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Why are gender roles viewed negatively?

866 replies

reddragon7 · 04/04/2023 20:32

I read and see so many threads and real life examples, where men and women feel the need to be “equal.” The man about to become a father, refuses to become the main earner, even when he has the means, and insists that his wife also work and contribute financially. Doesn’t this seem imbalanced to anyone, and that society is being brainwashed to accept this as the norm.

I have nothing against a woman wishing to work post-children, however, I don’t understand why society and some men put pressure on their wives to work, if she would rather stay home with the children. This has now become and expectation. If a woman is contributing financially, it is never really 50/50, as she is also doing most of the domestic work.

People condemn gender roles as though they are ancient, but seem to forget that, biologically and psychologically, women are naturally better caregivers to children. They are the ones pregnant, produce all these hormones, and better equipped to raise a child than a man. Of course, there are exceptions, but as a general fact, people seem to ignore this.

In view of all this, I believe more men should offer to be financial providers, giving women the option to not work after children, as childcare costs aren’t exactly saving them much anyway. Otherwise, it feels we are moving away from our gender roles, which may actually be more helpful in a marriage, than people make out.

OP posts:
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Bepis · 07/04/2023 15:55

@Mycathatesmecuddling I would speak out about matters that are very important to me and my family but I would not engage in such controversial conversations in real life unless someone specifically asked for my opinion.

I like to try and be peaceable as far as I can. I hate conflict, it's not who I am.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/04/2023 15:57

Bepis · 07/04/2023 15:48

@ShodanLives You make a very good point with that example. In that extreme circumstance, I wouldn't respect their views but I also wouldn't start an argument with them to their face as I would likely be their target too.

I appreciate your honesty on this, but I have to say that I find your position quite shocking. Do you not believe that we have a responsibility within society to speak up on behalf of groups who might be vulnerable?

If you saw discrimination and persecution happening on this scale, would you really just shrug it off as not being your problem and decide not to get involved?

Maybe you would. I guess that's actually what an awful lot of people must have done in Nazi Germany, but I have always assumed that most people would at least like to believe that they would have been one of the ones to speak out, even if in practice they might not have done.

It is quite eye opening to see someone express this disinterest so explicitly.

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:01

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves I also appreciate the tone of your posts. They are friendly whilst still not agreeing with me.

In answer to your questions, I have done and do speak out against discrimination. I have recently done this on behalf of my disabled daughter to the Police as they blatantly discriminated against her.

It is difficult to answer your other questions more specifically as it would require me disclosing a lot of background information about myself that I am not comfortable with on here.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Mycathatesmecuddling · 07/04/2023 16:02

Bepis · 07/04/2023 15:55

@Mycathatesmecuddling I would speak out about matters that are very important to me and my family but I would not engage in such controversial conversations in real life unless someone specifically asked for my opinion.

I like to try and be peaceable as far as I can. I hate conflict, it's not who I am.

I see so basically you are self serving and only speak out on behalf of things that impact you personally?

That's really interesting because the thing you are being most vocal about on this thread is defending people's rights to speak out homophobic viewpoints

So rather than defend the vulnerable (gay people who have be traditionally persecuted) you defend homophobic people, despite only speaking out about matters that are very important to you and your family.

On both occasions where you have started the conversation defending the OPs rights to promote a homophobic view point you have done that without being asked for your opinion, so by your own admission this must mean that the right to speak homophobic statements is important to you and your family.

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:04

@Mycathatesmecuddling All I am prepared to say is that I have a very religious background and there are certain topics that I simply can't have an opinion on due to my religion and/or may have very different beliefs compared to the 'norm'.

I do not feel comfortable saying more than that, nothing personal towards you or anyone on here.

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:05

To be clear, to those extrapolating my views. I did not say ONLY women can nurture, and ONLY men have to provide. But that I think it’s better for these roles to exist as I have found them to be more favourable, but if you prefer a different arrangement, thats your choice.

As far as homosexuality is concerned, yes, I am not in favour of it, but that doesn’t mean I am open to abuse. These are my personal beliefs I have expressed, but I would always intervene if I notice a gay person around me being discriminated against, face to face. Or any person for that matter. So don’t try to paint me as some extreme individual who has no regard for others beliefs either. I was honest with my beliefs online, and I preferred not to speak too much on homosexuality, as I know it will stark more controversy.

OP posts:
MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/04/2023 16:05

Thank you for your response. I understand if there is stuff that you don't want to disclose online. Fair enough.

I'm very sorry that your dd experienced discrimination. But do you not think it would be beneficial to people like your dd if all of us challenged discrimination and prejudice whenever we find it, rather than only challenging it when it affects us or our loved ones directly?

AnorLondo · 07/04/2023 16:06

Bepis · 07/04/2023 15:48

@ShodanLives You make a very good point with that example. In that extreme circumstance, I wouldn't respect their views but I also wouldn't start an argument with them to their face as I would likely be their target too.

Wait, so your now your saying it is okay to not respect views? But only if there over where you personally draw the line?

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:06

Also regarding the 'self-serving' comment - yes I only tackle issues that impact my family because that is frankly all I have the energy for. I don't have capacity to combat all the issues in the world as much as I would like to. We all tend to focus on our own family as opposed to wider issues and problems because they naturally come first.

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:09

@AnorLondo I am showing humility and accepting that there will be extreme circumstances where they are so abhorrent that I cannot muster up any respect for those views.

AnorLondo · 07/04/2023 16:09

Bepis · 07/04/2023 15:17

I don't feel that anyone should be saying those comments and same-sex marriage in public, or on a public forum as it is a sensitive subject with many having their own strong feelings on the subject.

