Child sex offender

[okeydonkey]

I can't believe Im actually writing this. I found out my sister, who has two children from previous relationship, has been seeing a man who is on the child sex offenders register. He was caught downloading child porn on a work computer. My sister is saying there's a fine line and he didn't know the girls were under age. I'm sickened. AIBU to feel like she's trying to pull wool over my eyes. As he's done so with her.

Hi op, I've just seen this thread.

The fact that your DN said that things were better before seems like a major red flag (amongst all of the others). When I was a child my sister and I stayed at my dad's every weekend
weekend. Every Sunday night when it was time to go back to my mum and her 'd'p I would kick up a real fuss and get upset. I was too young to articulate why as I didn't understand fully what was going on.

You are definitely doing the right things
things. Those children need protection and I'm so glad that you're there for them. Makes me feel sick that everyone around you is minimising

I'm afraid I too question the sister's prioritizing her boyfriend over her children.

As I said above I had a friend who had been accused of child abuse and wasn't brought to court, I honestly had good reason not to believe it, but I still made sure he was never alone with my child.

It's sad for the falsely accused, but our first duty as parents is to our children.

You can technically DL those images on accident, IF he was on a torrent site and a zip file was labeled as something else. But, the police would have found what he was trying to download and how long, how often he accessed those images.

More importantly, how did he DL porn in the first place on a work computer? Most of those sites are blocked. He'd have to be on a pretty obscure site to get around those, or he disabled the firewall to deliberately DL those images.

But, as someone else has said, a CP distributor won't just willy nilly distribute these to an average Joe. Too much risk of getting caught. No one would just slip those images in to a file where there was a risk of a user contacting the police.

It was deliberate. There's no way around it.

You should have told the police you that you did feel your nephew was in danger. If he's a pedophile, he IS in danger. You are taking the right steps though. In the mean time keep a line of contact open between you and your nephew and keep an eye out for anything troubling he talks about.

If the police find something troubling, they can remove DN from the home and put him in custody with xDP where he'll be safe (even if his father is an ass).

I agree with everyone who's said you're definitely not overreacting OP. Level 4 images are horrific - I have seen some for work and there is no way you "accidentally" download them, nor is there any way that he would be prosecuted for images where it was unclear if the person was underage or not.

A suspended sentence is not unusual for downloading images because it provides the offender with the opportunity / requirement to participate in sex offender programmes, which can help. It is not an indication that the offending wasn't serious.

It sounds like you've spoken to the Lucy Faithfull Foundation (Stop It Now) and I'm surprised they weren't better, they're usually very good.

I would also try CEOP. ceop.police.uk

You are doing the right thing by intervening. Don't necessarily blame your sister though; these men can be very persuasive and charming. When that spell is broken she will almost certainly be horrified with herself for being so easily manipulated.

I wish I could say more but I'm worried about over sharing etc.

He accessed the images remotely, so was a work computer but from outside of work.

Boomerang made great points.

Would it be possible to retract your 'no' to the police?

I can't see how you'd be able to say whether there was immediate danger or not... And the way your sister is behaving makes me very worried indeed. She won't protect her children will she? Especially after making this big song and dance about how innocent he is and how mean you are... She won't want to admit an error of judgement, and believe me, people do the most extraordinary and awful things to justify their previous actions.

Sorry, I know you're in a very difficult position with your sister and mother as it is

these wouldn't have been "slipped in" to the adult package - it doesn't work like that: why would the distributor do that

Exactly, because anyone distributing legal adult porn would not want to be caught selling (as I don't think it is available with out payment) illegal images of children being abused, and as bad as level 4 too. There is NO way level 4 images were in with an adult package.

Distributors of adult porn would not want to get prosecuted for supplying indecent images of children. For whatever we think of those making/distributing adult porn, there are a far far cry form the depraved people making & selling indecent images of children.

And whoever said 'why pay for adult porn' is spot on. There is pretty much anything you could imagine - and I mean adult porn wise - available for FREE on the net, why spend money on it?

The police would have gone into the work computer and looked at exactly what he was doing. In order to convict him they would have proven that he deliberately accessed these images and probably on more than one occasion. Despite what he says you don't get convicted on accidentally stumbling across abuse images

A suspended sentence means the court found him guilty

^This, this, a hundred time this!!!

He accessed the images remotely, so was a work computer but from outside of work.

He was remotely controlling the pc at work from his pc at home?

Because if so, he would have had to disable functions on the work pc & gathered info inc IP addresses to gain access to the pc.

I had to have a friend remotely access my pc, from his. I am in Australia, he UK. I had to go through several steps (changing permissions etc) before he was able to log in. I also had to give him various details to be able to do so.

