Should I tell my daughter she has a half sister? (title edited by MNHQ)

[tedrekasta]

I have an English daughter aged 32. She has 2 children.

Shamefully, I had an affair 6 years ago with a Polish woman who I met abroad whilst working which (accidentally) resulted in another daughter. She lives in Poland with her mother (and elder Polish half sister).

I have never told my English daughter about her half sister in Poland.

Historically, my English daughter always yearned for a sister and my wife and I regret not having any more children. We are in our 60's. I am 68.

I have to tell terrible lies to both my wife and my English daughter in order to go and visit my daughter in Poland. Which I do about every 2 months.

I miss my Polish daughter, now 5, very much. But I love my English daughter so much and don't want to hurt her. And I love my wife very much and don't want to hurt her.

I just don't know what to do.

Should I tell my English daughter that she has a very young half sister living in Poland?

I am deeply upset and ashamed of myself. But want the best for my wife, my English daughter and my Polish daughter.

I would love any advice. Especially from anyone who has been through such a situation or similar situation.

Thank you for any help.

Which do you think is the more likely scenario:

1. Pregnant, alone, broke and desperate. Sees an opportunity to secure financial assistance through her pregnancy and beyond.

or

2. Saw an old , fat, ugly, man and couldn't resist seducing him?

This is just going on what you've told us Ted. You've said that you didn't instigate it, you didn't pursue her, she did all the running. You say that you are not attractive. You say that it wasn't an affair where she got to know you and fell for you personality, it was just a quick fling.

I don't see how you can tell your English dd that she has a half sister unless you can actually confirm that is the case. Your reluctance to have the test does seem to indicate that you have some doubts yourself.

Do what you must regarding the young daughter but please be wary of the Polish mother. PP has made some good points in that post and I think it's possible she saw you as her chance to move and has got angry at you since then because it didn't happen. I know Poland is in the EU but you still need money and somewhere to live here. You didn't leave your wife or kick her out so that she could move in so it's just possible that's what's aggravated her. Call me cynical but something kind of similar happened to me so it's left me very suspicious about situations like this. Hopefully after the six weeks silence you can work it out

Stop being so nice and overly romantic and get a DNA test!
Then you can worry about telling your daughter

Finally, I know many of you disagree with me on this, but the Polish mother doesn't seem to me to be the kind of person who would tell such a terrible lie. I can believe many things about her. But not this. I just cannot imagine her being so terrible. After all it is a huge lie for her to tell her daughter. And that just doesn't seem credible

What she is and what you think/imagine her to be aren't necessarily the same thing though, I mean how well do you actually know this person? Things aren't always what they seem and you can't determine what other people will see as credible or an acceptable thing to do, even to their own child. I only say this in the hope you'll think about the implications for your wider family it's definitely not a criticism or judgement on your ability to judge someone else's character, after all it's only you that knows her. Do you still care about your wife now?

And if a test proved that I am not the father then I don't honestly think that I would stop loving her. And I don't think I would want to stop paying maintenance. Though I agree that my wife would probably have strong views on both of those matters

I'd be on the side of your wife 100% if it turned out the child wasn't yours. Having an affair and paying maintenance for a child who IS yours, is one thing. Having an affair and paying maintenance for a child who isn't yours, is a completely different kettle of fish.

In that case, I'd definitely be taking control of all the finances so as not to have our hard earned money wasted on a child that has absolutely no connection to you/us.

I firmly believe your UK daughter needs, and has a right, to know ASAP - once it's been established through a UK DNA test that the Polish girl is your daughter.

Finding out during a will reading, when she's already reeling from the grief of a parent, would be horrendous and cruel. To not do so, is only thinking of yourself. She has a right to ask you questions, etc - something she can't do when you're dead. Not telling her ASAP is only thinking of yourself. I'd also be pissed off with my mother if I found out she'd known and kept it a secret too. The UK daughter doesn't need to have a relationship with the young girl, or even acknowledge her existence, but she has a right to know OF her existence, and way before she finds out via a will.

And Ted's grandchildren who are similar ages to this polish child

I'm slightly baffled that we can't accept that this child is his daughter. If it was the other way round I'm sure we would be irate... "I had unprotected sex with a man nine months before my daughter was born, and did a DNA test afterwards to confirm it for him. He has happily paid maintenance for years but is now suspicious that the child may not be his. AIBU to be upset???!!!"

I don't think it's at all unreasonable of him to believe that this is his daughter. The mother has done a DNA test (albeit in a foreign country, but honestly, DNA tests work the same across the world!) and he had unprotected sex with the mother exactly nine months before the birth....

