3yo saying he's hungry - what's the fair thing to do?

[PerspicaciousGreen]

Our 3yo frequently complains that he's hungry, and I don't know whether it's fair to not give him anything and make him wait, or whether we're being mean.

7.30am he has a cup of milk then gets dressed and has breakfast around 8am - usually porridge, sometimes toast.

10.30am is snack time, usually a banana but sometimes has an apple or similar instead.

12.15pm is lunchtime. This is our main meal of the day, something cooked and filling. Curry, pasta, rice and stir-fry... Then they both have a nap.

4.30pm is the little ones dinner which is usually something on toast or picky bits as they're very erratic about how much they eat at that time so it's easier to do something cold so they can either have a little bit or we can keep it coming as necessary.

Problem is, 3yo has started saying he's hungry at other times. Often having had three spoons of porridge and then saying he's hungry half an hour after we've cleared away. Or saying he's finished dinner and ready for his bath and then the second he's in his pyjamas he says he's hungry. I just end up thinking "Well you should have thought of that half an hour ago!" But I don't know if that's a reasonable thought to have about a 3yo. If he wakes up from his nap hungry we do tend to give him a little something then.

On a nursery day my 3½ year old has cereal at home, then cereal and/or toast when she gets to nursery. They have fruit and milk mid morning, then cooked lunch and pudding at about 11.30. At about 3pm they have a light tea like a sandwich, wrap, soup, spaghetti etc. When she gets home at 5ish she sometimes has a snack like a bread stick or something while I sort dinner. Then she'll eat a full dinner most times or maybe something like beans on toast. Then milk before bed. Some kids are just always hungry. My 6 year old never ate that much!

This thread is really upsetting.
The OP isn't giving her son enough food and has large gaps in between meals. making him wait to be fed, making his meal times be dictated by their baby.
Giving cold "picky bits" as his dinner because he's three and she doesn't want to have a difficult mealtime so cold picky bits is easier... I feel so sorry for the son.

Our 3yo frequently complains that he's hungry, and I don't know whether it's fair to not give him anything and make him wait, or whether we're being mean

I just end up thinking "Well you should have thought of that half an hour ago!"

Please op, just keep reading this. Look at your preschooler and read this again.

I would try offering something that isn't porridge at breakfast if he isn't eating that. Toast and peanut butter or fruit with greek yogurt as we come into summer? Mine gets bored if offered the same breakfasts all the time.

I do not give him food if he refuses breakfast and is hungry, he can wait till the next snack and then doesn't get any extra. I've been down that road before, snacks are more exciting than breakfast so he just learnt to refuse breakfast so he could get something tastier later 🤷‍♀️.

If he was really hungry half an hour after refusing breakfast, I would maybe serve him the same (freshly made) porridge again, not something else and I wouldn't do it two days in a row.

I have a stubborn and clever toddler who will take a mile if you give him a millimetre.

And no "you should have thought of that an hour ago " is not at all reasonable for a 3 year old.

If your child is frequently saying they are hungry.... they are telling you they are hungry. You don't want him to grow up remembering being a hungry child and not fed or with food issues of his own do you?

@SleepingStandingUp

Yes, feed your hungry child. Your punishing him for not being hungry when you decide he should be hungry to fit in with the baby's schedule.

If he leaves his porridge can you put some foil over the top and if he says he's hungry offer it back? Or nuke in the microwave for 30 seconds with a bit of extra milk in?

Lunch I'd cut the volume given he's had bfast, milk, snack and lunch all within 5 hours.

How long does he nap for?

If he leaves his dinner, cover it and reoffer it when he's hungry given its cold so will be fine. Or offer plain toast / yoghurt / banana.

This is the useful practical advice you need. Ignore the dramatics from others about you starving your child. Obviously there’s a balance to be had and ultimately you are aiming for and moving towards a finite number of meals and snacks - I know ten year olds who graze all day and never eat a meal! Mine still always have a banana and milk before bed at primary age.

@MaryBoBary

In fact it's almost a bit lazy to whip up some "picky bits" (gross) at 4.30 and think you're done for the day. Don't be mean. Give them a proper meal AT DINNERTIME, not midafternoon.

Totally agree.

She can't be arsed maybe offering two different hot meals so offers him cold picky things. Wtf.
That's not good parenting.

With similar age children, DC1 would have a slice of toast at 6am when DC2 had his first feed of the day and then have breakfast at 8am.
Tea was never until 5pm and then DC1 would usually have toast, cheese & milk just before going to bed.
As you say, you don't know if he's going to eat twice as much as you or one bite. Therefore, I found it easier to feed little and often rather than the three meals a day route.
Even when they started school, they still tended to have breakfast, playtime snack (apple, carrots & crackers), lunch, light tea as soon as they got in the door, actual tea around 5ish and then toast, cheese & milk before bed.
DC1 is now 11 and now has a banana for breakfast, packed lunch, snack when she gets in and then tea around 5.30. She does sport from 6.30 - 8.00 three times a week and will sometimes have something to eat after that too.

