A devastated dad - need advice

[DevDad]

Hey all, I have been doing some research and reading online and I thought I would post my background to see if anyone can offer some advice or guidance as well as the articles I have read. Here goes...

I am a serving soldier with a dedicated army house (rental) which I lived in with my wife, daughter (17 months) and dog.

My wife recently had her 12 week scan for our second baby and then declared that week that she hated me and wanted to leave. She phoned her family, they picked her and my daughter up that night (May 22) and they have not returned since. A few quick facts.

Assets

*Wife has not worked in over 2 years including 6 months unemployment benefit
*I am the sole earner (32K annum)
*No savings
*No property
*1 vehicle on HP in my name 50% paid but DVLA registered to her

I contacted her the morning after she left and she confirmed via email that she had legal counsel via legal aid and her family had given her the cash deposit for a new house in their vicinity.

We argued, many horrible words exchanged until I agreed she could take the majority of the furniture from the house.

Possessions

I had to go away for 9 days on a charity trek (raising money for the hospital that operated on my daughter) and in that time she returned to the house and took everything of value however she told the Army she had moved out 3 weeks previous to her return with family members and a van. She told me that her solicitor instructed her it was fine as the possessions were 100% hers and 100% mine so first come first served.

I have returned to an empty shell of a home which requires cleaning and repairing in order to be of a standard suitable for the Army to take it back.

When prompted for communication she tells me constantly to "go through her lawyer" about even the most trivial items.

Children

I used a CSA calculator on the website and offered her the amount they suggested which she has accepted via private arrangement (bank transfer) and I have paid the first month however she has threatened to go to the CSA if it is not paid before the 2nd of every month. I asked for the address where my daughter is staying which she has refused to give. I informed her that I would pay CSA in full but only in cheque (as is my right per the CSA website) sent to her home. She has written back that she will forego the money and go to the CSA direct.

2 weeks ago I was in the area where she stays and asked to see my daughter at 6pm to which she replied it was too disruptive to her routine and refused to allow me to see her.

I told her that seeing her father was more important that "in the night garden" but she persisted and has now claimed that 2 solicitors and a social worker have confirmed that she was right to deny access and I should only see our child at the mandated times she has stipulated in the divorce papers which I have not received yet.

Filing for divorce

My stbx has ordered me to sign the papers and when I refused the sent me an email claiming that her solicitor had told her that bailiffs will visit my workplace with the papers and force me to sign. I could either do it "the easy way or the hard way".

I don't drink, smoke, adulterate or subject her to any violence and I have a sterling military record including a special security clearance with very deep background checks. I think she may claim unreasonable behaviour however I am not sure on what grounds. I have already told her I am making her wait the full five years.

I have neglected her for the PC quite a bit when immersed in my own projects.

My questions are thus -

1. Is she required by law to give me her new address where my daughter is a resident? She is refusing so far.

1. Can I demand receipts for what she spends the CSA money on as she has been a habitual drug user in the past and frequent abuse of alchohol.

1. If her family have furnished her with a cash gift to rent a property / buy a property is that a git to the married couple or soley to her?

1. Can she deny me unscheduled visitation to my daughter as Army life can be very unpredicatable and last minute with frequent changes of plan.

1. She is refusing to sign the car over to me in regards to the DVLA despite repeated requests since the tax is due in 11 days. Can I force her to do this in any way?

1. Will she have an entitlement to my future monetary bonuses in the Army which are paid for continued service

1. Is she legally allowed to return to a matrimonial home after confirming in writing she has left and take items without me being there?

1. We have numerous joint bills including an outstanding e.on bill for over £500 in both of our names which she is refusing to pay. I am also liable for the HP agreement on the car and the repair and cleaning bills for the house. Does she need to contribute?

I am quite devastated at the turn of events and have emailed her some nasty remarks. She admitted that she stayed with me until she was pregnant again purely so that she did not have 2 children by different fathers and left me pretty much on the day that the second child was confirmed as healthy.

I have no real premises with which to visit or see my daughter and have been reduced to jungle jims for an afternoon.

:-(

In March 2012 (not that far away) I return to Afghanistan for 6 months so will pretty much not meet the newborn at all and I am certain (having known her) that by the time I return at Christmas 2012 that she will have someone else living there and parenting my daughter.

At this stage I feel like walking away from everything including my little girl and just letting them get on with their lives.

Any and all advice appreciated, even criticism.

I am a little confused as to why you would have agreed to a second child when you sound so unhappy about the way your marriage was anyway. If you were so keen for your wife to go back to work, why did you both start TTC again?

eugh!

there is so much in the OP that is making feel queasy. it is very obvious there is far more to this than what has been stated by you OP. but what sickens me most is your distinct lack of reference to your child and how this will be affecting her. you dont seem at all concerned about her. yuck.

