Does anyone else feel like the Islamophobia on Mumsnet has ramped up in recent days?

[ForestFawn]

There have been several faux innocent threads started which have given posters the opportunity to be open in their Islamophobia. It’s truly depressing to read.

Sorry - in that case she should challenge it with MNHQ - there's no other reason it could have been deleted

Hiya,

Muslim lady here :) Both have modest guidelines! Men are told to lower their gaze too, they are responsible for treat women with respect. But just like any other religion, religious people are not perfect and you get silly people in every religion!

No one should be persecuted based on their religion or any other personal factor, but there needs to be a discussion about how some religions and cultures have some elements that aren't compatible with western society. For example, many religions and cultures including Islam and islamic societies are inherently homophonic and sexist. How can we protect one group without harming another? This is a real discussion that needs space.

I've reported the thread and basically said allowing it to stand feels like Mumsnet is allowing Islamophobia to spread.

Based on their response to me earlier, it’s clear that’s their intention.

That was an awful response from them.

One poster literally said they don't mind being called Islamaphobic and dislikes A lot of Isam and I got this response

Thanks for this report. Could we ask you to clarify exactly what it is that you find Islamophobic?

I'm not Muslim so please forgive me for posting on this board, but I wanted to show some solidarity and support.

The Islamophobia on these boards has been terrible recently and I have been really depressed to read so many horrible, prejudiced posts. I just wanted to say that there are many, many non-Muslims who don't share those negative views. Please do keep reporting each and every Islamophobic post/ thread... you should not have to tolerate it.

We have been reporting. Mumsnet have made it clear they intend to allow it continue.

Now replace Muslims with Jews and let’s see how long they allow such hate to stay up.

I am very sorry to hear that. I think the only solution is for more of us to report and to keep on pushing until they get sick of dealing with it.

@MNHQ, please would you comment on this? Why is it that Islamophobic posts are being allowed to stand?

I think people are allowed to say they dislike all religions though and that is not islamophobic and is not a breach of MN rules. More than half the UK does not believe in any kind of God at all and I believe they are allowed to set out why religion is a bad thing (in their opinion). They are even allowed to say they wish the UK would become 100% atheist.

@Xenia the problem is the contents of the posts. Anyone can say they don't like religion in general. But when you start cherry picking things and calling us all sorts of things and saying we are x, y and z. That's when things get eyebrow raising.

Now imagine that thread said Judaism.or Jews. It would have been deleted within seconds! And so it should, but anything about us, is kept up and encouraged.

On another post I reported they see now problem with it at all 🙄

But people are allowed to have opinions that vary. For example I love movies but dislike romance and action movies. If I had to choose one I dislike more, it'd be romance. People can say I dislike religion and I dislike this particular religion more than others. It's freedom of speech. Obviously verbal abuse is another matter and no one should be abusing anyone, but people are allowed to express their opinion on things. It isn't the same as abuse.

Did you not read what I said? We get called all sorts of horrible things. Not the same as comparing film genres. You can like or dislike religions. No problem. But when you start a hate campaign on a forum, you must understand why people feel targeted and upset?

You didn't comment on this part.... If the thread was changed to jews. Would you still agree it was a good thread and should be allowed?

Just chiming in with my support, I'm not a Muslim but I completely recognise what OP is describing. Between the rampant islamophobia, ableism and homophobia I don't think I can be here any more, I have enough bigots in my real life without spending time with them online too.

It's because people can hide behind an anonymous name and a keyboard and there's no accountability.

Those threads are utterly disgraceful. I honestly have no words. But please don't go down the whole "if it were about Jews it'd be deleted" route because it's simply not true. There have been plenty of blatant anti-Semitic posts and threads allowed. We're equally hated, often by the same people 🙃

I've been impressed with how the OP and other posters on the second thread have stood up for themselves though! It's just a shame no one is bothering to listen to what's being said. Unsurprising, but still a shame.

As always, solidarity to you all for the often blatant hate speech you're having to endure 🥴

I agree that abuse of any kind is unacceptable, but I don't agree that people shouldn't be allowed to say they don't like religion or its effects on society.
I don't like religion, and there are some I dislike more than others, because they tend to be more aggressively homophonic and sexist than others. Most religions are about pandering to men and the feelings of men, indeed this is why most gods and prophets are depicted as a man. In countries where the government is closely tied with religion, the populations suffer with more unnecessary conflicts and/or wars, women are frequently denied an education and/or equal rights, animal abuse runs riot and homosexual people are freely abused and/or killed. This is not something I agree with and certainly not something I want to see replicated in the UK. I am free to have that opinion and express it, because in the UK freedom of speech is allowed, unlike soke countries which again are governed in more religious ways.

I give up. We aren't disagreeing with you. But its not people just saying they don't like religion. Its people twisting things to suit a narrative. Those who haven't actually looked up what they are actually spouting and going off made up media ideology. And not listening to those of different faiths are saying is actually true in their religion.

I don't really think Islam is sexist. Some people who are Muslim are sexist. Some cultures and trends which identify as being within the umbrella of Islam are sexist. That's the same for all religions and societies though. You wouldn't necessarily say Christianity is incompatible with Western society because some people and cultures within the umbrella of Christianity are sexist.

Islam does have within its guidance recognition that there are differences between men and women. Difference is not inferiority or superiority, it's just difference. People have different physiologies, different inherent risks and vulnerabilities.

Many religions have teachings and viewpoints about homosexuality etc which are not consistent with what is acceptable today. Much of the negativity around Islam in this area stems from the accounts of the experiences of Lut (pbuh). In the Qur'an, he challenged men who were engaging in a number of socially questionable practices such as rape. It isn't actually explicitly stated that the issue was to do with homosexuality, although that has been a commonly held interpretation. There is a valid perspective that in fact the issue was that the men challenged were forcing others into sexual acts against their will, through rape and other forms of sexual assault. Many people hold the view that, as with other matters of sexuality, the most important thing is to ensure that people are engaging in safe, sane and consensual practices, and the majority view in Islam is that it should be within marriage.

I do think that the topic of religion is used by some people to be abusive and that's not acceptable. But many people can see that religions of all kinds, and some religions more than others, cause huge problems for many people around the world. Many people dislike it and believe most people would be better off without it. Indeed, many people from more religious countries move to places like the UK where they enjoy the freedoms of benefits that come from living in a less religious society.

I am sure that on an individual level, one person's practice of a religion can look very different to the negative effects of religion on a societal level, but that doesn't stop it from being a problem.

Again. Fine... its people commenting and making assumptions because they haven't educated themselves. No one is saying they have to like or agree with religions. It's the made up facts and uproar on things they have no understanding of.

Scriptures can be interpreted in many ways and I'm sure individuals might have their own interpretations. But it is naive to suggest that women in some more religious countries (Islamic or otherwise) have rights and freedoms that are comparable with the UK, or that homosexuals in such countries have the rights and freedoms of those in the UK. It simply isn't true and it's disingenuous to argue otherwise.

Also what you might interpret as rights and freedom could be very different to what we interpret as rights and freedom...