I know two people in this situation, one who who only found out when the other family turned up at the funeral and the other who found out at the will point.

It blew both families apart and was awful as it was so hurtful that he had left it to a time they were already upset.

One family have two half siblings who are now very close, the other don't want to know.

Notmypenguin

The odds of a woman in her 40s, by no means in her most fertile period of life, suddenly throwing herself at an unattractive(by his own admission, but no woman had thrown herself at him ever before) man 20+ years her senior, refusing to discuss contraception assuring him that she was on her "safe" day and then, oh surprise, having a baby 9 months later are infinitely low. The fact that Ted never said - that child is a spitting image of me, had you seen her, no one would question it, adds to the doubts. He also never said I've been known for my supersperm all my life, I have a dozen kids already and my wife got pregnant first time round every time. Ted, did your wife by any chance get pregnant with your one confirmed child on the first attempt?

Of course DNA tests work the same all over the world, it's not the case of Polish testing facilities being inadequate or mixing things up. Only if you don't live in the country and don't speak/understand Polish, give your sample to what you are told is a DNA checking facility, and then the local woman who claims that it's your child tells you a letter arrived(or shows you 'the proof") confirming you are the father, it's not the same as "DNA tests work the same all over the world" ...

Ted,

I just read most of this thread and it strikes me that at the beginning most people were far too harsh on you. People make mistakes and you seem to be in a horrible sad place. But I do think you seem to blame ‘weakness’ for what seems like selfishness in some instances. Telling your wife by test message was quite shocking to me.

What I’m interested in is a question no one seems to have asked: What do you love about your wife? How do you feel around her? Do you do things together? Can you list or describe any of this? If you don’t, people will just keep accusing you of not loving her or caring for her. I can see at your age you probably don’t want to be alone, but was there any real warmth between you before all this came out? I noticed you called your time with the Polish woman ‘an affair’ when it was an (extended) one night stand. If you use language like this with your wife, you’ve just given her the impression it was so much more than it was. It’s like you’re deliberately not helping yourself at all. I bet your wife is really concerned you have been carrying on with the Polish woman all this time. As a wife that would be my biggest concern, so I hope you addressed this firmly.

I also hope you haven’t also implied to your wife that the Polish woman took advantage of your weakness, because it wasn’t weakness it was selfishness. You presumably enjoyed sleeping with her and/or it made you feel good about yourself. I take your point about not using a condom – you’d hardly be the first man to turn down a ‘lucky’ shag because you had nothing handy!- but you do need to please accept that you did this because you wanted to at the time. Women just like a man to own up to what they’ve done and not make excuses or blame someone else. Say ‘I was stupid’ or ‘I was a total sh*t and you’re right, it’s not ok’, not ‘I was weak and she pursued me’. I think maybe you can fix it with her if you say the right things. Surely you can see how much the excuses you make about weakness annoy the women here. Why would you wife be different?

I think it’s quite possible you are the father of the Polish girl. Just because she was in her 40s doesn’t mean she couldn’t get pregnant quickly, and just because you were (in your own view) unattractive doesn’t mean there was nothing about you that appealed to her if she was lonely and you were nice to her etc. I do think you need a DNA test in English so you can verify it. That’s especially important to your English daughter because if there is no blood relation, she doesn’t need to know. If I had a younger half sister in a different country in those circumstances she would not be ‘the sister I always dreamed of’ but I would be interested to meet her. But you cannot try to predict your elder daughter’s reaction because she is not any of us, she is herself.

You do seem a bit obsessed with the little girl. I am sure you adore her but is she also a form of escapism from a boring life? You don’t talk about your grown up daughter with the same love. What about your grandchildren? I’m surprised if you love kids you haven’t enthused about them or said how you love being a granddad. It’s what you DON’T say that is the most interesting thing about your posts.

I just wrote this so you think a bit more carefully about HOW you express yourself to your wife/elder daughter and the words you use, because you seem to be getting it wrong and it’s frustrating to see.

Thanks again everyone.

A LOT of things to think about.

I feel a bit like an oil tanker - sometimes I think I resemble one - in that I have been very slow to move towards having another DNA test.

I think you are all right.

But I find it a deeply upsetting thought. Literally heartbreaking. And I would be terrified whilst waiting the days for the result to come through.

Despite which I have done some investigating. I phoned a couple of companies to find out the procedure. The biggest two things seem to be that In order to have a DNA test I think that you must have the permission of all parties involved. And secondly, all 3 people need to be tested to obtain an accurate result. Father and daughter alone are not enough for a really accurate result.