Dev I haven't read all the posts (am at work) so apologies if I repeat previous posters, but please, please take a deep breath, step back, and try to separate all of your (completely understandable) emotions from the practicalities here.

The issues which need to be dealt with here are legal ones, ie your rights of contact with your children and your responsibilities financially. A good solicitor will work through this with you to give you the best possible outcome.

The other issues you raise, ie your exes failings, are almost all probably (in the eyes of the law) irrelevant to the outcome of the important issues above. Yes of course you are angry - you were clearly very shocked by the way the relationship ended and didn't see it coming.

But whilst I do understand how you're feeling, ranting about your ex and throwing insults at each other will only cause more bitterness, resentment, and a desire to be as unreasonable as possible - on both sides. The most important thing here is your children, and still being a part of their lives in the future. Don't let your anger and emotions about what your ex has done spoil or interfere with that. Because in time those emotions will pass - but your children will still be there.

So in short I would say talk to the solicitor about financial and access arrangements with as little mud-slinging as possible. It's in your childrens interests for this to all be sorted out as quickly as possible, and with as little arguing and accusations as possible. Your DD loves both of you - so why would you want to drag down somebody she loves? It will hurt her as much as your ex in the long run.

Talk talk talk to friends, family, counsellors, whatever as much as you want to deal with the emotions - and you will get through this. Good luck - and sorry this ended up being so long!

Yearning - I am so glad to be out of it - I have a lovely DP now (we're getting married I used to be fuckmepinkandcallmerosie this is my Wimbledon name change)

But DevDad - I feel you lack empathy for your wife. As to her not working, which seems to be a big issue for you, you have a 17month old baby, she would have had a years maternity leave - which only leaves 5 months, she's 3 months pregnant - if you wanted her out working why did you agree to another baby?

I think if a woman came on here a posted in the same style that the op has she would recieve the same reaction. The posting style is cold and the OP made me feel a bit sick actually in the way it has all been laid out in such a calculating way. It

Also, if a woman who was a WOHP came on and said that her DH who was a SAHD was lazy and didnt contribute anything to the hosue or pay bills she would definately get the same reaction as the OP.

And another thing DevDad - you posted here, you put your situation with your stbx on this thread - this thread isn't about me and my ex and the situation I was in (that's been done on here at the time and since ad nauseum) it's about you and your stbx.

I was trying to bring my experience of dealing with a man who talks like you write, dictated what he wanted me to do with my life like you seem to with your ex wife, has spreadsheets of expenditure and demanded that I record all monies spent - if you search under fuckmepinkandcallmerosie as a user name you should be able to find the threads.

But as I have said from the beginning, this is only what you choose to put here. I have said it on other threads and I say it often, no one will put the stuff that shows them in a bad light, you can't tell tone or inference on here, it's only words, and a lot depends on the person you are saying things to and their reaction to what you say.

I do have sympathy for you that you aren't seeing your daughter, and I feel your stbx is totally wrong to stop you, but for example, the day you turned up at 6 and wanted to see your daughter - did you phone beforehand and say "I'm going to be in x on Friday at 6pm would it suit or could I possibly see my daughter" or did you phone and say "I am in x I want to see my daughter"

There's a difference in tone there, one is dictating, one is asking.

And the dictating is less likely to get a positive response.

DevDad

Have you tried the wikivorce website for advice and support ?

Good balance of male and female posters on that one and links to all sorts of useful advice sources.

Goodness I've read threads on here about fathers who haven't returned the children on time to the mother and the threads have been inundated by posters telling the OP to go straight to the policie etc etc.

Yet here no-one is really interested in where the children are or the fact that they've been removed from the father and he denied access - just on picking apart his character and basically assuming it all must be his fault.

Sympathies OP. Glad you're finally getting to see your child on Sunday

Allnew - I have said from the start, the ex-wife should let the OP have access to his daughter and that should be sorted asap. According to the OP the stbx has stipulated times in divorce papers that he hasn't got yet though. (Although I'll bet she's not offering as much as she should - my ex gets one or two evenings a week and every other weekend but that might be more difficult because of DevDad's job?)

Yearning -

DevDad, I'm glad you got a solicitor. Do not be afraid to go through the CSA, they aren't that bad and for men in difficulties with their Exs can be a godsend as they take care of the money without involving any of the emotion. I would recommend that you see a counsellor to help you deal with this. They'll help you get your anger out, understand what is happening and how to get beyond it in a safe and healthy way. I'm sure the army will be able to help you with this.