I always let mine eat when they’re hungry as long as it’s not 5 mins before a meal etc. I only offer fruit but they’re allowed as much as they like within reason.
If that’s a typical days food that you’ve described id say it’s variety that’s missing, it all sounds a little boring. Maybe that’s why he’s not eating much of it. I have two very fussy preschoolers so I know how hard it is to get them to eat.
I’d also factor in something 1/2 hour before bed.

And just for context, my healthy / active 4 year old DD has:

6:30am Veda toast or cereal, sliced apple and a yoghurt pouch

10am crackers, fruit, breadsticks, more yoghurt whatever she fancies for "snack"

12pm pasta and sauce, pitta pizzas, fish and veg, whatever as long as it's a meal

3pm carrot sticks, dips, maybe a little kinder bar

6pm evening meal, curry or casserole or meat and veg.

I would think that's pretty average and has been her routine since she was about 2-2.5? I can't fathom a child around her age getting by on spoonfuls of porridge and "picky bits" (horrible term)

We've done three meals and three snacks (if wanted) since ours was weaned, so breakfast, lunch and dinner then snacks mid-morning, mid-afternoon and before bed. Ours is a string bean and little and often seemed to suit her.

@Horehound

This thread is really upsetting. The OP isn't giving her son enough food and has large gaps in between meals. making him wait to be fed, making his meal times be dictated by their baby. Giving cold "picky bits" as his dinner because he's three and she doesn't want to have a difficult mealtime so cold picky bits is easier... I feel so sorry for the son.

Me too. Frankly, it's upsetting.

I can't help wondering if op has disordered eating or issues with food restriction... ive certainly never come across another mum out in the wild who has a feeding regime like this...

@NailsNeedDoing

Yes, you are mean to make him wait, especially as it seems your routine is driven by your own convenience rather than your child’s needs and appetite.

This!!

Food, sleep and routines are all intertwined at that age. You can't really consider one without the others. Trying to make a 3yo fit in with the baby is weird - most people fit the baby around the toddler as much as possible. The toddler nap will disappear very soon. That will give more time for food - and also more time to expend energy so building up the need for more food.

A child cannot really understand needing to eat now, to ensure they aren't hungry later until at least 10. You are expecting way too much if you think a 3yo can plan their day!

Offer a variety of food at one meal so that he has a choice - he may not fancy porridge for breakfast, but if there is fruit and yogurt or toast and peanut butter as well, he will probably eat more. But if he says he is hungry and the next meal is more than 30 mins away, yes give him a snack.

His stomach isn't big enough at this age to fill up with enough food if he hasn't eaten between 12.15 and 8am the next day. Even 4.30 - 8 is a huge length of time - you try it and see how hungry you are!

I haven't RTFT but from a quick overview I seem to disagree with most PPs. This probably is partly because my toddler has always been a fussy and difficult eater. She went through phases where she was saying she was hungry every 5 seconds but she'd not even eat when you gave her food. She's nearly 3 and she will still ask for a snack sometimes when she's tired or bored rather than hungry. We also got to the point where she was hardly eating anything at meal times and just filling up on loads of snacks - and it was impossible to make them all 'healthy' snacks given she wouldn't eat any vegetables at all then.

Our current routine is:

• Small cup of milk immediately upon waking, this is anywhere between 7.30 and 8.30am. Breakfast shortly afterwards, which is almost all cereal with milk and she usually gets a choice. E.g. at the moment she could have Rice Krispies, Oatibix or Kellogg's just for kids shape things. If she eats it all and wants more then we will keep things coming - always fruit first then maybe a Baby bell or another piece of fruit etc. She usually eats a lot in the morning. We don't usually give any snacks after 10am or she doesn't eat her lunch. If she hasn't eaten her cereal we don't offer anything else and if she wants it later on we will make her another small bowl up if it's gone soggy later.
• Lunch - whenever she asks for it, these days is about 12.30pm/12.45pm usually. Usually toast/sandwich with cucumber and tomato, piece or two of fruit, maybe a pack of crisps or some rice cakes or a biscuit, she usually eats a substantial amount. She naps 2-3pm.
• Small snack after nap about 3.30pm, usually a piece of fruit.
• Dinner is about 6/6.15pm which is our main meal of the day but she often hardly eats anything, sometimes nothing. E.g. yesterday she ate 1.5 veggie fingers, some carrots and two tiny spoons of mash. If she eats some of her dinner and asks for snack afterwards she gets a biscuit or cake or fruit or yoghurt etc with her small cup of milk about 6.30/6.45. If she doesn't touch her dinner she does not get anything else except milk and we redirect her back to dinner. Sometimes she eats some later and sometimes not.
• She's in bed by 8pm.

