The random comment men

[brokenbiscuitsx]

You know the ones, not the ‘leery car shouters’ but those who feel they can make comments about what you, a stranger, is doing when going about their business (and I’ll add not harming anyone!)

Just now I popped to the shop to collect a parcel, when I was there I grabbed a coffee from their Costa pod and a blueberry muffin. The man behind me piped up “You’ll get fat eating that” I was really taken aback so just said “thanks for your comment, random man” paid and then as I was walking out past him he said, no need to be so rude and mumbled ‘stroppy cow’ but I heard.

I wasn’t rude I just asserted myself and that is the issue isn’t it. He was expecting me to laugh along ‘oh I already am tee hee’ (I’m not) but no, I’m sick of it.

It happens too often as well. I have had a random man comment on how I could run better in the park when I was having a break and a man who saw my Led Zeppelin tshirt and said ‘what’s your favourite song then?’ So I said ‘Heartbreaker- you probably haven’t heard of it’ and he mumbled something at me and walked off (I knew he was trying to catch me out, hoping I didn’t know any songs!)

I don’t really know what my AIBU is, I guess, is it rude? Should I have just smiled sweetly like the passive woman I am meant to be. I’m just sick of these types of men! He took offence with me speaking up, perhaps he should learn not to make comments to random strangers.

Does anyone else get this, maybe I have that sort of face that men can’t help commenting to. If so, how do you cope with it?

Just, ugh, makes me angry.

While some women would prefer no random interactions, as as been pointed out repeatedly on this thread, the point is that men are constantly making judgements and/or forcing their opinions about what women should be doing/wearing/thinking on us for no reason. And then, when we complain, we're told "I'm just being friendly" or we're accused of being aggressive or stroppy or hysterical (my personal favourite).

@Battleneck you might not mean to do it but you are doing exactly that. You are coming on here and accusing us of not understanding your intention.l We don't need to know your intention. We just know that you are saying things that are explicitly telling us we are wrong to feel or think the way we do.

As a confident, sometimes a bit clueless, woman, I, for example, have never minded a casual (not sexual) comment from a male colleague along lines of, "you look nice today". In pretty much every case where that might have happened, the man is a colleague and friend and I know he is commenting in a perfectly pleasant way.

However, while I don't instinctively "get it" I have listened to other women who say it makes them uncomfortable, that even if they know the man doesn't mean it sexually, it causes them to question how that man views them. As a result, I would tell any man in a professional setting not to say such things even though not all women would find it unpleasant.

This is NOT the same as saying that no male colleague should ever speak to a female colleague (ala Mike Pence).

@Battleneck this is the part you seem too struggle with and you need to get over it. Listen, hear all these women's stories, and respect it. It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree. Just think about whether a man forcing conversation on a woman is ever innocuous from her perspective.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe

I get the feeling that you're rather enjoying all the attention on you, Battleneck, why else would you be on the thread going on and on?

I think, you've posted something salient here:
Is anyone here saying that men should do their absolute best to never speak to female strangers?
Yes, do this. For men that wilfully misunderstand, it's a good start. Keep doing just that.

I can't believe how patient the responses to you have been.

Yep I agree!

For men who clearly can’t comprehend the difference between a friendly hello and a demeaning comment. They should definitely just never speak to women at all. Do us all a favour.

@BrightYellowDaffodil

My confusion arises from the numerous comments which suggest that many women are completely on edge from the moment a man opens his mouth, however innocent what they say is. Whilst I understand that sharing experiences is a valid and reasonable thing to do, I am a typical man, more interested in solutions than feelings.

Jesus fucking wept, how many more times? We don't need your validation as to what is "valid and reasonable". We don't want your solutions, we have those for ourselves and they're all the way through this thread if you cared to read and digest rather than leap in with your opinions.

It seems to me that we all agree

Stand down ladies! We've got a man here to run the show, facilitate the discussion points and clarify the decision points. Thank fuck for that!

I am just confused why so many people are having a go at me when everyone seems to agree with me that men shouldn't be knobs, shouldn't be threatening, but are allowed to say the odd bit of innocent chit chat in passing in a bakery queue!

I think if you can’t tell the difference between being
“random comment man”
and
“Random man initiating polite conversation about an appropriate subject with a willing participant who happens to be female”

then it probably is best to stay quiet.

It strikes me OP that in your example and in pp's about a man in a charity shop, the man was standing behind you, in a queue, in a shop.

