Recurrent Miscarriage Support - tests, treatment, trying again - thread 10

[bakingtins]

Welcome everyone - pull up a chair! A thread for anyone who has suffered multiple miscarriages and is in need of information, moral support, tea or sympathy. Newbies very welcome.

Can we start the thread with a recap of where we are all up to again, please?

Longest, BBT is Basal body temperature it is taken as soon as you wake up at the same time every morning. When you ovulate your temperature goes up and you have what is called a thermal shift. This will be clear when your temp goes up for 3 days straight. I use fertility friend .com to keep track of mines but I get clear ovulation pain while ovulating so I no longer temp or use ovulation kits. Just 100 hpts instead lol!
Vitex is available on amazon for about $7 bucks online (I'm in the US) I use natures way but you can find it at any store that sells women herbs and things. It should move your ovulation into the teens as there in the twenties or thirties now. I read once (thinking my day 16 'O' was too late) that sometimes late ovulation causes poor egg quality. Its worth a shot to move it up just in case. Although you already have a little one that says other wise to that theory!

That is really helpful to know coco thank you. I realised after I posted what bbt must stand for. Sorry for being dense. I haven't been tracking it because it seemed fairly clear from my cm when I was ovulating but it can't hurt I guess? One thing that put me off was my thermometer said to use it rectally. Is that actually necessary? It's really helpful to know about the vitex. I have asked about my cycle regularly, not least because it is an agonisingly long time to wait between attempts to conceive but they have always just shrugged and said some women's cycles are just different.

Longest, I put it in my mouth (just in case I ever want to use it for anything else...). ;)

Hi, can I join the club please, though of course I'd really rather I didn't have to.

Just emerging from my third miscarriage in 6 months (Jan at 5 weeks, April at 6 weeks and now at 11 weeks, though the baby had died at 7-8). Feeling shellshocked and exhausted and beating myself up for making us wait so long to try. Got pregnant with DS on our first attempt three years ago and cockily thought it would happen that quickly again. I suppose it did, I've fallen pregnant every cycle we've tried. Staying pregnant seems to be another thing entirely. If one more person uses the "well at least you can get pregnant easily" line I may have to punch them. You'd think HCPs would know better. I'm pretty sure I would rather have tried for 6 months and got nowhere than have gone through the last 6 months and still, ultimately, have got nowhere.

My sister is pregnant at the moment. I'm not supposed to know yet, but my mum told me because she wanted me to listen to her worries about her - "she wants it so badly" (my sister took three years and two rounds of IVF to conceive her first child. This will be DC2, conceived naturally). The announcement should come any day now and although I'm obviously delighted for my sister, I'm still dreading it, she will be due the same week I would have been. I haven't told my mum about my last three pregnancies. It's a long story, but in the past, while she has demonstrated a bottomless reserve of care and support for my sister, if I try to discuss my problems I am self-centred and should pull myself together. If I mentioned what I am going through now I would probably be told that I am raining on my sister's parade.

Anyway, apologies for offloading all that, just feeling a bit touchy as she's just been on Skype. Had to fake an urgent toilet visit so I could end the call when she started talking about my sister - my cover story for why I'm under the weather this week is a stomach bug I'm sure I'll be able to put on a brave face in future, I just don't want to this week.

I'll stop rambling now. Don't want to make you all sick of me before I've even got settled in!

Oh and sorry to see you here longest. I preferred it when we were on the other thread - no offense ladies.

Hello I have to. It's shit, isn't it? So sorry. These ladies have already been really helpful though and I feel a bit better about the future knowing there are some new things to try, whilst also a bit scared about entering a whole new world of tests and medical lingo and all sorts. Squiz on the old thread also posted some useful info.

I understand about your sister. A good friend of mine is also pregnant at the moment and was only a few days behind me but is feeling horribly sick and disgustingly pregnant. Am seeing her later today as she is bringing my work laptop for me and I am a bit scared what my reaction will be on seeing her, never mind how I will feel as she gets bigger and her due date gets nearer. Am not normally a horrible person, honest!

Know also how you feel about beating yourself up. Two other good friends whose eldest are the same age as dd had their dc2s really quickly. I thought they were mad. Now who's laughing eh, while the gap between dd and any potential sibling just gets wider and wider. Find that the hardest thing about it all to be honest, as the family life I had envisaged for her childhood is not to be. Know that I am incredibly lucky to have her though. Must be so tough for those ttc dc1.

Oh Ihaveto, feeling some of your pain. When DH and I got engaged, it was close to when my DS had my DN. We were told by my DM to keep it quiet until after DN was born which was more than 3 weeks later. People had by then noted the ring and thought we were bloody odd for saying nothing earlier. Would a normal thing to do not be just to celebrate both things at the same time?

