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Legal matters

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Brother’s actions and inheritance

177 replies

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:16

I’m not sure what to do about this situation which has blown up since my last surviving parent passed away recently.
Seven years ago, my DD ( asd) inherited some money ( about £100k). For various reasons, I entrusted DB to keep it for her in his account until DD became an adult as my own finances were shaky. I have texts showing that he agreed and that it was DD’s money. Our relationship fell apart during early Covid era and he demanded that I take the money back but I said I couldn’t right now but I would do soon. I also found out that DB was pissed off that he had not been left anything by that person at the time. DB and his DW are both magic circle trained lawyers with huge savings ( worth millions together). I am a lone parent living on DDs DLA basically ( my ex was abusive and fully absent ) and full time carer to DD.
Over the past three years DB and I would text about majorly important things. The lines of communication were open even if the socialising was over.
Fast forward to this year, DB was pissed off about me declining a family invite ( it might have been an olive branch invite but I never wanted to start socialising with them again). Without telling me, DB transferred my DD!s money into our widowed parent’s account electronically, giving neither of us a say. Parent ( terminally ill, elderly) said it was because DB was pissed off about declined invitation and told me to take the money back before they died.
Now I did not feel that DB had the right to do that without my consent so I said that as far as I was concerned, my money was still in their account along with the other hundreds of thousands they have in savings. DDs money was not distinguishable from the rest of their savings but it was sent to an account belonging to parent with nothing else in it. My DDs gift would also have been tax free by this stage.
Now, surviving parent has died and DB is being obnoxious about it, saying it is irrelevant and nothing to do with them and that they will talk to the one other beneficiary about the possibility of them agreeing to me getting it back ( DB and I are co executors).
My questions are:
Can DB actually argue that he had a right to do this to DD’s money without my consent? I wouldn’t have agreed to it and I would have taken it back but he never asked?
can I pursue DB to give the money back from his account. I think it was a really dumb and or mean thing for a lawyer to do
As a co executor, do I really need the permission of the third beneficiary who is not an executor for DD to have ‘her’ money back? I gave emails from parent about the money and wanting to transfer it and it states that the money is DD’s and the amount.
DB is putting pressure on me to resign as co executor. They have all the certificates, bank statements etc and won’t show me anything. There was a weekend of ugly emails where they mocked my DDs disability, my parenting, my lack of finances, not taking responsibility etc and not for the first time. I felt they were gaslighting me because I am actually right.
As executor, could I approach the bank with what I have and ask to be given control over the money? I know DB has applied for probate but I understand that you can sometimes sort things out before it is granted?
I’m really worried for DD’s future as that money was hers, it was tax free and it may be vital to her survival in the future. I worry that DB and SIL Will use it for paying death duties and carry on using their vast savings for their bunch of kids ( all privately educated, luxury holidays, recently dropped £10k on a Taylor Swift weekend, you get the idea).

OP posts:
Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:23

Oh, one more bit.. they have announced that they won’t be selling parent’s old house because there is another relative living there who is not well ( no life trust) . I feel that a huge house with massive bills and a vulnerable person living there only visited by carers is a big risk on multiple fronts. I’d like to sell my share of it to move away and cut ties with them. Could I oblige them to buy me out of my share if they don’t want to sell and how do I go about it? Thanks

OP posts:
jackstini · 11/09/2024 13:29

You need a solicitor. This is far too complicated an issue

I don't get why you didn't put the money in an account in dd's name with you as signatory?

Struggling to understand why you left it with your brother all this time

Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:29

Why the fuck didn’t you just take your daughter’s money? This is actually bizarre, and completely caused by your own actions. Why couldn’t you have opened a trust for her and have it put in there. Nothing your brother has said or done is unreasonable, and as far as I know illegal, which I’m sure he’s aware of being a lawyer. It’s you with clearly underhand reasons here trying to get someone else to hoard the money for years on end instead of putting it in your or your DD’s account. You canny demand he now pays you out of his personal money ffs!

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:31

I know that I shouldn’t have trusted DB at all. I thought the relationship was something that it wasn’t. Is there a solicitor anybody could recommend who gives a free half an hour initial session? I have only limited resources and time but for DD’s sake I can’t simply walk away.

OP posts:
Wwyd2025 · 11/09/2024 13:34

Why didn't you put your child's money into a savings bond in her name?! You'll need legal advice this is way too complicated.
I don't blame your brother in the slightest though.

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:34

I had/ still have no idea about how to open a trust. DB probably did but never helped or suggested it. Is it honestly the case that you can agree to look after somebody’s money, in writing, then dump it elsewhere without giving the chance to take it back?

OP posts:
ellyo · 11/09/2024 13:34

Honestly, the money is ultimately your responsibility. It's unclear why you didn't want to take it on yourself (could you clarify?), but 7 years is a really long time to not have gotten yourself sorted out so you could look after the money, especially if he asked you to do this.

It's not your place to argue that your DD's money is 'indistinguishable' from your brother's savings, it's your job to take responsibility for your DD's money not argue why other people should when they've already tried to pass it back to you.

Could he have handled this better? Probably.

Should you have taken responsibility for your DD's money a long time ago, instead of outsourcing that responsibility to someone else who doesn't want it? Definitely.

GeorgesMarvelousCalpol · 11/09/2024 13:34

As per PPs why on earth did you leave your DD's money with him? There's more to this story.

Wwyd2025 · 11/09/2024 13:35

GeorgesMarvelousCalpol · 11/09/2024 13:34

As per PPs why on earth did you leave your DD's money with him? There's more to this story.

I imagine op is on benefits and didn't want to close her claim having that much money but if they had sense they'd of googled how to open a account in DDs name which takes all of 5 seconds and done it...

twomanyfrogsinabox · 11/09/2024 13:36

Why on earth didn't you put the money in an account for DD in the first place? And why not take it when your DB said he didn't want to be responsible for it any more?