Maybe it's just about time and opportunity but I also see something about status here. Man in shop (mundane shopping = women's work), having to wait behind a woman. Man in such a low-status situation feels the need to assert that he is still the important person here, the one who knows best, can put silly/uppity women in their place, top of this lowly pile.

Of course medium and high status men also assert status all the time, both blatantly and subtly, in medium and high status situations!

Battleneck. I talk to people all the time. I don't make people feel uncomfortable because in general it is clear whether someone wants to talk or not and I don't really need to be mindful of what I say because it wouldn't occur to me to say something about someone's appearance or mood or whatever. That isn't polite conversation with strangers

I think it's clear from on here that there are quite a few people who's experience is such that they'd rather forego the possibility of a nice interaction in expectation of an unpleasant one. It's a real shame, but it's understandable going by alot of the reported experiences on this thread. And it's not their fault they've ended up thinking like that

@Battleneck

Is anyone here saying that men should do their absolute best to never speak to female strangers? It seems to me that many are implying this, but maybe they're not.

Maybe it would be worth thinking about why it seems that way to you. Nobody has said it. Everybody has given clear examples of what kind of contact is unwelcome. Whenever you have suggested it, posters have tried to explain the difference between 'general chit chat' and 'unwanted commentary'. Yet you are still claiming to believe that we don't want any man to talk to us ever.

I, personally, have addressed several posts to you by way of explaining. But you keep asking the same questions and implying that the women posting on here are making outrageous demands. In fact, none of us are. We aren't asking for anything - just commiserating with one another about how shit it is.

I will attempt an analogy:

You and your friends all support the same football team. They lose. You all commiserate with one another. A rugby fan comes along and starts trying to talk about rugby.

You say 'we're not talking about rugby, we're talking about football.'

They say 'but in rugby, you're allowed to touch the ball with your hands.'

You say 'that's not what happened in the match we're talking about'

They say 'we know you can touch the ball with your hands in rugby, but that's not really relevant - the rules of rugby are different, and not what we're talking about. Please stop trying to bring the conversation around to rugby, we really only want to talk about football.'

They say 'Oh, I see - you want to ban rugby do you? Why don't you want anyone to play rugby?'

And then, throughout the conversation, they keep coming over and saying 'I just don't understand why you don't like rugby and why you are trying to stop people from playing rugby'.

It's not a perfect analogy, but its roughly akin to what you have done on this thread.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe

I get the feeling that you're rather enjoying all the attention on you, Battleneck, why else would you be on the thread going on and on?

I think, you've posted something salient here:
Is anyone here saying that men should do their absolute best to never speak to female strangers?
Yes, do this. For men that wilfully misunderstand, it's a good start. Keep doing just that.

I can't believe how patient the responses to you have been.

Battleneck. Read that post.
You have demonstrated a complete lack of comprehension, no emotional intelligence and a scarily rapey attitude towards women.

You are the type of Random Man we are complaining about in this thread.

So, for three avoidance of doubt - you should not speak to female strangers because you do not have the necessary brain filter.
Other men can use their intelligence to decide what to say to who and when.

@IsItAKindofDream

(3) some women will sometimes feel uncomfortable and / or annoyed that their day has been interrupted by random men who are not knobs and who are not threatening and violent, but there is nothing we can or should do about that.

Not worried about making women feel uncomfortable?
How rapey does that sound?

Still, it’s a great example of how men really think it is all about them, don’t bother listening and always try to have the last word, even when it is obvious their input is not wanted.

I am worried about making women feel uncomfortable, hence I am on a thread learning about what makes women uncomfortable.

We all agree that men should not be threatening knobs.

The confusion seems to be related to those women who seem to dislike all chit chat, perhaps because they have better things to do or because they are immediately on edge that chit chat could turn nasty.

The two solutions are "no chit chat" or "some women will have to learn to live with feeling a bit uncomfortable as a result of chit chat from men who are not knobs and not being threatening". No chit chat has been ruled out, which leaves some women to have to deal with the odd bit of innocent chit chat.

I have no concept of how making a woman uncomfortable despite doing nothing wrong is "rapey"

@TiredButDancing

While some women would prefer no random interactions, as as been pointed out repeatedly on this thread, the point is that men are constantly making judgements and/or forcing their opinions about what women should be doing/wearing/thinking on us for no reason. And then, when we complain, we're told "I'm just being friendly" or we're accused of being aggressive or stroppy or hysterical (my personal favourite).

