Not trans, not cis. What am I?

[allaboutthecrisps]

This is a genuine thread. I will try and phrase this well and please only respond on topic. It's hardtm tobhave a respectful conversation about any gender identity topics atm but I feel it's important that we work towards that. So I've been trying to educate myself about gender identity issues. I have read around a little and explored some definitions and descriptors. I have come to the conclusion that I do not have a gender identity. This means I'm not cis as the definition of that relies on my gender identity matching my biological sex. I'm not trans as there's no sense of a mismatch either and whilst I hate my body that's not because of it's sexual characteristics. I could see a category of gender queer but that did not really talk to me either. This came up because I was completing some questionnaires which asked me to report my gender identity. If this is something we're going to be asked to do more often (and I think it is) its important to me to do this in a way which I can actually identify with. There will be people much more informed about these issues than me so can you advise what 'gender identity' someone without a gender identity can report. Ia it perhaps agender or are there other more helpful categories?

I think that for the average person, trying to be kind, gender is used as another word for sex. Look to 'gender reveal' scans, etc.

Generally those forms are trying to be inclusive, because the people who design them aren't aware of all the queer identity stuff, ime.

Usually, what they mean is, are you happy with what sex you were assigned observed at birth.

OP, I would imagine that the majority of people don’t buy this gender identity nonsense, and haven’t got one either!
It’s being driven by the woke and trendy. Gender is a meaningless pile of sexist blue and pink stereotypes.
I do not have a gender, I simply have a sex. Adult human female.
I wear trousers, have short hair, can’t stand make up or high heels, I’m a gc feminist, did science at school and spent 36 years as a hospital doctor. I’m also a mother of two, enjoy cooking, and was happily married until my DH’s untimely death.
OP, If you wish to join the woke bandwagon, pick one of the (over a hundred) ridiculous “genders”, or invent your own - unicorn? hedgehog? - and choose some matching pronouns, which you can tediously insist your colleagues use. Flounce if they don’t. There you are, job done.

And also, what @Babdoc just said.

Babdoc 👍

I also think this is normal!

I'm female, but don't strongly identify that way... A lot of my personality traits are what would be badged as masculine (dominant, direct, unemotional) but I do wear dresses/heels/make up.

I honestly don't think that if I woke up as a man/with a penis tomorrow I'd be all that upset by it. It would be a bit disorienting (but only in the same way as if I woke up tomorrow a different race or if my name had changed to Julie without my knowledge), but I don't think I would lament over the days when I used to be female.

I don't care enough about it to put a label on it, I am just a person with a vagina and my personality... And I think for that reason I really struggle to understand the position of trans people, because they obviously care about something I have little regard for.

But maybe that's my 'cis' (also don't identify as cis) privilege.

I find the comparison to religion helpful. Being told I am CIS because I am not trans makes as much sense to me as being told I must be Catholic because I am not Protestant. It's all meaningless to me because they are not belief systems to which I subscribe.

@allaboutthecrisps

I did wonder about non binary but that seems to hinge on an acceptance of the concepts of binary man and woman identies. I am describing myself as non binary but it doesn't sielt well. *@hazel* I don't have a gender identity so there's no possibility of either a match or a mismatch.

You’ve already said you don’t have a gender identity - the vast majority of people also don't have one. They are either male or female. Collecting data using gender instead of sex is very misleading, which is why it was challenged in the census. Whenever I see on online form that asks for gender instead of sex, I complete it as my sex, but also contact the organisation to point out the error they have made by not using sex as the question. Gender identity is an ideology that many do not subscribe to.

I feel similar to OP. I do not wish to be labelled cis. This is the problem with gender ideology. If gender is a spectrum then perhaps everyone is non binary and no one is cis. If gender isn't a spectrum then it is pointless and restrictive and serves no good purpose. My self concept is not highly gendered. Some of my behaviours are, as I have been socialised as a girl and woman. But my psychological sense of who I am is not at all about gender.

@username12345T

Could you be non binary OP? If you don't feel as though you are male or female and there's nothing that seems to fit, perhaps you don't conform to social stereotypes and are non binary (like most people).