Add snack after naps.

Move dinner back a bit later. Needs to be more substantial even if simple after bigger lunch. Eggs on toast, fruit, yogurt.

Yes I would give snack if hungry. Banana/ toast

Add milk before bed.

My 11month old eats last meal 6-7pm. Then milk at 8pm. Then milk 7am and breakfast 8am like you. So he eats 2-3hrs later but breakfast same time. No wonder 3 year old says he’s hungry.

4pm is snack time, not dinner.. 4pm-8am is 16hrs without food. Add snack around 3pm, move dinner to 5-5.30pm, add milk before bed at 6.30pm.

Breakfast maybe a selection is better. Just porridge or toast can be boring so they give up. We do small bowl porridge, then they get a bit of finger food like toast, fruit cut up afterwards to continue.

@MeadowHay

I haven't RTFT but from a quick overview I seem to disagree with most PPs. This probably is partly because my toddler has always been a fussy and difficult eater. She went through phases where she was saying she was hungry every 5 seconds but she'd not even eat when you gave her food. She's nearly 3 and she will still ask for a snack sometimes when she's tired or bored rather than hungry. We also got to the point where she was hardly eating anything at meal times and just filling up on loads of snacks - and it was impossible to make them all 'healthy' snacks given she wouldn't eat any vegetables at all then.

Our current routine is:

• Small cup of milk immediately upon waking, this is anywhere between 7.30 and 8.30am. Breakfast shortly afterwards, which is almost all cereal with milk and she usually gets a choice. E.g. at the moment she could have Rice Krispies, Oatibix or Kellogg's just for kids shape things. If she eats it all and wants more then we will keep things coming - always fruit first then maybe a Baby bell or another piece of fruit etc. She usually eats a lot in the morning. We don't usually give any snacks after 10am or she doesn't eat her lunch. If she hasn't eaten her cereal we don't offer anything else and if she wants it later on we will make her another small bowl up if it's gone soggy later.
• Lunch - whenever she asks for it, these days is about 12.30pm/12.45pm usually. Usually toast/sandwich with cucumber and tomato, piece or two of fruit, maybe a pack of crisps or some rice cakes or a biscuit, she usually eats a substantial amount. She naps 2-3pm.
• Small snack after nap about 3.30pm, usually a piece of fruit.
• Dinner is about 6/6.15pm which is our main meal of the day but she often hardly eats anything, sometimes nothing. E.g. yesterday she ate 1.5 veggie fingers, some carrots and two tiny spoons of mash. If she eats some of her dinner and asks for snack afterwards she gets a biscuit or cake or fruit or yoghurt etc with her small cup of milk about 6.30/6.45. If she doesn't touch her dinner she does not get anything else except milk and we redirect her back to dinner. Sometimes she eats some later and sometimes not.
• She's in bed by 8pm.

Except this is totally different in that OPs son wants more food but OP thinks "tough, should've thought if that before" What she said was he occasionally doesn't eat all his breakfast, well I can imagine the same breakfast day after day gets pretty boring.

Our 3yo frequently complains that he's hungry, and I don't know whether it's fair to not give him anything and make him wait, or whether we're being mean

I just end up thinking "Well you should have thought of that half an hour ago!"

I really, really hope this is a troll or exaggerated post because that’s a horrific thing to say about a 3yo.

He’s 3.

My earliest memories are of being hungry. My parents were abusive. Those memories never go away.

Feed your child properly ffs, it’s not acceptable to let a small child go hungry for your convenience. There’s a massive difference between having a routine and not over indulging a child, and being cruel. If your child is frequently hungry and having to go from early afternoon to 8am with no food then you’ll be falling into the category you don’t want to be in

It seems a bit light on protein ...my ds was hungrier in the morning so added some protein egg/Greek yoghurt/sausage/cheese...as well as fruit/carb..

Veg/oatbake/fruit mid morning + milk..

Main meal plus same again for later eg beans/egg n toast if you just do light meals in the evening...more milk/Greek yoghurt

However would check not thirsty so if having recently eaten would check drink level as can feel like hunger..
Or distract with toy/story as can also be boredom....

OK, thanks to the posters confirming that I'm being very unreasonable to expect him to think ahead before decreeing he's finished, and to those offering practical advice on how to manage rejected food and further snacks.

