Quotes from Narcissistic Mothers (& support for their victims) Thread 2

[01Name]

Following on from this thread: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4610023-to-ask-for-your-quotes-from-narcissistic-mothers?page=39&reply=120137262, started by @itsgoodtobehome as a tongue-in-cheek repository for anecdotes of appalling remarks/deeds from parents/siblings with rampant NPD. It morphed into a place where those of us suffering the effects of such behaviour could share experiences, solidarity, advice and support. I hope this thread can continue the good work of the original. Your voice will be heard; your opinion and thoughts matter. You are welcome and valued here.

Ps not ‘Steve’ - that mean to say ‘whatever’

What you should have done was put on your coat and told your mother not to speak to you like that again and you'll await her apologies then leave. Don't enter into a debate just walk

It's difficult isn't it.
I agree the bahaviour is appalling, and sometimes no contact is the healthiest option, but some of us nee to, have to or want to continue some degree of relationship;
Narcs have a great ability to twist accounts and events.
I can imagine how my mother would recount that episode with the cold food.
After the event it would be "reesewithoutaspoon said she didn't like my food after I had been cooking all morning, she was rude to me and stormed out of my house. I can't do anything right, she is always angry with me" and mooch around like a little injured kitten.
I am going through a scene at the moment.
My mother's hearing has been deteriorating fow two years or so, and despite my suggestions to get a test, offer to book, to take her etc, she is convinced it is all a plot to make her feel old- she has told me that I "deliberately mumble".
So eventually ( after a penis person suggested it) she booked a test, and indeed she needs a hearing aid.
While she waits she has accepted that she needs a device ( which has been ordered) she continues to play a weird game.
Oe example-
She was trying to book a hair appointment last week and I asked " Did you manage to her a hair booking?"
DM- "Why do you always want to talk about my sister ?" ( she and her hated each other).
Me " No I was asking about your hair"
DM " I thought you were asking about my sister, you are always bringing her up" ( really not true)
DM " Look! (shouting now) I don't want you to talk to me at all in any way until I get my hearing aid!"
Me "OK"
Half an hour later she says " Do you have any ideas what I can ask santa for my christmas"
Me "Do you want me to speak?"
DM "No don't speak"
Me "OK"
DM " So I am not allowed to speak now"
Me " I thought you didn't want me to speak, you can speak all you like"

She has been walking around since Thursday ( thankfully been out a lot) and every time she sees me she makes the sign of a zipped mouth.
She told OH in the car while he was giving her a lift that I have told her she isn't allowed to speak anymore.
It often feels surreal, like an alternate universe.
The thing is my DM has the ability to actually come to believe her own lies and warped perceptions.
She now actually believes I have made some rule banning her from talking.
My ear pods are a blessing.

@speakout I am genuinely amazed you have your mother living with you. Have you thought about getting her into accommodation with a warden , or even a home? Just why are you putting up with this?

Good point.
Why I put up with it stems from childhood trauma, and something I am still working through.
I am one of two siblings. When I was 8 my sister left home and went to live with her boyfriend ( she was 14) my mother dived into a dark place. I didn't understand at the time, but I guess some MH breakdown.
My sister married at 16 and emigrated when I was 10, which further compounded my mothers emotional state. Not cooking, crying all the time, still in her nightdress when I came home from school. My father became terminally ill when was 12- so I was in the position of having to care for them both.
I felt so desperately sorry that my mother had lost a child ( it would be 15 years until my mother saw my sister again), my mother behaved like an injured child.
Then and even now I know I try to compensate for her losses by giving her support and stability.
I have tried to broach the subject of sheltered living, but she immediately becomes defensive, saying" Now you want to throw me away like rubbish" or similar.
She is 89 and becoming increasingly frail, although her passive agression is as sharp as ever.
Part of me feels this won't be forever, and I know there is a long waiting list- years in our area.
I agree it isn't a great situation, but I have managed to put systems in place so she is busy. So a few days a week she is picked up and goes to a day centre for 6 hours, has lunch, sees friends, entertainment etc. Today she is off to the theatre with the same group.
I have enouraged her to engage with her church, so that takes care of Sundays, and usually some social function through the week-there is cheap minibus transport, so I have arranged that too, she will agree to meet friends on the "magic bus" and go to the supermarket, have lunch.
She tires easily, so when she comes home from an activity she will sleep, eat dinner then watch some TV in her room.
So although we don't have a great relationship, many days of the week I am in her company for only an hour or two.

That’s a really awful childhood to have had @speakout . My heart goes out to you. Your mother is really lucky to have you, she really is.
I’m guessing your sister found the home situation very toxic herself and that’s why she left when she did. What an appalling burden for you to have carried as a child.

Sounds like you’re managing the current situation pretty well all things considered, many of us couldn’t do it in your position.