Though of course a simple blood test can prove that someone is not your daughter. But cannot prove that they are your daughter. Only DNA seems able to do that.

I should add that I am not a medic and I may well have got the above two statements wrong.

Goldenrachota. That was an interesting post. And I don't know how to answer the issues you raise. But I do think that I have an unpleasant personality - not deliberately- but I can come across as uncaring and uninterested. Selfish is probably right. And one big criticism I have had from my wife is that I am 'needy'. Which I am beginning to think is true. I do try to address these failings. Because they are clearly awful failings. But I don't seem to succeed.

Especially at the moment whilst I feel depressed I think I am at my worst.

Paternity testing can be done with or without the mother.
www.genetrack.co.uk/tests/dna-paternity-test

My friend did so discreetly on an access day as he had legitimate concerns, including financial as the mother wanted him to fund private schooling on top of maintenance, as she was having an affair before and after becoming pregnant & eventually left to be with the o/m.

It involves swabbing the child's and your inner cheek and sending off the separate sealed containers for analysis. If your wife was insistent on a DNA check it would necessitate a visit to Poland to get the DNA sample.

Christ on a bike, what a miserable situation
Tellyour dd, divorce your wife. This is the only way out of this miserable situation

So... are you getting the UK DNA test or what?

If you're getting a "UK DNA" test, whatever you do, don't send it over for the mother to do. She could swab a banana for all you know, soak it in vinegar, "oh did it come back as unreadable, shame". Go visit, swab daughter and yourself.
But then if she refuses to send your daughters UK cheek swab back, then yoinalsknsadly have your answer in that she knows it will be not a match so refuses and you will know.

goldenrachita raised an issue I was thinking about as well, about your lack of mentioning your two grandchildren, although I realize that could be just for their privacy as they are nothing to do with this. But it does still kinda suggest a lack of affection for them somewhat in comparison and surely you know them better than the daughter abroad?

I've no idea about the morals of the o/w in Poland and no one can answer for or control that other than her but you do paint her as quite head strong and determined downright aggressive and frightful as if she is protecting or hiding something

If I was a grandmother (not yet happened) I would be very concerned how a secret child of my husband (especially if my DH's secret Child was younger than my grandchildren) was going to impact on my grandchildren

If my father had had another child that was younger than my own children I would think that the relationships between all the children was very significant^

The^ secret child from my husband/father would be my grandchildren/children's aunt even though she would be younger than them

I would hope that my husband or my father would be very worried how introducing a very young child into the family suddenly would impact on the young children already in the family

How would I explain to my own grandchildren or my own children that their grandfather (my husband or father) had suddenly got this little child in his life that was younger than them?

@CaliforniaHorcrux and @goldenrachita I completely agree with you both

Why all the random bolding RT?

Cos I found the thingy on my iPad that does different ways of posting

@RT yeh I just hope the OP won't let his fears about maintaining contact with the Polish daughter cloud his thinking and actions towards others involved especially the GC. Could be very easy to unintentionally neglect them in these circumstances through worrying about someone else. That's assuming the GC are in his life right now, I don't think he said either way

@CaliforniaHorcrux IMHO the grandchildren are very important cos they are about the same age or slightly older than the polish child if his DD or their mother is 32 then my guess is that they are sort of 12 years old and under BUT the GC are older than the polish child

So if his DD is in his life then so are her children as they are too young to have left home for uni etc,

unless they are both child prodigy and gone to uni before 17/18 or their mother was very young when they were born. Which going on his age of 68 and his wife at 60+ so they were 36 and 28+ when she was born would sort of make it less likely than if her parents were 16 and 17 when she was born iyswim

This happened to someone I know but slightly different circumstances. A child was born the father never saw that child and years later when the child was grown up she came looking for her father to find his family in mourning as he had recently passed. His wife was devestated. Their children want a relationship with this sibling but due to their mums heartbreak and refusal to accept he could have possibly had a child all those years ago that isn't going to happen. My advice is if your 100% that child is yours tell your wife and child. Yes they will be hurt and upset and may want nothing to do with that child but that is their decision to make not yours. Stop living a lie as one day they will find out and to find out the way the family mentioned did was horrendous. It's been over 4 years now and the anger is still there as he isn't around to explain himself and the daughter has been left with no one. Tell them now so they can digest everything, ask what they need to ask and meet if they decide its right for them

Needingchange

He has told his wife but not his DD or grandchildren **