how toxic she can be and constantly seeks her approval. I learned at a very young age I couldn't trust either of them with information about my life because they would share and twist it.

My mother's mother was the same, which is the bit which baffles me. I almost didn't have children because I was convinced this sh** is genetic and if I reproduced I'd just carry on the cycle of abuse. When I found myself pregnant and already past the point of being able to abort I was completely distraught. I thought I had already ruined my babies life just by him being mine. I was expecting pregnancy to be awful and childbirth the worst thing imaginable because that's what they told me. I thought the baby would be a dead weight around my neck and I'd ruined my life, as well as ruined the babies life because women in my family are incapable of unconditional love. To say I was wrong is an understatement. I loved being pregnant, have been blessed enough to have two complication free home births, have enjoyed having my babies in a sling, breastfed them both (disgusting according to my mother and sister) and practice each and every day at being a present, calm, supportive mother who wants to see her children flourish and be whatever they want to be. Am determined to show them that sometimes I slip up and how people can make amends. My mother would fly off the handle and then moments later be acting totally normally, which kept me on eggshells for most of my childhood. By the time I was 10 I believed that if I didn't love her or show her affection that it wouldn't hurt so much when she rejected and ridiculed me. She never loved me for me, was always trying to mold me into visions of herself and my sister. I did become them for a good long while, but since I met my husband and became a mother myself I'm on this incredible journey back to the person I am at heart rather than the one I was shaped to be. I'm kind, loyal and genuinely sometimes too empathetic. I'm a people pleaser which I'm working on, but I'm not the sarcastic, sadistic person I thought I had to be to be in their 'gang'.

At Christmas last year I had an epiphany. I have a wonderful, kind husband, and incredible kind friends who have been with me for decades. If I'm surrounded by so many wonderful and kind people, then surely I'm not the person I have been made to believe I am? It was a life changing moment. And since I've stopped allowing her to cast me in that mold, since I've been showing strength but also a level of 'sticks and stones', it's like she's lost some of her power. I think also a huge factor being the loss of my brother last year, she seems to suddenly have more respect for her remaining children. But realising my life is bloody incredible without her in it, and she needed to act a certain way in order to remain in our lives was next level empowering. Am so proud of the person I've become.

Really hoping you all get your lightning bolt moments too. You are all so much more than these women have let you believe. Shine bright, you're doing incredible things.

@Beansandneedles That's great that you have established boundaries and that your NM is being nicer. Perhaps as well as the sad death of your DB she has also mellowed with age, although you are right to be wary. It's great that your DH and friends are kind and loving.

@Beansandneedles
What a fantastic light bulb moment.
I have 2 friends who have been similar, and I understand.

I am so sorry to read this, she was a vile bully indeed

Loads I’ll be back

@Beansandneedles Without sounding OTT, so very proud of you - and everyone on this thread - for breaking the cycle of narc behaviour. And to @Nicola101177, words are so inadequate to express my disgust at the treatment you received at the hands of the one person who you should have been able to count on as a child. Truly sickening.

The ‘moulding’ behaviour is certainly something I recognise. My NM used to regularly tell people that when she was told at my birth I was a girl, that she couldn’t wait to dress me in all sorts if frilly things. Nothing wrong with that, but clearly what she really wanted was a doll.

She was always good with babies because their needs are pretty straightforward. She certainly couldn’t cope with children, once they became personalities and expressed views. I saw her struggle so much with my own DCs once this happened too. She wanted me to be totally compliant and her ‘mini me’ She wanted to dress me a certain way, to be totally compliant, to think the same way and not have any opinions that either differed from or didn’t support her own. She wanted me to constantly feed her need for attention and adulation and if I didn’t, I was ‘ungrateful, selfish and spoilt’

She never approved of any of my friends or especially BFs with the exception of those that schmoozed up to her. Then they were wonderful and, ‘I wish you were more like Schmoozer, they treat me with respect I deserve” meaning they told her what she wanted to hear and how marvellous she was.