So, in order to be able to download these images, he would have had to jump through several hoops to do so.

Therefore, I would be very surprised if it was accidental, and coupled with the other info on this thread, especially how he was found guilty etc, points to him being a big fat liar, who has sucked your sister in. So it would have been very premeditated.

Even if it were a work laptop, it still shows intent was there, as otherwise he would have used his own pc, no?

I can't see how you'd be able to say whether there was immediate danger or not.

I think it was because op said her ds isn't seeing the guy for several days, but I can't find that comment now.

I think remotely is he can access the images on a computer in another house but provided for by work. So he can check emails files etc at home, but he just downloaded his sick images.

I've woken up feeling sick trying not to heave. Id say that's anxiety feeling.
I'm reeling that she's down played it all. And that I'm reacting like a daily mail reader, I think that's so nasty considering the views we both share on daily mail. My DP doesn't want anything to do with him or our child to have anything to do with him.

Good point by a previous poster.

A person pays for adult porn pictures from a company.

Company includes child abuse pictures- level 4.

Person looks at pictures finds level 4 picture.

Person calls police reports company. Person does not buy more porn from said company as person is disgusted. Company may be prosecuted/shut down (depending on where it is in the world I guess).

Surely the company would not cause trouble for itself and ruin potential profit.

More likely version: company sells child abuse pics cunningly placed in a file with adult pics so 'if you are caught' you can say oops poor old me I was a porn addict and accidentally downloaded these images with some adult porn.

Q. Why didn't he report these pics to the police when he stumbled across them? Level 4 images and he didn't report. This alone tells you far too much about this perverted man. After other posters telling me what a level 4 contains I think I would have vomited on seeing them. Yet this nice kind caring chappy just left them on a work PC and didn't think to ring the police. Amazing.

could someone let me know what EA is short for? (with ref to sisters ex partner)

I'm reeling that she's down played it all. Please remember though, that she has been groomed too. She has been taken in so much by him, so try not to be too mad at her, she will need you when she comes out the other end.

EA - Emotional abuse

Emotional Abuse, sleeps - which unfortunately may mean that OP's DN's father is not a great potential carer either. Possibly helps to explain how OP's sister has ended up with such faulty boundaries.

OP - I am very glad for your DN's sake that you are pursuing this. I hope that my relatives would be equally dedicated to my children's welfare if I ever took such leave of my senses.

I also think that it might help you make headway with your sister if you take care to avoid appearing as if you think she is foolish or neglectful (however much you - and we - may think it). It may make her entrench herself in her position, because she doesn't want to admit she's made a second big mistake (after her abusive ex).

Concentrating on the approach that her "D"P is a wily, manipulative liar, who is doing everything he can to get her and her child in his clutches might be better - to make her feel that you see her as a resourceful, strong woman who can step away and outwit such attempts.

Failing that, though, it may well have to be a report to police/SS that you think DN is in danger.

emotional abuse!
thanks just couldn't figure that one out..

The greatest monsters hide in plain sight, manipulating those around them, the fact your sis and mum are defending him demonstrates that.
Jimmy Saville wouldn't have gotten away with his crimes if he hadn't been convincing and an expert manipulator to those around him.
The fact that your are making noise about this and showing you see him for what he is and you aren't going away will hopefully drive him away.
I think a calm conversation with your sister about recent high profile cases and their 'stories' might help her see the similarities to her own situation.

ask her what makes this guy so great? then when she says this man is best partner she's had, attentive, helpful, really what she has always wanted makes her feel special and loved...
then show her this thread; show her we want to protect her as well as her children from this manipulating monster.

Okeydonkey I just wanted to say that you are actually my new hero!! I think you are an amazing aunt and I can only hope that if for any reason I lost all my senses, developed cat shit for brains and allowed someone like this near my son that one of my relatives would step up and do exactly what you are doing. Your actions are what family is all about, forget brithdays cards, family squabbles, weddings and all that, family is about being there in times of need and you are well and truely stepping up to the plate for your nephew. I just hope that one day he gets a chance to thank you.

We're all behind you 100%!

Oh and as different pointed out, in order to access his remote desktop through the work intranet system he would still have to go through normal logging on processes and therefore go through the firewall. I do this from the Uk to Australia (do we know each other different!). Once in he could then surf the net using the works internet browser but would have to disable the security settings to access dodgy sites that the firewall would alert the user to.

This makes me think that he was very naively trying to cover his tracks, it's possible he thought that by using the works internet connection they wouldn't be able to tell who was looking at the sites, whereas if he did it in his own connection it could be traced back. This is very naive because as he discovered any techie would be able to track down who was logged on and accessing what through the user log.