I know it's raw, but you need to stop thinking about your Ex and concentrate your energies on yourself and your kids. Good luck.

I'd second posting on Wikivorce also.

You'll get a fair hearing on there you won't on here.

I think this is a terribly sad thread.
Reading it, it sounds as though there were no good times, no love, no tenderness, no communication in the relationship at all.
The OP has obviously been critical of his STBXW's lifestyle choices for a long time.
The STBXW appears to have been planning her exit for a while.

I have no idea why they decided to have one, let alone two, children.

But perhaps that is the anger talking - perhaps there was something good about their time together?

1. Is she required by law to give me her new address where my daughter is a resident? She is refusing so far.

No. However,it isn't unreasonable to know where your daughter is living as long as there is no molestation/harassment/DV. Things sound very new and raw at the moment and it is a good idea to allow yourself and your wife some time to adjust to the emotional realities of divorce. If then your wife won't disclose where your daughter is living you can ask the courts.

2. Can I demand receipts for what she spends the CSA money on as she has been a habitual drug user in the past and frequent abuse of alchohol.

No.

3. If her family have furnished her with a cash gift to rent a property / buy a property is that a git to the married couple or soley to her?

It is a resource available to her and could be taken into account. However, as there doesn't appear to be much else in the way of assets and she has the majority of the responsibility for housing the children for many years to come it is unlikely to make any real difference.

4. Can she deny me unscheduled visitation to my daughter as Army life can be very unpredicatable and last minute with frequent changes of plan.

Yes. Unless there is a court order saying she has to make the children available for contact there is nothing to prevent her acting unilaterally.

5. She is refusing to sign the car over to me in regards to the DVLA despite repeated requests since the tax is due in 11 days. Can I force her to do this in any way?

Depends on whether or not you are the legal owner.

6. Will she have an entitlement to my future monetary bonuses in the Army which are paid for continued service

The value of all the assets (including pensions) held at the time of the financial settlement is the consideration. Once there is a final financial order future claims are dismissed.

7. Is she legally allowed to return to a matrimonial home after confirming in writing she has left and take items without me being there?

The legal expenses involved rarely make it worthwhile getting into a legal battle over possessions.

8. We have numerous joint bills including an outstanding e.on bill for over £500 in both of our names which she is refusing to pay. I am also liable for the HP agreement on the car and the repair and cleaning bills for the house. Does she need to contribute?

Both parties are liable for joint debts and can be pursued by creditors for payment. If payments fall into arrears it effects both parties credit rating. You are liable for debts in your name. Liabilities are taken into account in the divorce settlement.

Anger is frequently a factor in relationship breakdown but it is often a secondary emotion to hurt or fear. My advice would be to allow sometime for both parties to adjust to the emotional realities of divorce rather than making legal demands and/or threats. If you and your wife can cool off there is every chance that constructive progress can be made relatively quickly. Otherwise you risk getting into a cycle of provocation and retaliation. That could cost tens of thousands in legal fees and damage long term family relationships making it difficult/impossible for you to maintain a relationship with your children.

Please don't rely on internet forums for legal advice. A solicitor with knowledge and experience of the law is in the best position to tell where you stand and what options there are given your particular circumstances. Look for a solicitor who is committed to resolving matters with minimal conflict to avoid high legal bills and damage to long term relationships.

The OP seems to have a "thing" about money - it's all about what he earns, who paid what for a house deposit and can he get it, the wife didn't earn, can he demand that all maintenance spent by the stbx is recorded and "approved" by him.

"she spent all her time before marriage hopping around europe", and consequentyly did "nothing" after marriage.

You dont seem to hold your ex in very high regard, OP. I wonder if that has something to do with her hating you.

Ok the OP has said some nasty things, he's angry, very angry, wouldn't you be?

Some people are a lot better at expressing themselves than others, or handling shit like this.

I stil believe that if the op were a woman the response would have been different, an opinion not shared by us all but there you go

How are you doing today devdad?

Needanewname - I have asked awkward questions of women on threads before. I don't think I've been biased.

I just think the tone of the posts is detached and unemotional and I don't think a woman would have posted in the unfeeling uncaring way that the OP's posts come across.

As to DevDad having a low opinion of his wife - they're recently split up, he's hurting and angry and he probably does hate her guts at this point.

Pink I get what your saying but I think we will have to agree to disagree!

IMO men and women communicate differently and this a sounds pretty new, so right now I'm not surprised that he has nothing positive to day.

I think we do agree on the fact that he needs to calm down, stop the nasty messages and get on with the legal advice, his goal should be the welfare of his children and hopefully with support he will see this.