@speakout I totally get where you’re coming from. Again, your mother’s behaviour sounds so familiar. The only difference was; I lived an hour and a half away from her so at least I could decompress on the way home after my visits. My half sister (different mother) asked me several times why I wasn’t NC but she was still my mother and at a failing 88, I felt a sense of duty and obligation. If I was going to cut her out, I should have done it 20 years earlier when she was younger and fitter.

Unfortunately, the viciousness of her tongue didn’t mellow with age and as she slipped into dementia, she lost her inhibitions and forgot about who should receive the charming persona and who got the spiteful one.
I think you’re doing absolutely the right thing keeping her busy with outside activities. My mother was always worse when she was bored. It was like she needed some kind of thrill, drama or entertainment and by causing a row, she got her fix.

One slightly amusing thing regarding hearing aids. My mother was always incredibly vain. Convinced she was drop dead gorgeous and that other people were all envious she was so much better looking than them! She would never wear glasses for this reason, despite struggling to read. Eventually, I managed to get her fitted for hearing aids as she wasn’t coping on a day to day basis but unsurprisingly, she wouldn’t wear them and would attempt to hide them constantly. Eventually they disappeared altogether. When I asked her where they had gone, she boldly said, “The gardener took them. I saw him. He came in, put them in his pocket and left”
This man was really lovely, looked out for her - not that she deserved it - and why he would want to steal a pair of used hearing aids specifically fitted for someone else beats me!

Thanks ilverLiningPlaybook, my eyes are filling up at your kind comments.
Like us all I am doing the best I can.
And my challenges have given me cause for introspection and growth.
I also care for my 24 year old son

What you should have done was put on your coat and told your mother not to speak to you like that again and you'll await her apologies then leave. Don't enter into a debate just walk.

I, ve got to the point where I am emotionally completely detached from her. it's water off a duck's back now. it doesn't upset me. I feel nothing. It use to tie me in knots and in my younger days I would have been groveling to win back her favour, "it's okay mum I, 'll eat it like that" etc at which point she probably would have chucked it in the bin, because "I was being ungrateful and obviously didn't want it", so I don't play those games anymore.

She's old and she won't be here much longer as callous as that sounds. I Just keep contact to a minimum, watch tiktoks when she phones me and do the odd umm, yes, ahh, ok because she's not after a conversation, just wants to talk at you.

I only visit with an exit plan so I don't have to stay longer than an hour etc.

As long as she stays independent it's bearable. The issue will come if she develops care needs because that won't be happening ever. She's the type who would be obstructive about letting anyone in her home because she's under the deluded impression that her family has nothing better to do than take care of her needs That's going to be a rude awakening. But we've all discussed it and are on the same page.

@speakout you deserve a medal, I couldn't do what you're doing. My mum once 'jokingly' suggested she sell her house and use the money to convert my extension into a granny annexe. Before I could stop myself I blurted out. don't be ridiculous. I would kill you within a week. She still thinks I was joking.

I think you have found the key reesewithoutaspoon.
People can behave as they like, but we don't have to react in a way that upsets us.
I have been learning to emotionally regulate myself, understanding how my emotions are tied up with my codependancy, and take steps to preserve my mental landscape using many techniques, and having healthy boundaries.
With practice it becomes easier.

My mother literally had an argument with herself yesterday. She needs drama in her life. I mindfully stayed out, did nothing to inflame the situation (my attempts to calm her will often have the opposite effect) and observed her getting more and more irate.
I don't need her validation, and I don't particularly care what she thinks of me.
I try to be curteous and kind, but I won't jump through her hoops.

@speakout It sounds like you're in a similar place too. You said it yourself. I don't care what she thinks of me. That's the point when you take your power back. I don't care if she thinks I,m a shit daughter, she needs me more than I need her. And tbh I don't need her. I could walk away tomorrow and never miss her. I, ve accepted who she is and accepted the fact that she can't show love due to who she is and I no longer look for it anyway, that way madness lies.

@reecewithoutaspoon That’s a very healthy way of viewing and dealing with an NPD person - excellent advice.

I did find there was a subtle power shift as she got older. She never stopped being a bitch and putting the boot in at every opportunity and, maybe because I became more confident in my own right, I was more able to grey rock her and refuse to be baited by the deliberately provocative and contentious remarks. They still occasionally got through my armour but I used to mentally repeat to myself that she’s now just a sad, pathetic and powerless old woman. I know that sounds harsh but it helped keep my sanity in my dealings with her.

During lockdown, when work shut down, zero wfh set up, no contact from anyone for weeks, my MH was spiralling, she insisted that 'its just like when I retired, not seeing work folk'.

So, so many other instances. Nothing, ever acknowledging how I felt, constant comparisons with her own experiences and how they were worse than mine.