I assume there must have been some financial advantage in you and your DD not taking possession of the money?

Is there a paper trail showing the money was gifted to your DD but paid to your BD and then passed to the other relative? Sounds like a huge mess now, of your own making really Your DB won't want to pay you the money (again) out of his funds because he would consider he would be effectively be paying you back twice, I would imagine your DD will have to apply to be a creditor against the relative's estate, whether you can prove that or whether it will look like some sort of money laundering I don't know.

There are also details like where has the interest gone? And who actually would inherit the money that you claim belongs to your DD?

ellyo · 11/09/2024 13:37

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:34

I had/ still have no idea about how to open a trust. DB probably did but never helped or suggested it. Is it honestly the case that you can agree to look after somebody’s money, in writing, then dump it elsewhere without giving the chance to take it back?

Perhaps your DB did know how to open a trust. But whose responsibility is it to find out what you don't know, and ensure your DD's money is managed responsibly? YOURS

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:37

I am prepared to be told that I am wrong but I was going through a messy divorce and I was worried about DD’s money being raided by the other parent. I know that after it concluded that I could have taken it back but DB never offered so I assumed he did not mind looking after it any longer.

OP posts:
Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:38

Op your db has done nothing wrong. There’s something clearly fraudulent going on here why you forced him to keep hold of that money. Pretty fucking cheeky to be accusing of him of being untrustworthy here when it’s you that’s been completely out of order

GeorgesMarvelousCalpol · 11/09/2024 13:39

Wwyd2025 · 11/09/2024 13:35

I imagine op is on benefits and didn't want to close her claim having that much money but if they had sense they'd of googled how to open a account in DDs name which takes all of 5 seconds and done it...

I guess so. But is not hard to open an account for your (I'm assuming) under-18 child. I know some people would be clever about trust funds/interest rates etc... but it could just as easily be left in a standard bank savings account.

Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:39

If you’re literate enough to go on mn on top of researching solicitors, you are capable of googling how to open a child’s account

Hoppinggreen · 11/09/2024 13:42

Sounds like me as if you might have been up to something dodgy and its now backfired.

TemuSpecialBuy · 11/09/2024 13:43

Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:29

Why the fuck didn’t you just take your daughter’s money? This is actually bizarre, and completely caused by your own actions. Why couldn’t you have opened a trust for her and have it put in there. Nothing your brother has said or done is unreasonable, and as far as I know illegal, which I’m sure he’s aware of being a lawyer. It’s you with clearly underhand reasons here trying to get someone else to hoard the money for years on end instead of putting it in your or your DD’s account. You canny demand he now pays you out of his personal money ffs!

This.

It’s astounding
I sort of feel for their DB in all this tbh

Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:44

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:37

I am prepared to be told that I am wrong but I was going through a messy divorce and I was worried about DD’s money being raided by the other parent. I know that after it concluded that I could have taken it back but DB never offered so I assumed he did not mind looking after it any longer.

So you were too lazy and irresponsible to do the grown up thing and walk into a bank to make an enquiry? You expected your siblings to look after everything for you? Despite your brother telling you that you need to take your daughter’s money?

anniegun · 11/09/2024 13:44

I suspect you were trying to avoid declaring this money to the DWP.

ARichtGoodDram · 11/09/2024 13:46

Is your daughter a child or an adult?

Was your DB the executor of the will she inherited from?

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:47

If I have screwed up then I really want to know what I can do to represent my DD’s interests given the current situation.
Otherwise, I expect that The money would be divided between three siblings, the one who is not an executor has been NC from the family for ages. They wouldn’t agree to giving up money for my DD’s sake. There is a paper trail or a partial one.

DB and I were close at the time of the initial transfer which was actually from DD’s child savings account ( the bank stopped offering the account so I thought the money would be safer with DB). I thought DB actually cared about DD’s interests on a purely human level and would not be able to screw us over with a clear conscience.

OP posts:
Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:47

I suspect the ops lying a bit here. The money was left to her, not her daughter. None of this makes sense otherwise. She’s been keeping that money in hiding and claiming ignorance about what else could possibly be done with it. Whether it’s claiming benefits or having a divorce, if that was genuinely her daughters money then common sense says it can’t be stolen from her

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:48

Doltontweedle · 11/09/2024 13:47

I suspect the ops lying a bit here. The money was left to her, not her daughter. None of this makes sense otherwise. She’s been keeping that money in hiding and claiming ignorance about what else could possibly be done with it. Whether it’s claiming benefits or having a divorce, if that was genuinely her daughters money then common sense says it can’t be stolen from her

It was always DD’s money and emails between all parties also identifies it as such.

OP posts:
PenelopePitStrop · 11/09/2024 13:49

I suspect that at this stage you will do best by keeping your brother and other beneficiary as close as possible.

Apoloogise to your DB for leavjng the £ in his account after he twice asked you to take it back.
As executors I expect (IANAL) you are legally bound to distribute the estate in accordance with the will . And unfortunately the estate, on paper, would seem to include your DD’s £x

So havjng dine your best to make amends with your DB and having shown the messages between you and DB to other beneficiary, you can do a Deed of Variation whereby you all 3 agree that £100k from the estate goes to your Dd.

Tbis is a time for building bridges, offering and taking olive branches, however much it sticks in your craw, because basically you handed the ££ over with no protections or conditions.

Good luck

Kushiyaki · 11/09/2024 13:52

ARichtGoodDram · 11/09/2024 13:46

Is your daughter a child or an adult?

Was your DB the executor of the will she inherited from?

DD was a child, now a young adult. It was a lifetime transfer by an elderly relative , I should not have said “inherited” as confusing.

OP posts: