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Original poster

I have smacked my child and can't see how I could avoid it... tell me how awful I am

199 replies

Fastasleep · 28/01/2006 20:55

This is sort of a confession of a post, because some people (not many!) might still think I'm a 'goodmum'... but I just felt like I had to say that I've smacked my 23 month old on more than one ocassion, and I probably will again...

I can't seem to help it, it seems like a completely natural reaction and it happens before I even think - I smacked him yesterday on the back of his head, not hard, but a smack, as he sunk his teeth into my arm and drew blood... I've also smacked him forcefully 'off' his baby sister as her scratched at her eyes (he cut her eyeball, I know that's no excuse but still)... I'd like to say I always use the naughty chair, and in 95% of incidents I do, but the times when I don't it happens before my brain even engages.... I don't know how I'm meant to not do it!

Am I a terrible parent who needs anger management? I'm a calmish person...

OP posts:
Mercy · 29/01/2006 12:55

That's great cod! I've been trying to find a way of not responding with 'because I said so' - I'll try the teacher version from now on.

freshstart · 29/01/2006 12:57

so do you dish out a punishment on the third go then?

codnotmud · 29/01/2006 13:11

well not a punichsment but say ds2 was takign a long time to turn off the tv
id go adn turn it of and have a shapr word

or say ds3 wodulnt put his hsoes on to go to school id whisk him up briskly and put hem onhim tellgn him what he did wrong - he woudl knwo i was cross

it it wer major - say... ds1 was irritating ds2 ( not very often really) id sned him to his room

Surfermum · 29/01/2006 13:17

You are scaring me now Cod. I'm like that. I thought I was a laid back surfermum. Letting dd know I'm cross definitely works for us, I hardly ever shout but a change in my tone of voice works.

blueshoes · 29/01/2006 13:41

Hi edam, sorry about your dd's experience. I don't agree with ignoring. If my child does something wrong, she needs to know that, on-the-spot and as many times as it takes if she does it repeatedly. So if dd was hurting another, I'd be over there in a flash to intervene, pull her away, telling her it is wrong, comfort the other child and when things have calmed down, repeat to dd it was wrong and make her apologise. If she does it again, I'd probably warn her that another incident would mean we would go home, and carry out the threat. Ideally accomplished without (too much) shouting, time outs, bribes, certainly no smacking. Even if dd does not apologise, I won't make a big deal but would pointedly apologise on her behalf to the victim and victim's parent in her presence. I am not a fan of ignoring bad behaviour.

But I do agree with bakajimjams that if the bad behaviour goes on for a long time (I mean many many months) or gets worse, then it is time to re-examine your approach.

blueshoes · 29/01/2006 13:43

arghhh, ignore that last post. Pooter double-posting again!

FioFio · 29/01/2006 13:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

nailpolish · 29/01/2006 13:53

i have to say

smacking is allowed in this country apart from:

smacking that leaves a bruise/mark

or

smacking on the head

the above are not allowed (illegal?)

i smack mine i have to say, but only on the hand. ime shouting/shrieking extremely loudly works better. i feel idiotic smacking. have images in my head of mothers dangling children by the hand in the air and whacking bottoms.

always feel i have to apologise to dd after a smack, nut not after shouting. and dds hit each other, am scared they get that 'wrong message' thing "do as i say not as i do"

nailpolish · 29/01/2006 13:53

but not

blueshoes · 29/01/2006 14:07

Hey cod, your 3 step "say, warn, do" is something I agree with. But I do choose my battles and would only use it for the non-negotiables like aggression, getting ready for nursery, bedtime, running onto the street. As scummy says, anything short of bottomline is fluid - like can I have a biscuit, and another one? Can I play with water (messy)? Can mummy come to the kitchen with me and watch me spread jam on my bread? ok, my dd is clearly younger than yours - and I have a lot to learn.

I don't think it is rude for children to ask for something which might be slightly naughty or to protest, even tantrum (for younger children), if the request is not granted because it is an non-negotiable boundary. It is inappropriate, but not rude. Kids are just learning to manage their emotions and rely on their parents for support and guidance. Just like they are learning when it is appropriate to push for what they want and when they have to toe the line (like in school). But to meet a request with a "no, because mummy said so" (not saying you do that) is not teaching them anything. Hypocrisy has a way of biting one in the arse when children are old enough to reason for themselves.

Don't know about boys and girls but dd is not known to take "no" for an answer. The nursery tells me my dd "knows her mind". My dilemma - crush her spirit? or accept and celebrate her persistence? All we can do as parents is work with what we are given.

codnotmud · 29/01/2006 14:25

totally agree

but soemotimes endless explaingin can push you to smak i cna imagien wher a firm no ( no reason given) in some heated situations is the best
not saying mine is the best wasy o fbrinignup kids but it works here

blueshoes · 29/01/2006 14:35

oh yes, cod. Non-negotiable means just that. No is NO!

morningpaper · 29/01/2006 14:42

Blueshoes: "experience with negotiating with parents puts children a good stead for negotiating the slings and arrows of the big bad world."