I'm joining too. Went to GP today to ask (timidly) for referral after 3rd loss in May. She said that I had already been - ie there was a note on my record to say 'refer to RMC' but no one had actually made the referral. How confidence inspiring...

Timidity is because I'm 43 and I expect to be told that I'm just too old but the last 2 m/cs were after DE IVF so age of egg not an issue. Saw the heartbeat before I lost the last one. Sigh.

Was planning no more IVF as it's too hard on the head/heart but DH was diagnosed with cancer on Tuesday so now my head is spinning and I think that I want to ask if he will freeze some sperm before chemo then at least the option of further treatment is there.
With the chemo, to try naturally is off the books and we had been discussing adoption but that us likely to fail because of the diagnosis too. If we were to try IVF again I need to know that my m/cs weren't caused by anything which could be fixed.

2 m/cs from DE IVF and DH's cancer diagnosis in 6 months has left me feeling that it's us against the world .

Sorry for the long intro and hello to everyone!

Hi Resipa and Ihaveto, welcome and sorry you find yourselves here. It's horrible when it happens and its horrible that life just carries on around you, and its horrible when you have to kick the NHS up the arse to get anything done. Hopefully on here we can offer advice and support.
I totally understand about the close friend/sister thing. My sister was pg with her second when I mc'd my third. I am very 'out and proud' so everyone knew, but it was 'awkward' to say the least. Still, it's who I am, the experience has changed me and I refuse to pretend that my babies didn't exist for the sake of anyone else's social discomfort.
In the end my sister and I had lots of long chats and she was brilliant and understanding. In fact, when she went in to labour suddenly and quickly I ended helping to deliver my nephew on the bathroom floor! (Someone clearly has a warped sense of humour!!).
Anyway, do have a scroll back through, as some of your questions might be further up in the thread, and if not, feel free to ask away, rant and swear as much as you want/need to.
x

Hello resipsa. I am so dreadfully sorry about all your awful news. Wishing you all the best during your dh's treatment and in getting some answers about your mcs.

How awful Resipsa. Hope your DH responds well to treatment and that you get some help from the RMC soon

Aah, thanks for the thoughts, you guys.

Anyone on here based in S Manchester? My local hospital is Stepping Hill but I was told I'd get a choice of 4 and am wondering if the choice would include St Mary's as there seems the most logical place to go for these investigations.

TIA if you're local to me.

Have just splurged the best part of 200 quid on flowers to cheer up the garden and gig tickets in a moment of fuck-it-I-don't-need-to-save-for-maternity-leave-now-but-can't-face-clothes-shopping-while-bleeding madness. Now worrying I should be saving for private consultations and train fares to Coventry. Oops.

Oh well, I recently increased my hours at work in anticipation of dd's free childcare hours kicking in soon, hoping it would be a temporary measure pending dc2. Might as well make the most of earning more for longer I suppose.

Have also ordered vitex from Amazon. Thanks for that coco.

On a shopping note, it's my anniversary this weekend. Trying to think of a nice present for dh as feeling quite well disposed towards him after he handled yesterday well, but can't think of anything that strikes the right tone of 'we'll get through this' without being too cheesy. Will probably just buy actual cheese and write a nice card.

Trains to Coventry can be cheap longest

I ended up waiting over one hour at the station with my book and an ice cream because I booked ULTRA cheap £6 each way tickets (from London)

resipsa sorry to read your post. Hope things will improve one way or another... I'm in London so St Marys was actually one of the closest to me... ask your GP if there is a way you can be referred here...

Longest - I got my BFP which led to MC1 at the end of my first week back at work after 14 months () off with DD. That was in Feb 12 when DD was 13 months.

I went back 4 days a week. My plan was always to reduce to 3 days once DC2 arrived. DD is now 3.5. So, I totally get what you say about things not going according to plan (even though those very words trivialise how much hurt it causes). I still do 4 days and so feel that DD has really missed out. I always assumed that I'd be having another stint of ML before she started school. And indeed, one such stint should be about to start now but MC2 saw to that plan last December.

I've finally accepted that there will no more extended periods off work before DD starts school so am in the middle of an application to reduce to 3 days. It make me sad but I feel that I've faced reality rather than continuing to live in 'what if' land.

The free hours are worth £200 a month to us. Result!

Tiny - thanks but my St Mary's is Manchester not Paddington.

Ahhh, then should just be a case of asking the GP. I remember i got given a choice of my nearest 4 hospitals...

Yes, dd is an August birthday so starts school in Sep 2015. Was going to be perfect timing to be on mat leave over the summer so she didn't need holiday club and I could settle her in properly at school while also having some time with dc2 while she is at nursery. Wail. At least she likes nursery so I don't feel she is massively missing out too much. I still get Wednesdays off and pick her up early on Fridays.