My standpoint is that all people and all views should be respected. If we do not agree with something, is it really beneficial to say anything? Can someone just walk away from a conversation in order to keep the peace? Sometimes it is just not worth speaking out.

I don't believe in criticising other people's views. Questionning is fine as that is how we all learn but respect is definitely a two way street.

If no one ever talked about same-sex marriage it never would have been achieved.

If you think no one should ever disagree maybe an Internet forum isn't for you.

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:10

, @Bepis I think you’ve been brave to support my viewpoints, despite all the negativity, and actually took time to understand my beliefs. Thank you for this.

I understand you are a peacemaker and prefer to keep your opinions and beliefs private, unless they are personal to you or your family. I respect that, and if you feel more comfortable with this approach. From what I’ve read, it sounds like your or your family have faced discrimination in the past, which is why you would rather not be judgmental.

OP posts:
Mycathatesmecuddling · 07/04/2023 16:11

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:04

@Mycathatesmecuddling All I am prepared to say is that I have a very religious background and there are certain topics that I simply can't have an opinion on due to my religion and/or may have very different beliefs compared to the 'norm'.

I do not feel comfortable saying more than that, nothing personal towards you or anyone on here.

Okay I understand

So when you are defending the OPs right to make homophobic comments it is because it sits within the issues that you and your family might face

Well to be clear, as you asked this above

I respect your right to have religious opinions, but if you state, or support those, who state homophobic opinions I do not have to not criticise them merely because they are religious opinions. Any more than I do not have to criticise the taliban because they are religious.

AnorLondo · 07/04/2023 16:11

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:09

@AnorLondo I am showing humility and accepting that there will be extreme circumstances where they are so abhorrent that I cannot muster up any respect for those views.

And for many people OPs views fit those circumstances.

Where exactly is the point where you are allowed to not respect views?

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/04/2023 16:12

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:06

Also regarding the 'self-serving' comment - yes I only tackle issues that impact my family because that is frankly all I have the energy for. I don't have capacity to combat all the issues in the world as much as I would like to. We all tend to focus on our own family as opposed to wider issues and problems because they naturally come first.

Again, I disagree.

I don't think that we all tend to focus on our own families to the exclusion of wider social issues. For me, that's a bit of a false dichotomy in any case, because my family has to live within society and I therefore want to contribute to making that the best possible society that it can be. I don't want my dd to grow up in a world that is full of racism, sexism, homophobia, disablism etc.

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:14

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:10

, @Bepis I think you’ve been brave to support my viewpoints, despite all the negativity, and actually took time to understand my beliefs. Thank you for this.

I understand you are a peacemaker and prefer to keep your opinions and beliefs private, unless they are personal to you or your family. I respect that, and if you feel more comfortable with this approach. From what I’ve read, it sounds like your or your family have faced discrimination in the past, which is why you would rather not be judgmental.

Sorry, I meant to add - it appears that you prefer to avoid judgment, due to the fear of causing more controversy.

OP posts:
SilverCatStripes · 07/04/2023 16:14

Western society has devalued caring , so it is seen as having less value than earning money.

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:14

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:10

, @Bepis I think you’ve been brave to support my viewpoints, despite all the negativity, and actually took time to understand my beliefs. Thank you for this.

I understand you are a peacemaker and prefer to keep your opinions and beliefs private, unless they are personal to you or your family. I respect that, and if you feel more comfortable with this approach. From what I’ve read, it sounds like your or your family have faced discrimination in the past, which is why you would rather not be judgmental.

Thank you. It is more my daughter that has been subjected to discrimination and I am currently fighting for her rights against our local Police force.

I don't feel there is much point stating controversial views on a public forum as differing viewpoints (for whatever reason) are hard for people to understand.

I don't think I will be commenting on the homosexual issue anymore but I find the gender discussion quite interesting.

I apologise for going off on a tangent on your thread.

bossonext · 07/04/2023 16:15

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:10

, @Bepis I think you’ve been brave to support my viewpoints, despite all the negativity, and actually took time to understand my beliefs. Thank you for this.

I understand you are a peacemaker and prefer to keep your opinions and beliefs private, unless they are personal to you or your family. I respect that, and if you feel more comfortable with this approach. From what I’ve read, it sounds like your or your family have faced discrimination in the past, which is why you would rather not be judgmental.

🧦🧦

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:16

bossonext · 07/04/2023 16:15

🧦🧦

Oh get over yourself. Just because you can’t comprehend that others may actually understand my views, doesn’t mean you jump to sock puppetry.

OP posts:
Mycathatesmecuddling · 07/04/2023 16:16

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:09

@AnorLondo I am showing humility and accepting that there will be extreme circumstances where they are so abhorrent that I cannot muster up any respect for those views.

And for me homophobia is so abhorrent I cannot muster up any respect for it

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:17

@Mycathatesmecuddling I understand. I don't wish to cause any further upset or frustration.

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:18

@reddragon7 I still have no idea what this sock puppetry thing means 🤷🏻‍♀️

reddragon7 · 07/04/2023 16:19

Bepis · 07/04/2023 16:18

@reddragon7 I still have no idea what this sock puppetry thing means 🤷🏻‍♀️

That we are the same person, and your account is another one I’m replying from. Pathetic isn’t it, that people assume to such things because someone actually supports me.

OP posts:
momtoboys · 07/04/2023 16:20

Oh, dear. This will be a big thread.

Swipe left for the next trending thread