TOTALLY disagree with this

Negotiating as an adult has nothing to do with how your parents disciplined you. It's primarily a business or relationship skill. That's like saying you are helping them to be good at Accountancy. Adults learn negotiating as they mature (hopefully). It's nothing to do with whether mummy is a bit soft on you when you don't want to share Horsey with Archie

codnotmud · 29/01/2006 14:43

always thought archie was a perv

magnolia1 · 29/01/2006 15:24

I have 4 girls and to be honest they all know that NO means No and wouldn't dream of negotiating!!

The 10 year old has started to try it and really doesn't like going to bed at 7pm so its stopped now

blueshoes · 29/01/2006 15:26

oh yes, cod. Non-negotiable means just that. No is NO!

satine · 29/01/2006 15:57

IME too much negotiating is as bad as no dicipline at all. There is a 5 year old boy in our village who up until recently was an only child and quite indulged. Everything was negotiated, from bedtime to what he ate, so he's now reacting badly to a new sibling. He recently bit my son so hard that he left teeth shaped bruises through a jumper and thick coat, yet his parents' reaction was to "have a talk" with him. He knows fine well that if I'm around, no means no but with his parents, a bit of "Oh go on" will get him what he's after.

getbakainyourjimjams · 29/01/2006 16:04

ha I think I am Scummy. "that was no an option" is one of my favourite phrases. Along with, "no the choice was banana or nothing, biscuits are not an option", but that's what I call negotiating, maybe others meant something different.

In the case of ds1's challenging behaviours, I don't expect strangers to respond appropriately, but ds1 is never left unsupervised around strangers so I would be there to ensure the behaviour was dealt with. I do get extremely pissed off if despite countless explanations adults continue to respond inappropriately (MIL and teachers at ms school) yelling and squawking every time he pinches as I'm the one left to deal with the consequences of that reaction (he doesn't really go for children, but if he did I would expect them to yell- it bloody hurts- be he wouldn't be more than 2 inches from my side so hopefully wouldn't happen).

getbakainyourjimjams · 29/01/2006 16:04

sorry ms = mainstream school, forgot I wasn't on SN.

blueshoes · 29/01/2006 16:12

Right, ignore that last double-post! Computer acting up again.

Morningpaper, negotiating requires self-confidence as a pre-requisite. And whether a child is self-confident is partly innate, but a lot has to do with the way that child is parented. Studies show that how children perceive themselves depends on how their parents view them. And what better affirmation of the child's worth than the fact that their parents will (within limits) listen to and carefully consider what the child says.

If a perfectly reasonably request from a child is met with "no" because it happened to be inconvenient for the parent at that time (and I know I do refuse requests on a knee-jerk basis), that does not instill confidence, IMO. If my dd can get me to re-consider in those circumstances, that is power to her.

The home is the place where children cut their teeth. It is a safe microcosm of the outside world, which is much less forgiving. dd will learn that whinging only winds mummy up, a smile and polite "please" will get her further. Approaching mummy when she is not busy is also better. In your example, if dd did not want to share horsey with archie, what about telling her to offer archie a doggie instead and see how that goes? That is learning basic negotiation within the confines of the home.

I am not of course suggesting that dd will learn how to negotiate a technical software contract but it could give her the gumption and skills to ask for a raise. As an adult I know I sometimes take "no" or bad service as given. But to turn a "no" into an "ok" is a real gift.

I am

FrannyandZooey · 29/01/2006 16:39

I don't personally feel comfortable teaching ds that adults are always right and he must follow all instructions without question. Does anyone else feel concerned at the potential for harm if their child unthinkingly follows every adult command? Adults, like everyone else, should be respected and spoken to politely, of course, but if someone tells you to do something you feel is wrong, you should protest. Like other people on this thread I have a "special" tone of voice I use when I really need him to obey NOW. Otherwise, annoying though it may be, I prefer to encourage independence of thought and emerging negotiation skills to unquestioning obedience at all times.

I think.

colditz · 29/01/2006 16:43

I don't want unqustioning obedience in the face of unreasonable orders, but who is a toddler to judge what is an unreasonable order, and what is a sensible request?

With a 3 year old, a kind request to put his shoes on can be met with more screaming than a shouted order to walk into the road in front of a car, hypothetically...

You see what I mean.

ScummyMummy · 29/01/2006 16:50

Hmm. Not sure I wholly agree with your examples, blueshoes.

What if Archie really wants the horse? Is it reasonable for him to be palmed off with the dog? And is that true sharing?

And if your vision of a super confident adult secure in the knowledge that she has the skils to influence others should come to pass, might she then feel crushed emotionally when, occasionally, the raise is refused or her opinion does not prevail? I would guess that's a bit of a danger if kids are always able to argue their parents round (I realise your dd isn't able to do this from your posts btw- am just playing devils advocate a bit.)

Mercy · 29/01/2006 17:01

'If a perfectly reasonably request from a child is met with "no" because it happened to be inconvenient for the parent at that time (and I know I do refuse requests on a knee-jerk basis), that does not instill confidence, IMO. If my dd can get me to re-consider in those circumstances, that is power to her.'

Afraid I don't really agree with this approach. On a very basic level children have to learn to wait their turn, that's partly what negotiation is about. I can't see how a refusal for immediate attention can be seen as detrimental to a child's confidence (unless it happens a lot).

codnotmud · 29/01/2006 17:02

i d steer arhcie back to miss hoolie