Honestly, the number of people who think we're starving him! I didn't think it was relevant to go into that much detail. So look, on an "eating day", he'll actually have:

Cup of milk
B: Bowl of porridge, bowl of muesli, maybe some yoghurt or fruit
S: Two bananas, oatcakes and peanut butter
L: Big bowl of kedgeree with fish and egg and veg, second helpings
S: Oatcakes and peanut butter when he wakes up
D: Few round of cheese on toast, veg sticks, fruit, breadsticks and dip, yoghurt

That level of eating is always on offer if he wants it. He's just very variable in how much he eats. Aren't most toddlers? Also, believe me, he needs all that sleep. Always has.

I don't want to do things the way my parents did, true, but that was forcing food on me that I didn't want and badgering me to clear my plate at every meal even when it was things they knew I hated. So we're more of a "this is what's on offer, eat the bits you want, leave the bits you don't" household. There's always something he likes so if he wants to make an entire meal of rice, that's OK for that day. And actually we make the baby fit in with his pre-existing routine, not the other way around! (I say baby... She's 14m now!)

But we will think about making afternoon snack a fixture and not just when he asks, and adding a little something before bed. When we had main meal in the evening he'd hardly touched it so we moved it to lunchtime and it's settled there.

He is 3. Children that age don't plan their eating, you shouldn't expect that for some time.

Have you got a younger child too? Are you giving them meals on their schedule rather than your 3yos?

My 3yo wildly varies from eating nothing to eating everything in sight so I understand your issue. I usually leave things out so if he doesn't eat all his lunch, I'll leave it out for an hour or so and he can go back to it later if he fancies it. I've been known to wrap a nibbled sandwich up and take it out to the park because he's not eaten at lunch. He doesn't regularly have snacks unless he asks for one or we're having a very active morning/afternoon because he wasn't eating his main meals of the day otherwise and we were stuck in a no meals/hungry/snack loop.

As for schedule we have breakfast at 7.30 (milk before while watching TV), lunch at 12ish and dinner at 5.45.

Start by not clearing away meals he leaves. Then when he’s hungry half an hour later you can offer it again.

But in this house from Age 3ish onwards the rule is bread, fruit, cereal and yogurt are available at all times except 30-60 minutes before a main meal (so that they aren’t full for the meal). Breakfast is as soon as DC get up once over 1 so most calories should be from food, not milk. Age 3 he should be able to get himself cereal if you are in the room: make sure cereal, bowl and milk are all low enough to reach. It will be a bit messy at first!

I do think a lot of the replies in here are very over the top and I hope it hasn't put the OP off

She has come on here seeking advice, offering her schedule and asked for some help. She acknowledges that she doesn't know what to do.

She's then come back to the thread and asked for some more advice and taken on much of the advice

I think labelling her cruel, mean, abusive (!) (I have reported you @ButterflyHoneyPot as I think your post is uncalled for) are far too severe

A mother has come on here and sought out advice and openly said she doesn't know if what's she's doing right. I know Mumsnet can be a bunch of vipers but to coin other posters..,FFS!

I think your expectations of a three year old are unreasonable.

@PerspicaciousGreen

OK, thanks to the posters confirming that I'm being very unreasonable to expect him to think ahead before decreeing he's finished, and to those offering practical advice on how to manage rejected food and further snacks.

Honestly, the number of people who think we're starving him! I didn't think it was relevant to go into that much detail. So look, on an "eating day", he'll actually have:

Cup of milk
B: Bowl of porridge, bowl of muesli, maybe some yoghurt or fruit
S: Two bananas, oatcakes and peanut butter
L: Big bowl of kedgeree with fish and egg and veg, second helpings
S: Oatcakes and peanut butter when he wakes up
D: Few round of cheese on toast, veg sticks, fruit, breadsticks and dip, yoghurt

That level of eating is always on offer if he wants it. He's just very variable in how much he eats. Aren't most toddlers? Also, believe me, he needs all that sleep. Always has.

I don't want to do things the way my parents did, true, but that was forcing food on me that I didn't want and badgering me to clear my plate at every meal even when it was things they knew I hated. So we're more of a "this is what's on offer, eat the bits you want, leave the bits you don't" household. There's always something he likes so if he wants to make an entire meal of rice, that's OK for that day. And actually we make the baby fit in with his pre-existing routine, not the other way around! (I say baby... She's 14m now!)

But we will think about making afternoon snack a fixture and not just when he asks, and adding a little something before bed. When we had main meal in the evening he'd hardly touched it so we moved it to lunchtime and it's settled there.

I think that sounds fine and if your DC eats all that in one day quantity-wise it's a lot more than my DD does! I think front-loading eating is very common for toddlers, I know plenty of other mums whose kids do the same - eat loads the first half of the day then hardly eat dinner. Mine is like that too to the point where DH and I also keep saying we should switch our main cooked meal to lunchtime and see if that works to get more food of nutritional value down her! I would maybe add a small snack immediately after waking, move dinner time a bit later - 5 or 5.30pm? And add a small cup of milk before bed too.