Longest - we're secret twins. But for MC3, I'd have been due DC2 in Jan 15. My DD starts school in Sept 15 too. Would have been perfect for all the reasons you say .

longest I hear you on the shopping - I've also bought concert tickets thinking that I'd like to get some new clothes (and not ones that I think 'ooo this would still fit with a bump') but still bleeding, day 7 now, and totally exhausted from continuing to work and struggle through it. Came home at lunchtime today and have been napping on the sofa.

respisa that's awful news . I'd definitely go for the sperm freezing in your situation, and the tests. Is your DH's diagnosis such that it would definitely block adoption? Or is it just that you don't want to have to wait until he's given the all clear to make an application? I'm not S Manchester but it's where I grew up, I was born in Stepping Hill! Obviously I have nothing useful to say on that as I moved away after uni.

just I'm also 'out and proud' and refuse to be uncomfortable silently for the sake of social etiquette, I want to acknowledge that I was pg and this is what I'm going through. I want to scream at some smug women sometimes. "You might have a baby/be pg but don't dismiss me/look down on me because I look like I'm happily childfree - I've actually probably been trying for number 1 longer than you have, you just happen to have been luckier" . I've got friends who started ttc the same time as me who have admitted they're now ttc number 2 .

ihavetowait I hear you on the 'at least you can get pregnant' line, I had to tell my best friend to stop saying it as it was unhelpful. It's not reassuring to have it confirmed that you can pg, but only with fertility treatment and you only have 3 chances left, and actually - just as you say - I'd rather have had no pgs in the last 2.5 years than had 2 pg and lost them. It would be much better for my sanity to wait 3 years then have one gloriously successful pg.

Does anyone have an opinion on my current dilemma btw? Should I go with A or B? Completely unqualified opinions very welcome!

Hi barking. We're in Bramhall. It's really that I don't want to wait 5 years for an all-clear but that said I have no idea if that is what they'd require. No one really seems to know and it's seems always to depend on individual circumstances. I'm still in a spin and a lot depends on how advanced the disease is; if v early then none of these problems should come into play and if v late, will I really want to bring up 2 alone? God, the potential issues seem endless.

DD was born in Stepping Hill!

(Also had m/c3 and ERPC after m/c1 there ).

By the way, B.

If you have no success (unlikely), you don't also want to have to cope with the 'what if' question. That's why I went for DE IVF for cycle 2/3. No regrets save the embies not sticking.

Barking I didn't offer an opinion before because it really is an unqualified one but I would go for B too. Not even sure if I should keep trying for a natural pregnancy until I have been tested (advice on this thread is to wait). If I had a limited number of attempts I would definitely give it my best shot to get any issues sorted beforehand.

barking in your shoes I'd go with B. First try asking GP if they'll do some tests, the fertility and MC issues might be linked and it will save you money if they agree. I did it slightly arse backwards after MC3 (but not 3 in a row) we paid to see a consultant gynae privately, she recommended tests which GP ordered, paid for scan and for some bloods not available on NHS ( AMH). They didn't find anything, I had MC4, got referred to local RMC clinic who tested products (normal) and said there was nothing further they could do, then I self referred to Prof Q for NK testing. We spent getting on for £1k in all, but that's a drop in the ocean compared to self funding rounds of IVF so I'd want to be as sure as you possibly can be that you are maximising your chances of a pregnancy sticking.

PS just got back from pregnant friend's house and glad to report it was fine. Turns out I don't wish her or her baby any ill will- phew! Am also quite open about my miscarriages and relatively open when I am pregnant. Obviously it's no one's business if the woman doesn't want to share but personally all that lying and pretending not to notice raised eyebrows wears me out. Sometimes people are a bit sniffy if I tell them too soon though which I find a bit off. Are they saying they don't want to be burdened with the knowledge if I miscarry? Why should I keep it a secret? It wasn't having to tell people I wasn't pregnant any more that made it hard. It's slightly different with my mum and MIL as they are emotionally invested in the pregnancy too so telling them feels like letting them down, which is why I hadn't told them about the latest pregnancy yet, or the miscarriage yet but I will do when I see them in person.

Resipsa I also say freeze the sperm and keep your options open. Can't imagine what you're going through right now but you sound incredibly strong. Any time you need a hand to hold while waiting for cancer test results please come here too. I sadly have quite a bit of experience of cancer but not in terms of me, dh or dd being directly affected. That's another level of nightmare scenarios and I think you sound amazing.

Longest - glad visit was good. It's funny but I find that random strangers affect me (like the obese smokers leaning over the newborn's pram ) more than friends.

PS Now I've had 3, I tell everyone about m/cs. In part it is to explain why I've been such a miserable b*h for so long.