Have you been to your GP to discuss this dissociation from your sex? There could be something else going on there such as Autism.

I went through something similar as a teenager as I didn't identify with stereotypical female things and I wore trousers, had short hair and wasn't into what other girls were into at school, I found it boring and I didn't relate to it at all.

I didn't ever think that I wasn't a girl but I did think that there was something wrong with me or I was the 'wrong' type of girl. As I got older, boys would call me a 'dyke' because I wasn't 'feminine' enough or didn't conform to what they perceived as feminine.

I still don't but do see myself as a woman. You say you've read a lot about this so what do you think?

The OP hasn’t said they dont feel if they are male or female. Why would they need to see a GP? ‘Hi doctor, can I have an appointment because I don't know how I feel about gender identity?’

@NiceGerbil

Options might be

Agender
Non binary
Bi gender
Aliagender
Demi gender
Gender apathetic
Feminine of centre

There are plenty more options.

I would imagine there a quizzes to help you know what gender/s may fit you.

Good luck finding a gender that encompasses you and allows you to live as your true self.

🤣🤣🤣

To think that you can take a quiz to find out what your non existent gender might be. Can’t you see just how batshit that sounds?

Hmm. Today I washed the car and jet washed the drive while DH did the ironing.

If all that drives gender is stereotypical roles then who knows what we are.

@WellIWasInTheNeighbourhoo

I decided for census purposes that I am agender, as I don't subscribe or adhere to the stereotypes associated with my sex. Although in reality I think gender critical is more accurate, but strangely that wasn't an option.

Yes there was - the option to not answer the question was available.

@Soontobe60 Follow the thread.

[quote allaboutthecrisps]@lazylinguist I'm inclined to agree with you but this is the world we're in right now. I do see myself as female. I used to see myself as a woman but I think I saw woman and adult female as the same thing but that definition seems to have changed. It sounds like ticking 'other' and adding agender might be the best way forward.[/quote]
The definition absolutely hasn’t changed, its even there in Law. It’s certain people’s use of the definition that has changed to suit their agenda.

The suggestion that someone may have autism because they don't subscribe to gender identity is really quite offensively bizarre. As is the notion that this means you are disassociated from your sex
You need to have a word with yourself, User

I don’t have a gender because I believe it to be introspective navel gazing based on stereotypes. No one has ever in my entire life asked me what my gender is (when they didn’t actually mean sex).

Therefore - I am a woman. I don’t feel ‘girly’ because my mum and eldest sister were very girly, beautiful and glam, and I never was.

@GreyhoundG1rl

The suggestion that someone may have autism because they don't subscribe to gender identity is really quite offensively bizarre. As is the notion that this means you are disassociated from your sex You need to have a word with yourself, User

Autistic people are more likely than neurotypical people to be gender diverse, several studies show, and gender-diverse people are more likely to have autism than are cisgender people

Largest study to date confirms overlap between autism and gender diversity

You don't have to tick any boxes about gender. These things that are asked about you, are just the the norm these days, to stop a lot of people getting offended about anything,or everything these days. Lots of people are going around being confused in this modern life, instead of just enjoying being who they are in their own minds.

Not subscribing to the whole nebulous concept of gender identity does not mean you are gender diverse
Please stop it.

I don't have a "gender identity" either. That doesn't mean that i'm agender, or pangender, or nonbinary, or a butterfly or a unicorn.

I'm a biological female.

@GreyhoundG1rl

Not subscribing to the whole nebulous concept of gender identity does not mean you are gender diverse Please stop it.

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

Wind your neck in.

Gender critical maybe. My view is gender as a social construct it seems is now causing more problems than good. We’re all humans. We have a biological sex and there’s no need to recognise any gender.

I'd happily ignore this tbh but in the world of online forms they don't let you. I don't want to put 'don't want to report' as I'm happy to really as long as there is a box I can identify with. The definition of woman has changed in some quarters whether we like it or not.

The definition of woman has changed in some quarters whether we like it or not.

Bollocks

@HazeyJaneII

The definition of woman has changed in some quarters whether we like it or not.

Bollocks

I'll second that.