I was thinking about his so called cover story of trying to get fired by accessing these images, not only is this ridiculous and laughable, but it also suggests that he is unsuitable to be around other people's children due his cavalier attitude to the welfare of children. What a complete tool!

Oh and your sister using that daily mail comment, either that is his dig being repeated or she knew that would rile you and is lashing out. It's possible deep down she knows this is wrong but doesn't want to admit she is putting her child at risk or making bad choices and is therefore getting very defensive.

You are on the right path keep going.

Please remember though, that she has been groomed too. She has been taken in so much by him, so try not to be too mad at her, she will need you when she comes out the other end.

She's a grown ass adult. Let's not infantalize her. She knows he's a sex offender, she has still let him near her child. She chose to continue seeing this man. Not one is twisting her arm here.

If worst case scenario happens and he does rape/molest her child she can (and should!) be charged with gross negligence for allowing a known sex offender near her children. Just like a mother can and should be charged with gross negligence for allowing a physically abusive boyfriend around her children if they get hurt. Her job is to protect her children, and she's fucked it up right now. You have every right to be furious with her.

Turning a blind eye to an abuser is just as monstrous as the abuse itself, and she can't claim ignorance on this like some mothers can.

If something happens to your nephew, she should never be forgiven for it, and you shouldn't have to feel obligated to forgive her or even cut her a break. She doesn't deserve one.

Thanks for all the posts of encouragement.
I had a call earlier than expected by the disclosure place. Spoke to a sergeant.
He asked me a few more questions eg has my child been in his care. I said no. Has he been with my child on his own. I said no.
He said he can't disclose his information. I said what about my right to protect my Sis children. He said my sister would have a full disclosure on him for him to be near her children.
He asked me what she had told me. Then I told him. Then he said yes she's told you everything. So he was nice in disclosing to me but without saying it iyswim.
I then asked what's your opinion on him possibly manipulating her he said he didn't know. I said what about him saying he downloaded as a package. He said we have other departments for that. He was so kind and helpful even though he wasn't able to disclose.
He said if he ever looks after my child on his own then call him back as that's when it's the problem.

So my conclusion is he's a manipulating bastard, but under law he doesn't seem a threat if he's not got my child on his own with him and isn't a threat with my sis children, but probably can't see them on his own. So its sick really that this is even intertwined into my family regardless of level if risk etc.

That's incredibly harsh, Squiggly

Remember, this woman has come our of an emotionally abusive relationship, and was obviously vulnerable. This man has totally groomed her, sensing a weakness, and he's prayed on her. That's what men like him do. He will have talked the talk, made her feel comfortable, then dependant. She wouldn't be able to see the wood for the trees. He has and will minimise what he did. He certainly wouldn't have told her the full truth. He will have said that he's ok because he didn't get sent to prison so he's not dangerous. Perhaps she didn't or doesn't know what exactly being a schedule one offender means.

Has she been stupid? Incredibly. Nieve? Hell yes.

I personally think that she doesn't realise just how serious this is, I think that when she's faced with the prospect of her child being put on the CPR as at risk of Sexual Abuse, she may start to twig on.

OP, there's was a thread on the relationships board recently about a woman who found out her husband was a schedule one offender. It's probably a few pages down now, but have a read of it. You'll see how someone who is vulnerable can be groomed. You can see the level of deceit these men will go to. It might even be an idea to let your sister read that thread - then she can see for herself how her life may turn out if she doesn't end this relationship now.

I think you're amazing, OP. You're handling this really well.

okey the way I'd understand that is that the man has a SOPO (Sexual Offences Prevention Order) attached to him preventing him from being by himself with a child - so yes he absolutely is regarded as a threat.

Unfortunately the law is reactive not proactive so unless he breaches the SOPO (by being with a child alone) there may be little the police can do.

I think squiggly might be American, where the concept of rehabilitation is about as popular as the concept of banning firearms. In the UK we follow the idea that "the law exists to civilise our emotions of revenge." In the US they elect their judiciary, based as far as I can tell on who promises the best vengeance. [tongue in cheek] Seriously though we don't have the same law of gross negligence here, although there is an offence of 'failure to protect' a child from cruelty or neglect.

But Okey, you said he'd told your sister he's allowed to be around children but that's not strictly true and sounds like he's gilding the lily a bit.

He's only allowed to be around children but not to be alone with them by the sounds of it.

Have you actually spoken to social services?
The police can do the disclosure to your sister but if he's not breaking the terms of his licence then they can't do anything. However, social services can look at his offences and potentially do some work with your sister and her children if they are concerned that they are vulnerable/that he is grooming/etc.