Like so many others have posted, I used to see other families and their contrasting dynamics and wonder why they were so different from my own. I recognised this even as a young child. That others were more relaxed in their own homes, that there wasn’t a strained and artificial atmosphere and that children were allowed to be children and not a mini adults. I was very often in trouble with her for being ‘dirty, untidy, silly and not taking life seriously enough’ I realised with my own DCs that’s what children are and do, and it’s not all about being serious and controlling their every move.

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas I recognise so much of what you’ve said.

My mum definitely struggled with us once we started expressing feelings or opinions, and infinitely moreso when we became teenagers and wanted our own space and to do our own thing.

My sister actually says that she stopped herself from crying from the age of 5 because of our mum’s response to her expressing emotions 😔 it’s devastating that a 5-year-old would understand on some level to repress their feelings because it’s not safe to cry around their own mother. Our mum would respond with anger to any expression of ‘difficult’ emotions. Her anger could be expressed as anything from the silent treatment to storming out of the house to throwing things on the floor in rage.

I remember being a bit envious of my schoolfriends’ mums but not really understanding why. Looking back, I can see that it was simply that they weren’t scared of their mums or having to walk on eggshells. I really didn’t understand the level of damage she was doing to my emotional kind of ‘core’ or me as a person - even recently, I’d just describe her as quite difficult. It’s incredibly eye-opening to comprehend the effects of their behaviour on us.

And yes, so proud of everyone on this thread 💐

The daft thing was, we were such quiet and meek children. Without exception, all of my school reports said it would be nice if I talked more. We were never in trouble at school, but at home we were made to feel like such difficult children.

This exactly.

I was often complimented by outsiders or school on my meek polite behaviour too.

it wasn’t as a result of good parenting or upbringing, it was because I was absolutely petrified of putting a foot wrong and the potential consequences. I just learnt to keep my head down and to try an avoid drawing attention to myself because I never knew what sort of mother I was going to have to be dealing with, sometimes even on an hour by hour basis.

My school reports were generally very positive, but she always focussed on the slightest negative thing and blew it totally out of proportion because I was apparently ‘letting her down’

@CherryGarcia23 I'm so sorry your mother was so violent towards you. Mine used to be extra violent when my dad was at work but he used to slope off if she started on me when he was home and then come into my room as a comforter later. Like you, I thought he was kind and nice.As a child you cling to that. My best friend had a violent dad so we used to talk about how great it would be if my dad and her mum married and we could all live together. Glad we escaped.

The damage they do spills over into adult life too. For years I found it incredibly hard to confront people, or to ask for what I wanted Even something trivial like receiving the wrong order. I would just take it without ' causing a fuss'
I would feel physically sick and my stomach would be in knots so I avoided it. It was totally a learned stress response,
My mum was so volatile and god forbid anything you said could be taken as criticism, that I found it almost impossible, I just thought I was a wimp, it stopped me from applying for manager positions because I knew I would find it extremely difficult to do things like performance management if I had to deal with staff not performing.
I was a total people pleaser. It took me a long time to unpack that. I was so well trained to constantly consider her feelings and emotions and 'what would people think' that I was literally terrified to upset people by saying no.

“You were such an awful, clumsy child with all your broken arms and everything.”
*Only the last of my ten broken arms (when I was eight) was an accident. She had form for picking me up with one and swinging me at the wall.
”Don’t bother telling your teacher that I shaved your eyebrows off/Slashed into your hair. I’ve already told them what a liar you are and nobody will ever believe you. I’m going to tell them that you did this yourself. Weird little girls do things like that you know.” *Both events coincided with school photos.
You must always wear black/wear your hair up. It’s slimming. (Black on little blonde children is very Midwitch Cuckoos.)
”I wish they hadn’t bothered resuscitating you.”
(I was very premature.)
”I can’t believe they decided that you didn’t have brain damage after all. You didn’t walk until you were three and a half.” (I had a leg broken at birth that was badly set and is now deformed. Both hips were slowly dislocated by the traction they put my leg into. I had full-length calipers until I was nine.)
“You don’t have asthma. You’re a hypochondriac.”
*I was hospitalized many times and she refused to buy a puffer for me. She told my school I was making it up. I was blue-lighted after being found unconscious on the cross country track during PE.
“You walked around the corner and slammed into the oven door.” *She had picked up a stoneware jug filled with cutlery and knocked me out and fractured my cheekbone.