@Battleneck you might not mean to do it but you are doing exactly that. You are coming on here and accusing us of not understanding your intention.l We don't need to know your intention. We just know that you are saying things that are explicitly telling us we are wrong to feel or think the way we do.

I am not telling anyone that they are wrong to feel how they do. Thanks you for giving me the opportunity to correct your misunderstanding.

Battleneck still unable to grasp the fact that his manly existence and manly thoughts aren't solving all our sad lady problems, despite his many honest and honourable and manly efforts. Poor man. If only we would just accept his manly wisdom and stop treating him as exactly what he is a random commenting man.

this is one reason (apart from the obvious) why i shall keep wearing masks. After a lifetime of random twatty men telling me to “smile”, i haven’t had it happen at all lately!

@Flyingantday

I think if you can’t tell the difference between being “random comment man” and “Random man initiating polite conversation about an appropriate subject with a willing participant who happens to be female”

then it probably is best to stay quiet.

Best staying quiet as option 1 and 2 are interchangeable depending on who you speak to. You never know how a comment will be taken. A comment of 'did you get caught in that shower?' could be met with 'yes it was a bit unexpected wasn't it' or 'a loud and embarrassing 'fuck off and leave me alone!'. As OH would say why would he want to speak to some woman he doesn't know.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe

I get the feeling that you're rather enjoying all the attention on you, Battleneck, why else would you be on the thread going on and on?

I think, you've posted something salient here:
Is anyone here saying that men should do their absolute best to never speak to female strangers?
Yes, do this. For men that wilfully misunderstand, it's a good start. Keep doing just that.

I can't believe how patient the responses to you have been.

I swear, I am just trying to correct and refute numerous comments directed directly at me which are misrepresenting what I said (or what I meant anyway)

Most people have body language, tone of voice and facial cues to indicate they are not in the mood to talk or you are making them uncomfortable.

The tendency of a “random comment man” is to bash on regardless or to call the woman a mardy arse or whatever for not smiling and basking in the masculine attention.

@BrightYellowDaffodil

"How do you reach the items on the top shelf?"

"I stand on the bodies of my victims."

@SpaceOp

As a confident, sometimes a bit clueless, woman, I, for example, have never minded a casual (not sexual) comment from a male colleague along lines of, "you look nice today". In pretty much every case where that might have happened, the man is a colleague and friend and I know he is commenting in a perfectly pleasant way.

However, while I don't instinctively "get it" I have listened to other women who say it makes them uncomfortable, that even if they know the man doesn't mean it sexually, it causes them to question how that man views them. As a result, I would tell any man in a professional setting not to say such things even though not all women would find it unpleasant.

This is NOT the same as saying that no male colleague should ever speak to a female colleague (ala Mike Pence).

@Battleneck this is the part you seem too struggle with and you need to get over it. Listen, hear all these women's stories, and respect it. It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree. Just think about whether a man forcing conversation on a woman is ever innocuous from her perspective.

Where have I said that I do around telling women they look nice?

I really don't do that, pretty much never to friends let alone strangers.

If you don't understand then it's not for women to teach you. You're the one with the deficiency, not us, Battleneck.

Why don't you ask men - you know the sort, the ones who get on with women, have women friends, engage with women who are willing to spend time engaging with them - and asked those MEN what it is that you're doing wrong. Let them educate you.

Or go on the FWR board and read a few dozen threads about the insidious pressures that women face? Better that than constantly bleating on this thread that nobody understands that you're 'not like that'. You are. You bloody well are.

What you're doing now is derailing and making this thread all about you and your lack of comprehension/understanding. Can you please just stop it now?

It would be better if everybody just ignored you. You've taken this thread which was a supportive thread for women, and spoiled it.

Battleneck

I’m also a man. I really don’t know what you are up to here; you’ve been told numerous times that you’re being a prat, but you still you carry on. You don’t listen to women, you try and talk over them. You’ve been doing that throughout this thread.
You’re an embarrassment.

This thread has made me consider changing my username, I don't want to be associated with the "cheer up love" style random man comments.

To be fair, if we didn’t feed it then it wouldn’t keep coming back.

Don't feed him.

@DismantledKing

Battleneck

I’m also a man. I really don’t know what you are up to here; you’ve been told numerous times that you’re being a prat, but you still you carry on. You don’t listen to women, you try and talk over them. You’ve been doing that throughout this thread.
You’re an embarrassment.

and a fucking troll to boot.