I just don't think it fair that people jump on his back and accuse him of stuff when he's come looking for support. I think he has said from the beginning that he is far from perfect but I still don't think that warrants what his ex has done.

Of course there will be more to this story than we're being told but without all the facts I can only go on what's been said and I still think she's done a shitty thing

Agreed needanewname - lets just say that while there may be a bias on MN in general, I have tried not to be biased.

What I have done is bring my experience from dealing with my ex to this and I am not going to apologise for that, despite DevDad feeling like it's a personal attack, it's not, I'm just trying to put a different point of view forward - different to his that is.

I don't think he sounds like he cares for his wife, but that could be his coping mechanism, I don't know, there is no way we are ever going to get the whole story on here.

And I have said that to women before now.

Apart from not letting him have access to his daughter, which I think is totally wrong, what has his wife done? She's left, gone to her family for support, and taken stuff from the house, which he said she could.

Things that have been said in an argument on either side I'm ignoring. Both said nasty things. People do when they're splitting up.

Hi DevDad,

Your situation seems pretty bad... and like you've already realised not much in the way of sympathy from mumsnet.

In response to your questions...

1. Is she required by law to give me her new address where my daughter is a resident? She is refusing so far.

No she isn't, you can however apply to the courts for Reasonable access. Given you are a serving soldier Reasonable access won't be Saturday @ 2pm-6pm but a court will stipulate a solid guideline amount of hours or overnight stays it expects you to have with your child/children. If she is witholding this information from you (address) it is pretty much kidnap. And i'm sorry to say on here, many many Mums will say that it is NOT kidnap... the definition of kidnap will fit what happens in your situation.

On another note: solicitors advising this in my honest opinion need striking off. They are playing god with someones life just in the interests of making a quick buck. Afterall, you writing letters back and forth to agree contact is £ cherching.

2. Can I demand receipts for what she spends the CSA money on as she has been a habitual drug user in the past and frequent abuse of alchohol.

Unfortunately not, however if she is insisting on going through the CSA ensure that you apply for a variation under the HP of the vehicle which you are paying for. It will be classed as a marital debt. Any loans in joint names paid for by yourself throughout the recourse of the marriage (and still being paid) will be factored in at roughly £4 per month reduction for every £100 you pay.

3. If her family have furnished her with a cash gift to rent a property / buy a property is that a git to the married couple or soley to her?

No, unfortunately... the tactics usually used are: deny that any money was given as a deposit, or claim it was solely for her use. If the boot was on the other foot, i'd hazard your "deposit" could be factored in...

4. Can she deny me unscheduled visitation to my daughter as Army life can be very unpredicatable and last minute with frequent changes of plan.

If its unscheduled she could technically yes. Remember you'll need Reasonable Contact, a court will stipulate hours per week (overnight stops etc) and yourself and your ex will need to come to an arrangement, if she breaks these, she will be in contempt of court... that said there's nothing a court will actually do to enforce that she has to allow you contact.

5. She is refusing to sign the car over to me in regards to the DVLA despite repeated requests since the tax is due in 11 days. Can I force her to do this in any way?

Two things you could do... stop paying the HP (the car may be repossessed). Or pay it off and take her through small claims courts/ancillary relief as part of Divorce Proceedings.

6. Will she have an entitlement to my future monetary bonuses in the Army which are paid for continued service

Possibly. A few ways out of this mind you which a solicitor should be able to advise you of correctly and with more etiquette than i. Basically if you had a private pension i would stop paying into it immediately, wait for your divorce to become final and then open a new one. Another option is to not mention your pension at all in any divorce proceedings... very rare people get away with this last point mind you.

7. Is she legally allowed to return to a matrimonial home after confirming in writing she has left and take items without me being there?

Technically she can do this if she is listed on the contract/lease. Otherwise it is classed as trespass and a criminal offence. Erm one other thing that i think that her Solicitor has been very wrong here. The items are not in any way 100% yours and 100% hers, if you have proof that you have paid for these items, legally they are yours. End of story. Again a claim form would secure this "properties". Again it sounds like terrible advice from a terrible solicitor.

8. We have numerous joint bills including an outstanding e.on bill for over £500 in both of our names which she is refusing to pay. I am also liable for the HP agreement on the car and the repair and cleaning bills for the house. Does she need to contribute?

Joint bills are exactly that in a court of law... joint. If she has caused damage to the property she needs to re-imburse you. Your solicitor will be able to advise you of the necessary steps in order to do this. As your property is Army rented, see what help they can offer. It is afterall their property she has damaged.

Terrible story, and even worse one that is terribly familiar.