@RenewableNewt yes, I'm another "meek" child. Tried to be small, quiet and invisible - very repressed.There is no pleasing a NM. If I came 2nd in the class in tests/exams rather than being pleased my mother would berate me for not being first. Like you, I used to dread school reports and parents evening. She used to sit over us whilst we did homework and hit us or take an essay away from us and write it herself for us to copy and then fulminate when the mark was low.

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas your posts are really insightful and resonate with my own experiences. I still feel in my 50's that I'm often walking on eggshells, over analyse conversations afterwards and think I'm fundamentally unlikable and the ugliest person in the world, still hate mirrors and photos and I'm stoic when being criticised but feel devstated afterwards. I try hard to relax and tell myself good things but you are right there is damage to the"emotional core."

Like others I was "moulded" and treated as a doll.My mother used to dress me up in "American Party dresses"-elaborate layered white or pastel broderie anglaise affairs with white "bobby socks" matching white patent shoes and elaborate Victorian style hair do's to wear to primary school. "Woe betide me"if they got dirty and was teased by other kids for dressing weird and none of them could understand why I didn't just tell my mum that I didn't like my bizarre hairstyles. Even teachers seemed to think it was my choice.

I used to cope by imagining I was an alien sent to observe human behaviour and that one day I would be recalled to my planet. All day everyday was stressful, even in sleep I would sometimes be pulled from my bed as some new misdeamour had been uncovered. I feel so sad for us all but we are all breaking the chain with our own children.

Like others I too tried never to cry as I was labelled "gurny gob" just one of the many demeaning nicknames NM had for me.

Oh good grief - is this evil person still walking this earth?! Has she ever been held to account for this criminal and insane treatment of an innocent child?!

I had the, “Don’t talk about our family business to other people” and “No one outside this house needs to know about anything” but your experience is on a totally different level.

I’m so, so sorry and so angry on your behalf to read this about this wicked woman. Xx

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas She died almost seven years ago. There were no Disney moments. Her death threw me into a massive tailspin grieving for the mother I never had/comparing her relationship with me to mine with my own kids and wondering how the hell anyone could be so horrible. I know she also grew up in an abusive environment, and can only assume that the truth was too painful for her to confront. I broke the cycle. I genuinely love, like and respect my kids. They have always been physically and emotionally safe in my presence. I’m super proud of each of them and they are growing into kind, empathetic, generous young adults.

MIL is classic narc and DH is her scapegoat. I noticed fairly early on that she treated DH differently and that his siblings had learned over the years to shut him up because he would stand up to his DM which would often unleash the beast.

Things she has said:

1. DS is bright, not genius bright but always referred to by his friends as the annoyingly “ clever” one. MIL used to insist on seeing his reports early on ( mainly so she could compare him with the “golden grandchild” who is the same age) so was aware that school identified him as bright ( they don’t use gifted anymore). I went to pick him up after a sleepover and she came rushing out to meet me flapping a piece of paper eager to inform me that he couldn’t be bright because he couldn’t draw trees.
2. I asked if they ( MIL & FIL) would like to join us for Christmas one year, she replied “ can I get back to you, I’d like to wait and see if I get any (better) offers”.
3. told me how I’d ruined her Christmas 10 years earlier. We had decided to join my DF ( who wasn’t well) for Christmas but it was cancelled last minute ( stepmother- whole other story) so we decided to have Christmas on our own. My SIL was heavily pregnant and I had recently suffered a miscarriage, MIL knew this, so neither DH nor I were really in the mood to spend Christmas with the family. But we were selfish for ruining her Christmas apparently. SIL had the baby on Boxing Day and DH and I were actually the first to go and visit. We just didn’t need MILs constant comments about how wonderful it was that at least one of her DIL would give her grandchildren.

I could go on and on. When Covid came along it gave us the opportunity to go almost NC. DHs mental health has improved immensely. Unfortunately, he had a stroke last year, but since this trumps pretty much any problem MIL has and of course he is no longer of any use to her she has totally cut contact with us.

@CherryGarcia23

You poor thing she is truly terrible!

Do your siblings still stay in touch with her? Are you in touch with them?

Im not sure if I’m mum is a narcissist but she definitely has traits. One sister is NC and the rest of us have issues with her.

Never physically abusive to me, my older sister got that. Mine was the emotional neglect that gets me the most. Never feeling good enough, never feeling truly loved but I had her on a pedestal for years. It’s all come crashing down since I had my own kids.

@NeunundneunzigHorseBallonz your mother was truly a monster. Your poor broken bones and heart. It's fantastic that you have broken the cycle. As I hope I have. I remember 30 years ago (pre interent) trying to start researching about NM and reading an Alice Miller book that said it was almost impossible to break the cycle of emotional and physical abuse and feeling very upset by it as I had recently had my eldest child and then I determined that I would strive even harder to be a parent that truly cherished and listened to my child!
Now that you have had time to grieve for the love and care you never had do you feel a sense of freedom and relief that you no longer have to cope with your NM in the flesh?

@Angrymum22 what a peach your MIL is. I hope your DH is recovering well.
@Boredatwork1234 MY NM was physically and emotionally abusive and for me, the emotional abuse has the longest lasting effects. I'm in my 50's and still trying to convince myself I'm enough and not a dreadful failure of a person.

@SapatSea - I left home early and had a loooooot of therapy! (Mostly confirmed it was my family that was nuts, not me. I suspect it saved my life.) I was in danger of being hyper-vigilant with the kids, so put myself back into therapy when she died.
DB was golden child of course. He’s turning 50 and has never worked. A lifetime of my mum covering up for him and not allowing him to deal with the consequences of his behaviour has left him with a very unrealistic view of his place in the world. (We used to call him “The son around which she orbits.”) While I am NC with him (restraining order due to violence and threatening behaviour) I also see that he was never allowed to grow up. She had “never known true love until he was born.” (Barf).

@SapatSea - I would agree that the emotional abuse is harder to recover from than the physical. Every day you have to remind yourself of the ways you are NOT repeating those patterns.

@NeunundneunzigHorseBallonz
Oh my love....there are just no words.

@NeunundneunzigHorseBallonz It’s weird isn’t it? I thought when my NM died, I would finally be free of her, but there’s also a feeling of unfinished business. I always wanted an opportunity to sit down with her and ask her why. I guess I have to reconcile myself that I wouldn’t have ever got an honest answer because she was so used to obfuscating and distorting facts, that she either wouldn’t have been able to explain or she would have told me - which she always did - that I must have imagined facts.

Shes been gone just over three years and although they’re getting less frequent, I still have these vivid dreams where I’m screaming and screaming at her and she’s just laughing at me.

Whilst nowhere near as bad as your experiences, she waylaid me once as I walked through a door and hacked a great chunk of my then long hair off and as @SapatSea related, I was also pulled out of bed whilst deeply asleep because of some minor misdemeanour that could have either waited until morning or was so trivial that it wasn’t worth raising. I think she actually enjoyed seeing me confused and struggling to comprehend what was going on as anyone would be woken up like that.

Because I struggled as a left hander with a fountain pen and used to smudge my writing, she made me rewrite schoolwork endlessly until she was happy with it. Until it was acceptable to her, she used to rip pages out of my exercise books. I can remember crying, further smudging the ink with my tears and having to start again. I then got into trouble at school for having a too thin book! My DD who is a teacher said that nowadays so much of her treatment of me would be a big red flag for safeguarding concerns.

I often wonder how she would have coped had she been investigated but I suspect she might have got away with it. She was so good at playing the caring parent to outsiders and came across as your ideal middle class mother with an angelic daughter who was always immaculately dressed with perfect manners. We once had a visit from a health visitor - I don’t know why - but NM told her to go away and “do some work where she was really needed in the local estate!” NM was very proud of this fact too and boasted to many about it. Maybe her defensiveness should have been a sign to the HV?