JohnPrescottsPyjamas I don't think that's a harsh view- it is probably accurate, and sad.
One thing that works for me is treating her like a badly behaved 5 year old. Totally wrapped up in herself, unreasonable when things don't go her own way, prone to tantrums, and unable to consider anyone else's perspective.
In fact that's is a little unfair to 5 year olds who can be very respectful and empathic.
It feels like having another young child in the house.
I only tell her information that she needs to know ( usually stuff that affects her) although we live together she knows very little about my life- what I do when I go out, people I know, events I attend. Because if I share with her it passes through her own frame of reference, ie how it affectJohnPrescottsPyjamass her. She has zero interest otherwise, and can be quite rude.
So if I were to tell her about an interview I had or a local hotel I had visited for coffee she is quite blatant about her inattention, and will literally interrupt me mid sentence- " Guess who I met on the bus yesterday" or " I am thinking about having my hair dyed a warmer blonde next time, but haven't decided yet, maybe I will speak to the stylist"
So in the end I have given up sharing my life quite some time ago- and the ironic thing is that she hasn't noticed I have gone grey rock.
In fact I think she enjoys it-means she can do 99% of the talking during a "conversation".

JohnPrescottsPyjamass woops- not sure how I managed to insert your name in the middle of the paragraph- you get the gist though!

The thing is she won't ever acknowledge it, the danger lies in expecting her to, Tying yourself in knots, trying to understand why she's so self-absorbed and mean, when the fact is she's like that because that's just her. It's no reflection on you or what kind of daughter you are because you could be Mother Theresa and she still wouldn't treat you any different, because it's not about you, she's not worrying about you, only her needs. So stop worrying about hers. She's never going to be the concerned mother you wish for, not because you are deficient in any way, she's just incapable of it.

It’s hard though when other siblings are not treated the same. My mother is lovely to my siblings. It’s just me she is vile to. It leaves me feeling there is something intrinsically wrong with me. She will do kind things for acquaintances. For example, she sent a large cheque to my cousin who she barely knows when she graduated, yet ignored my daughter when she graduated. There are many instances like that. Things like that really hurt.

She will do things for people who massage her ego and tell her she is wonderful. A lot of it is about looking good and getting the strokes.

Someone mentioned a book that had been helpful earlier in one of these threads. I can’t find the post now. Would someone re post it please?

Is it this book?
www.amazon.co.uk/Will-Ever-Good-Enough-Narcissistic/dp/1439129436/ref=asc_df_1439129436/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=310831412334&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=14466823103515926150&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9046893&hvtargid=pla-435426350635&psc=1&th=1&psc=13

Thanks speakout! Yea

@SilverLiningPlaybook I think you’ve hit the nail on the head.

“She will do things for people who massage her ego and tell her she is wonderful. A lot of it is about looking good and getting the strokes.“

Their relationships are certainly all about those that feed their egos. They have a need to be constantly told how perfect they are, what wonderful parents they are, how beautiful they are. We all like compliments but their need is excessive. If I tried to be charitable and compliment my mother, I instantly regretted it as she would go completely overboard rather than just accept graciously.

Most of their favourite relations or “best friends” are the ones that fulfil this need. It’s a very one sided partnership though, if their disciples require support or have needs of their own, they become burdensome and ‘demanding’ and their only value is to be gossiped or bitched about. The only slight exception is if the NPD can offer some showy charitable action to the fallen disciple; something they can tell others, “If it wasn’t for me, Gladys wouldn’t have coped” “etc etc.

It’s definitely not you @SilverLiningPlaybook, it’s probably because she knows she doesn’t need to impress you with grand gestures, therefore she doesn’t bother. It’s about her need to feel self important when your cousin gushes over her generosity - almost like ‘buying’ compliments? Maybe she knows deep down that you won’t play the game either? They seem incapable of giving just for the pleasure it gives the recipient, it’s about the emotional mileage and status that can be gained from the gesture which, I agree, is very hurtful.

my mum used to love the showy gestures to randoms but is incapable of buying gifts for her family that isn't stuff she likes. She literally cannot put herself in anyone else's shoes and think, "what does Kathy like?" So we get weird-ass presents of cardis she likes, the perfume she likes, the food she likes.
My sis is an avid reader and has been all her life, sick of getting smellies that she can't use due to sensitivities she asked me to intervene and helpfully suggest book tokens for her birthday. When I suggested this to mum, she recoiled in horror and said "who would want that, that's a boring awful present" because she doesn't read and she is so disinterested in anyone but herself, the fact her daughter would love it, hadn't even registered.

I haven't posted yet but you're all describing my life to a tee. I almost feel like I can't jump into the discussion as it would take far too long to explain my experiences and relationship - needless to say it follows the script that you're all describing so maybe it's not even worth trying!

I wanted to recommend Dr Les Carter on YouTube as well as his podcast and his books particularly Enough About You Let's Talk About Me. This man REALLY knows what he's talking about!

Oh yes! I get presents from my mother very occasionally but they are always things she likes or would want to get herself. Her taste in clothes, painting sets, drawing sets, stuff I would just never use. I don't think she has ever given me something I actually wanted in my whole life.
The prize was when she gave a cake slice to a four year old child..

She also gives things that are frankly insulting. She came round for tea one day and brought a box of carrots for me as a present. She told me quickly she needed the tupperware container back straight away...